PSX5Central
Playstation/Gaming Discussions => Gaming Discussion => Topic started by: Tshirts on June 14, 2001, 01:12:11 AM
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Hi!
I just want you guys to know that I am not here to cause any trouble, but rather to have a healthy dose of debates. I just want to see your side of things, and what you think about the Xbox.
Here goes!
Currently, the Xbox is in direct competition with the PS2, and *not* the Gamecube. The Gamecube has its own market, so I am simply going to put the system head on with the PS2.
Ok guys...
Throw all your *personal* reasons on why you would get a PS2 away. I know many are enticed by the great RPGs such as Xenosaga, Wild Arms 2, the promising FFX and so on. Set your personal preferences aside and hear me out. Look at the whole ordeal with me from a broader perspective....
With that out of the way...
I don\'t know if I am accurate in saying this, but the PS2 is known for games like MGS, Final Fantasy, Tomb Raider, Gran Turismo, Crash, Bloody roar, Tekken, Madden, Ridge Racer....correct? Those are the biggest draw of the system and those are the games that sell the most and the *drive* that made the PSX number one in last generation correct? They are the franchises very much like Zelda, Mario, Donkey Kong, etc on the N64. Bottomline they are the PS2\'s most important games. I am sorry if I miss a few. Pls correct me if I have.
Ok the reason why I brought that point up is it seems like the biggest franchises on the PS2 are making their way over to the Xbox. It seems like almost every big franchise with the exception of Gran Turismo is in some way or another finding an incarnation on the system. Although Namco hasn\'t announced anything yet, Ridge Racer and Tekken are strong possibilities of what they have in store for the system and soon-to-be Square is definitely going to bring their FF franchises over.
When you look at things from a broader market, the reason why you purchase a system is for its killer franchises and the games that are exclusive to it. Ppl buy Nintendo products for Zelda, Mario, etc....
How does Sony look to the world now? I don\'t think these ppl really *care* if they are getting the games first. It makes Sony look very bad just the mere fact that they are losing these franchises to their rivalry. No longer do they have Crash, and MGS2 *exclusive*. No longer does it feel special to own a Sony system knowing that the games you play on it is finding its way somewhere else.
You guys have to admit it will hurt Sony very badly. Real bad! When you start losing your precious franchises, you are pretty much....screwed! You know, killer apps only go so far. When you only have 2-3 games to look for on a system it\'s time to go looking somewhere else. I mean really, if you brought every killer app on the PS2 that will come out at the end of the year, do you really think you\'d be satisfied? Especially when you consider that right to your left will be the same game on the XB with better graphics and updates in gameplay.
To top it off, I know not too long ago ppl shot down the Saturn for not having "graphics as good as the PSX" or "not being able to accurately port a game over". Whenever you have two versions of a game on both the Saturn and the PSX, the PSX versions end up being the better one just because of better light sourcing and true transperancy or some crap like that. Small subtle graphic inefficencies made a huge difference to these casual gamers. Now I cannot imagine how the PS2 games will fare against the Xbox, but if the shots of Omnimusha Gen is any indication, I am sorry but the PS2 is going to suffer even *more* than the Saturn. When ppl start seeing both versions of the same game side by side and the Xbox version being almost *2x* better, trust me they will make a quick assessment and label the PS2 as the inferior machine. What better way to judge a system by two exact games. The same thing happen to the Saturn, and it will happen to the PS2 especially when so many of the ports are coming straight to the Xbox. The casual gamers will question themselves "Damn I can get that game on the Xbox with better graphics, why don\'t I just get that system".
Well to back this up I will include an excerpt from a Tecmo representative. Tecmo is pretty much unbias since they work for both Sony and Microsoft..
quote:
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Itagaki was first asked to address the issue of Dead or Alive 3 for the PS2 and GameCube. It is technically impossible," he stated, continuing with "The [graphics] quality would drop." Itagaki believes that the Xbox can achieve four to five times the performance of current machines. His team wants to make the number one fighting game, and won\'t consider a downgraded version. "If DOA appears on another platform," commented Itagaki, "it won\'t be DOA3, but perhaps another title.
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Then we have the whole developement issue. To quote one programmer "Programming for Xbox is so easy that it\'s almost a joke." Many whom have had their hands on it praise the system to a great extent. Of course, in the long run, ease of developement will win a lot of grace. Once Microsoft establishes itself as a *serious* and competitive platform, many developers will simply just opt to move their projects over to the system. Easier developement equals less cost, saves a lot more time, and of course better games in the end. In spark contrast to the PS2, the system is consider a "walk in the park". Many have cited the PS2 as the "worse and hardest system to ever develope for". The system is also limited with its lack of vram, low resolution, and no AA, etc. The system is one faulty system and developers are taking too much time, and effort to achieve what could of been done on other systems in a matter of days. I think this is a big issue. When you have developers favoring you that is when you are on your way to *truly* being better than your competitors.
You know what else is incredible? The Xbox is still 5 months away! All of this is prior to its launch and it is simply incredible what they have accomplished so far. Have you seen the graphics on DOA3? Don\'t you think it is incredible how many developers they are able to sign on board. You have to give credit to Microsoft because if they are able to do this much in just a short amount of time, I cannot imagine how much they are able to do a year from now.
These guys mean business and Sony will be facing off with their first *true* competitor whom have the deep pocket, and ambition as they do.
Square is coming.....
Trust me....
More on that later..
On an ending note....
I don\'t mean to shoot down anyone who has a personal preference of purchasing the machine. I know there are fans out there who dont really give a crap about what I just posted. Seriously more power to you. I don\'t think I am getting the Xbox for "PS2 franchises" either. This whole post was written from a *broad view* and not of the personal taste. So guys be happy with your Xenosaga, and Wild Arms 2 or whatever. Don\'t let my post anger you in anyway. I totally respect your buying decisions, and I am happy that you are content with your PS2. More power to you.
If I have said anything inaccurate. Please shoot my head off. I am ready for any sort of discussion or debate.....fire away!
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BAM!
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You make a lot of valid points here. You will find a lot of the people on these forums are very open to the other consoles. A lot of us are going to get an Xbox or Gamecube too. People here are very open to things like this. We dont have many fan boys here.
But the reason we brought our PS2\'s are too play great games that wont be going to other systems like GT3 as you already stated, Wipeout Fusion, Twisted MEtal black, The Getaway and Jax and Daxter just too name a few.
Welcome to the forums :D and by the way, this belongs in the console debating forum
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Firstly, it\'s Wild Arms 3.
Secondly, if I were to buy all I wanted for the PS2 this year, I\'d fall behind on my bills (Gas, Elec, Mortgage, etc.), so I could care less about another console having some games I can\'t get on PS2, since I can barely keep up with the PS2\'s line up (Summer/Fall).
....And if the Xbox get\'s equal, or slightly enhanced versions of PS2 games...Who cares? Not me. If that\'s the situation, where the consoles get the same games, then it really does come down to which console/company you prefer.
IMO MS should have stuck with PC\'s, so I would pick Sony\'s console over MS\'s anyday. And no, I\'m not being a fanboy or some other faggy term-- It\'s just what I think.
IMO Sony entered the gaming market when the industry was faltering badly. They pulled off a good gaming machine and have done really well at satisfying the consumer (although some will always hate them for the whole "2-ports" thing).
MS OTOH, came into this market STRICTLY in a defensive/offensive gesture. They really did see only 2 things (IMO)
1. PS2 is a real risk to the pc as we know it.
2. The Gaming industry is now surpassing Movies as the top grossing medium.
Bill (again IMO) is only in it to get a even larger chunk of the pie.
Don\'t get me wrong. I\'m in favor of capitalism, and I know that Sony, Nintendo and whomever else are in it for the money too, but somehow to me the whole MS foray into the market seems extra greasy.
Just what I think. I haven\'t had my coffee yet:)
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Tshirts : hello
slavebots.xbox.com:912 : hello
slavebots.xbox.com:912 : identify
Tshirts : ms_slave_bot_200413.05
slavebots.xbox.com:912 : stat current_task
Tshirst : ms_slave_bot_200413.05 initiate op ram ms @ http://194.47.16.181/forums/showthread.php?threadid=10634
slavebots.xbox.com:912 : execute continue_ram ms_slave_bot_200413.05
Tshirts : reply acknowledged
slavebots.xbox.com:912 : end_connection
[ I stole this idea from a member over at the IGN boards, Onimusha. Hope you guys think its as funny as I do]
I just wonder why anyone would bother. Enough pro xbox posts and you get a free game?
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First of all, the NGC does not have its own market. Even though the games on it are more cartoony than on the Xbox or PS2, it will still be stealing a lot of sales from both of them. Just because you think the NGC is for little kids, doesn\'t mean the rest of the world does.
Second, the PS2 franchises are not going over to the Xbox. Most of the games you posted is just a lot of speculation (FF games? Tekken?). Until it\'s announced be the developer or Microsoft, it is not true. Also, the PS2 has a lot of exclusives that won\'t be coming to the Xbox; like Vulcan Raven said, Wipeout Fusion, Twisted MEtal black, The Getaway and Jax and Daxter. And lets not forget Devil May Cry, Baldur\'s Gate, and GT3. And what would you rather have, MGS2 this fall, or MGSX two years from now? The Xbox may be getting some of the PS2 games, but I would rather get the games sooner than later.
What\'s the point of comparing the PS2 to the Saturn? Did the PS2 cost $400? Did the Saturn have a over 10 million userbase before the PSX came out?
You know what else is incredible? The Xbox is still 5 months away! All of this is prior to its launch and it is simply incredible what they have accomplished so far. Have you seen the graphics on DOA3? Don\'t you think it is incredible how many developers they are able to sign on board. You have to give credit to Microsoft because if they are able to do this much in just a short amount of time, I cannot imagine how much they are able to do a year from now.
Yeah, the Xbox is only five months away and look at how great it is: DOA3 looks amazing, and, well, um, at least DOA3 looks amazing. There are a few other great games, but for me, it\'s not enough to buy an Xbox.
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Last I heard MGS2 was PS2 only. Even a guy form Konami said it.
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Vivi
Last I heard MGS2 was PS2 only. Even a guy form Konami said it.
Well you heard wrong!
Ironfist
Just because you think the NGC is for little kids, doesn\'t mean the rest of the world does.
Actually....
You\'re the only person who thinks they are not. The rest of the world does.
Second, the PS2 franchises are not going over to the Xbox
Some of the best franchises on the PS2 so far..
Madden, SSX, MGS2, Silent hill 2, Omnimusha 2, Bloody War 2, Nba Live.
All have been *Official*.
Most of the games you posted is just a lot of speculation (FF games? Tekken?). Until it\'s announced be the developer or Microsoft, it is not true.
Just because it is not official doesn\'t make it *not true*. In fact, Square on board the PS2 is more real than not. Why? They said it themself. FF online is a massive RPG that requires both the hard drive and the ethernet. Having it exclusive on the PS2 just isn\'t enough to reap in the amount of dough they are expecting to make. Namco hasn\'t made any of their plans official yet. Everybody is bringing their best franchises over to the Xbox, I don\'t see why Namco wouldn\'t do the same.
Wipeout Fusion, Twisted MEtal black, The Getaway and Jax and Daxter. And lets not forget Devil May Cry, Baldur\'s Gate, and GT3.
Other than GT3, everything else is a far cry from being one of the top franchises on the system. Xbox has basically nab all of *your* best franchises.
And what would you rather have, MGS2 this fall, or MGSX two years from now?
2 years from now? Says who? How do you know when Konami hasn\'t released a date for MGS2X? I know Sony has an exclusivity clause but it is only for a couple of months (not sure how long) and not 2 years.
The Xbox may be getting some of the PS2 games, but I would rather get the games sooner than later.
Other than MGS2X releasing *later* on the Xbox (because of the contract) what other game is the system getting *before* the Xbox? Show me a list.
What\'s the point of comparing the PS2 to the Saturn?
Graphical difference.
Cygnus
If that\'s the situation, where the consoles get the same games, then it really does come down to which console/company you prefer.
You are wrong on that. The Xbox is getting the PS2s best games and not the other way around. I don\'t see *many* Xbox exclusives making their rounds to the other system. Besides, it wouldn\'t even be able to handle an Xbox game. Too much of a graphical downgrade will be quite evident.
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I know you wouldn\'t notice but Tisted Metal:Black got a 9.5, so how is that a far cry? And about the Tekken part... there is no logic to why it would go to the X-Box.
Namco hasn\'t made any of their plans official yet. Everybody is bringing their best franchises over to the Xbox, I don\'t see why Namco wouldn\'t do the same.
All that is is hope. One reason why Tekken would not go to X-Box is because it is arcade and PS2 exclusive.
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the most popular franchises on ps2 come from EA-SPORTS . Then followed by games like Mgs2,FFX,Tekken,GT,DOA, Silent Hil, and tony hawk. And besides FFX, Tekken and gt. The rest of those titles are all going to Xbox.
Those are titles that casual gamers know and recognize and are best sellers.
Here are some other potentials that casual gamers know.
Some other titles like Dino crisis - Which is a awesome series and Dino Crisis 3 is exclusive to xbox.
Twisted Metal. Well that last version of the game sucked, but its back in twisted metal black and will be awesome. So far it is ps2 exclusive.
Resident Evil - Multi-platform.
Wipeout Fusion, , The Getaway and Jax and Daxter. And Devil May Cry, Baldur\'s Gate.
Those are not games you can come out and say are excellent games because you have not even played them yet. If that is the case every new game in development is a awesome.
In that case I could say this for Xbox, House of Dead 3,Dino crisis3, X-isle, Hunter the reckoning, Matrix, WWF RAW IS WAR, Project EGO, Project K-X, Azurik, Bruce Lee: Quest of dragon, Malice, Amped, NFL Fever, and New legneds ...ect You see I could name tons of titles that have been announced for xbox there is 290. I could very well say all 290 are great games. But that would be very stupid of me.
I mean ps2 has its new games coming out and so does xbox. Most of the old psx franchises are being ported across platforms and no longer are just ps2 exclusives.
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*takes aim*
Originally posted by Tshirts
Well you heard wrong!
Oh, that was a well supported rebuttal :rolleyes: Anyway Kojima himself stated at SOny\'s pre-E3 conference that MGS2 would remain a Playstation 2 exclusive.
Actually....
You\'re the only person who thinks they are not. The rest of the world does.
The fact of the matter is that Nintendo represents a significant part of the videogame market sales. And whether they are considered kiddie or not, consumer dollars are going to be spent on their products, those are dollars that are not being spent on either PS2 or X-Box systems. So like it or not the Gamecube will factor into the equation and I believe it will be in a significant manner.
Some of the best franchises on the PS2 so far..
Madden, SSX, MGS2, Silent hill 2, Omnimusha 2, Bloody War 2, Nba Live.
All have been *Official*.
Onimusha 2 has not been announced for X-box. An enhanced version (once again enhanced is the key word) of the original Onimusha was announced. MGS 2 I\'ve already explained. I have never heard of Bloody War, so it\'s probably not that big of a \'Playstation\' franchise. As for the EA games, they\'ve always been available on most systems. Madden was also on the N64 and that did not stop the PSX from holding a majority of the market.
Just because it is not official doesn\'t make it *not true*. In fact, Square on board the PS2 is more real than not. Why? They said it themself. FF online is a massive RPG that requires both the hard drive and the ethernet. Having it exclusive on the PS2 just isn\'t enough to reap in the amount of dough they are expecting to make. Namco hasn\'t made any of their plans official yet. Everybody is bringing their best franchises over to the Xbox, I don\'t see why Namco wouldn\'t do the same.
Square has stated on several ocassions that they have absolutely no plans to bring the FF franchise to any other system, other than the PC. And they have confirmed that FFX, FFXI AND FFXII are all PS2 exclusives. As for NAMCO they can do whatever they want.
Other than GT3, everything else is a far cry from being one of the top franchises on the system. Xbox has basically nab all of *your* best franchises.
WTF??? You\'re saying that Twisted Metal, Wipeout, And Baldur\'s Gate are a \'far cry\' form top franchises. Just what are you smoking anyway? Suffice it to say that I am quite sure that no one in this forum will agree with your idiotic statement.
As for the other games; they may not be franchises but they are very likely going to be AAA titles and thats what it\'s all about unless you consider Tomb Raider CXII to be top notch.
2 years from now? Says who? How do you know when Konami hasn\'t released a date for MGS2X? I know Sony has an exclusivity clause but it is only for a couple of months (not sure how long) and not 2 years.
Funny how you call it MGS2X, the name of the game you are referring to is MGSX, despite your little fantasies.
Bam.
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VIVI: Last I heard MGS2 was PS2 only. Even a guy form Konami said it.
Tshirts: Well you heard wrong!
No. Vivi is right. MGS2 is a PS2 exclusive. MGSX (not MGS2X like you seem to think), is coming to the Xbox. But Konami has not released any launch date, and has not given any details on what MGSX actually is (A port of MGS2? MGS1? Or an all new game?)
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IronFist: Just because you think the NGC is for little kids, doesn\'t mean the rest of the world does.
Tshirts: Actually.... You\'re the only person who thinks they are not. The rest of the world does.
The only person in the whole world? I don\'t know...that\'s kind of stretching it. You obviously don\'t know what you\'re talking about.
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IronFist: Second, the PS2 franchises are not going over to the Xbox.
Tshirts: Some of the best franchises on the PS2 so far.. Madden, SSX, MGS2, Silent hill 2, Omnimusha 2, Bloody War 2, Nba Live. All have been *Official*.
I would not consider any of those games "franchises." Franchises are games that the system is known for AND there has to be more than one game with that franchise name on the system (like the Tekken series was a franchise on the PSX because there were 3 of them) Onimusha 2? All I\'ve heard is a port of Onimusha 1 right now, but it could happen. SSX and Madden are also going to the NGC. They are hardly "franchises" on the PS2. Bloody War 2? What the heck is that?!
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Just because it is not official doesn\'t make it *not true*.
Ok. Last I heard, Microsoft was scrapping the Xbox project and are entering the exciting field of fast food. They decided they would have a better chance making a profit in the fast food industry. Oh, and this is not official, but it\'s not "not true." See my point? What you said is just stupid.
In fact, Square on board the PS2 is more real than not. Why? They said it themself. FF online is a massive RPG that requires both the hard drive and the ethernet.
I support FF11 going multi console. It would make the userbase in the game a lot bigger and a lot more fun, but as of right now, it is not happening.
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IronFist: And what would you rather have, MGS2 this fall, or MGSX two years from now?
Tshirts: 2 years from now? Says who? How do you know when Konami hasn\'t released a date for MGS2X? I know Sony has an exclusivity clause but it is only for a couple of months (not sure how long) and not 2 years.
Yes, 2 years from now. Konami has said that they are going to wait until MGS2 on the PS2 is finished before continuing their work on MGSX.
Other than MGS2X releasing *later* on the Xbox (because of the contract) what other game is the system getting *before* the Xbox? Show me a list.
I can\'t believe this. Ok, even though the list is small because the Xbox is not stealing as many games as you may be thinking, I\'ll list the games I know of:
Silent Hill 2
SSX (You didn\'t specify which version is coming to the Xbox.)
Onimusha (it has already been released duh!)
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IronFist: What\'s the point of comparing the PS2 to the Saturn?
Tshirts: Graphical difference.
Right now, the graphics are obviously better on the Xbox. I won\'t deny that. But the graphical gap is already closing. Look at Run Like Hell. When I first saw the pictures, I thought they were pictures from an Xbox game.
Click here to see the pics of Run Like Hell: http://194.47.16.181/forums/showthread.php?threadid=10631
Tshirts, you are obviously an Xbox fanboy. I usually don\'t mind Xbox supporters that come here, but you don\'t even know anything about the PS2. You assume way too much, and expect us to believe everything you say. Go do a little research before posting here again.
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TShirts
Your way off in your thinking,
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This thread has gone in a awkward way. Hey T-shirt xbox is going to be a great system It has it own share of exclusive games that are in know doubt going to be awesome games. Yes it is getting a lot ps2 games, because developers are making the games all system now. Yes MSGX is going to xbox, but it what fashion nobody knows, but you can guarantee it won\'t be an advance verion of the psx MGS because that would be stupid and not profitable. Umm Iron fist I would consider Madden and Live to be Playstation franchise seeing how everybody knows playstation for those game and it is so very popular. But T-shirt don\'t get all excited over cross platform games. At some point in time it going to get old seeing the same games on all the platforms you need some to stay, but most of those games are old psx franchises. So it time for ps2 to get new ones Like getaway, red faction, and Devil May cry.
Because I agree most of the old ones are going cross platform. But I also agree that your way of looking at the situation and your out take on this hold thing is just plain incorrect.
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Originally posted by XBOX
Umm Iron fist I would consider Madden and Live to be Playstation franchise seeing how everybody knows playstation for those game and it is so very popular.
Ooops, my mistake. :) I have never been a sports game fan (the only sports game I\'ve ever had was NBA Jam on the Genesis :)), so I didn\'t know that. Thanks for correcting me though.
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I think that the one overriding thing that Tshirts is wrong about, is his thinking that since this is a PS2 forum it\'s filled with PS2 fanboys. Well, you\'re half right. There are a lot of PS2 fanboys here, but they\'re mostly kept in check by the older and more experienced members who, often but not always, prefer Sony. Yet we\'re not so stupid or arrogant as to think that no other company out there can provide us with good games. I think I can safely say that most of us anticipate the arrival of the Xbox and GameCube, as well as own a DC.
Now I\'ve seen your posts on Segaweb, and truthfully.. you\'re illk is the reason why I won\'t post over there. Just by looking at my name I know you people would brand me a fanboy. I guess I could chalk that up to my username, but I enjoy the oxymoron. It\'s an easy way to weed out the shallow minded from the people who just enjoy games.. despite the platform they\'re on. It\'s pretty damn bad when I\'m more at home on a forum of a console I don\'t support (Nintendose) than on a forum of a console I would almost litterally kill to get my hands on. (Segaweb)
Your attempt to start a flamewar or pissing match under the banner of "debate" is flawed by your reputation and the general openmindedness of the people of this forum. :P
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Ironfist
No. Vivi is right. MGS2 is a PS2 exclusive. MGSX (not MGS2X like you seem to think), is coming to the Xbox. But Konami has not released any launch date, and has not given any details on what MGSX actually is (A port of MGS2? MGS1? Or an all new game?)
About MGSX.. sorry but what you are talking about was a made up interview done by one of the lesser quality sites last year during the flurry of made up stories about what MGSX was going to be. Just about every site had their own "inside sources" and "interviews" that stated that MGSX was this or that, and each sites info were all different. It ranged from MGS1 to MGS2 to a mix of MGS1 and MGS2 and even a couple said a whole new game.
But the only real facts (since they come directly from Konami and Kojima-san) are this... In an interview with Core magazine in Japan in Feb of this year, Kojima-san was asked DIRECTLY if MGSX was to be an enhanced version of the PS2 game MGS2 and if so what enhancements. Kojima-san answered Yes and said he could not talk about the enhancements. (A couple of other sites out there may still have the translation, I don\'t know) Also, prior to Konami REMOVING all information pertaining to MGSX from their servers, they were asked a bunch of times on the MGS2 BBS at Konami of Japan\'s website what MGSX was. And each and every time either Konami or Kojima-san answered it was ALWAYS an enhanced version of MGS2.
IronFist: Just because you think the NGC is for little kids, doesn\'t mean the rest of the world does.
Tshirts: Actually.... You\'re the only person who thinks they are not. The rest of the world does.
The only person in the whole world? I don\'t know...that\'s kind of stretching it. You obviously don\'t know what you\'re talking about.
Nintendo = Kiddy
I don\'t understand why so many ppl cite examples of so call *mature* games and then say the system is "for adults". The system at its heart is not. You have to take into consideration their advertising campaign, the design of the system, the content on it, their targetted audience, their appeal, etc. I mean everything spells "kiddy". One of the reasons why the system has a "cartridge like" game device is because they don\'t want the "little kids to scratch it". The system is also rumored to come in purple. Then we have the price set so moms will be more drawn to it, and the fact that Nintendo has *no interest* in the online game market because it "won\'t sell to the kids."
Lets move on to the games shall we. Nintendo at the beginning has marketed their system as "family oriented". By that they mean the games on the system will be very "family friendly". Sure the system will have its occasional violent games, but Nintendo utilize Luigi, Pikmin, Star Fox, etc as their main selling point. They are just carrying on their legacy. If you were to do a side by side comparison of the family oriented games Nintendo is launching verses the more adult oriented (blood, gore, adult themes) Xbox and PS2 games, you see a stark contrast. While they may have some games that are violent (Eternal Darkness, etc…) these types of games don’t move (sell) as well as Luigi, and other family oriented games. Whereas on the PS2, the games that *move* the system are violent, dark, mature games like MGS2, Resident Evil, and such.
In reality, you have to paint a clearer picture of when the games are going to be release, if they are just mere rumors, and how far apart are the releases. Nintendo, as of right now, is not putting out enough funds, advertisement, and the games to even break in and take a portion of the adult gamers. Rogue Squadron, and the sports games at launch will do didly squat to draw any sort of adult buyers. They need MORE than that! Fanboys always cite examples of adult games that you know won\'t come out for quite a while and are just mere rumors. The only game they showed that would appeal to the mainstream mass was Rogue Squadron, Too Human, Eternal Darkness, and Metroid Prime. Neither games are launching at the same time and/or will be released in a window of 5 months. That is not what I would call "breaking into the mainstream mass". In spark contrast to the Xbox and PS2, that amount of games is laughable compare to the hundreds of *mainstream* and sports games on the respective consoles. Nintendo simply has no desire to even grab a fair portion of that market. They have obviously lost their touch since the SNES days. Pokemon has made them gone soft.
IronFist: Second, the PS2 franchises are not going over to the Xbox.
Tshirts: Some of the best franchises on the PS2 so far.. Madden, SSX, MGS2, Silent hill 2, Omnimusha 2, Bloody War 2, Nba Live. All have been *Official*.
I would not consider any of those games "franchises." Franchises are games that the system is known for AND there has to be more than one game with that franchise name on the system (like the Tekken series was a franchise on the PSX because there were 3 of them) Onimusha 2?
So the PS2 is not *known* for Madden, Nba Live, SSX, MGS2, Crash, Silent Hill 2, etc? You have to be kidding me!
Silent Hill 2
SSX (You didn\'t specify which version is coming to the Xbox.)
Onimusha (it has already been released duh!)
Silent Hill 2 is aiming for launch. EA will have a couple of products ready also but they have not announce what yet. Onimusha 2 is progressing along nicely (pics of the Xbox version was released even before the PS2 one). Maybe the reason why those games are coming at a later date is because the system *hasn\'t* been launched yet. Umm logic?
Then again, you are simply speculating and assuming *all* games are going to be released at a later date. Which is not the case. Neither EA, nor Capcom has announce any sort of date for the Xbox versions of those games. How the heck would you know. It is quite obvious the games are coming out as soon as the system is launching. The PS2 is out first, *of course* any game released prior to November will come out first. Purely irrelevant!
But the graphical gap is already closing.
Yea keep dreaming!
Tshirts, you are obviously an Xbox fanboy. I usually don\'t mind Xbox supporters that come here, but you don\'t even know anything about the PS2. You assume way too much, and expect us to believe everything you say.
LOL I almost proved everything you said wrong. Look who is the assinine one making assumptions about me not knowing anything about the PS2 and *is* an Xbox fanboy. The hiprocrisy some ppl display!
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kangu
Oh, that was a well supported rebuttal Anyway Kojima himself stated at SOny\'s pre-E3 conference that MGS2 would remain a Playstation 2 exclusive.
Yes and he also stated the updated MGS2 will be available for the Xbox with better graphics and more levels.
The fact of the matter is that Nintendo represents a significant part of the videogame market sales. And whether they are considered kiddie or not, consumer dollars are going to be spent on their products, those are dollars that are not being spent on either PS2 or X-Box systems. So like it or not the Gamecube will factor into the equation and I believe it will be in a significant manner.
Still. They won\'t be a factor. The mainstream market will be split between the Xbox and PS2 and *not* the GC.
Onimusha 2 has not been announced for X-box. An enhanced version (once again enhanced is the key word) of the original Onimusha was announced.
Wrong! *Yet again* Onimusha Gen is indeed an upgraded version of Onimusha 2.
Square has stated on several ocassions that they have absolutely no plans to bring the FF franchise to any other system, other than the PC
First of all, FFXI will be an mmorpg. That\'s massive multiplayer online rpg for those that don\'t know and these type of games are broadband games and usually use hard drives. And we all know the Xbox comes with broadband and hard drive inside. Now here\'s the beautiful part. Now that Square is making an mmorpg, Sony no longer has the largest user base. Only people with broadband make up the user base for the game, hence every Xbox sold is part of that user base. But with the PS2 and GC, people will have to buy peripherals. I\'m not saying that people won\'t buy them, but I think it\'s a very good possibility the Xbox will offer Square a larger user base for their game, because I believe more Xbox\'s will sell than broadband adapters. So even though Sony may have the largest user base, things change when it comes to FFXI.
Second, there is a reason to believe Square is coming to the Xbox: They said it themself.
Third, They\'ve been in negotiations with Microsoft for 2 years now. We know they are trying to work something out.
Fourth, at E3 they announced FFX as an exclusive PS2 title for a year (meaning it could go somewhere else) and made no mentioning of FF XI even though it was one of the premier showings. When asked about it, Square officials simply said "no comment".
Fifth, Nihon Keizai Shimbun..
You guys do know who they are right? Well they are the same guys who ran the "Sega is developing for Sony" story. The first group to report that story. Noone believed them, but they turn out to be right and everyone else was wrong.
Anyway......
Those guys have recieved *confirmation* from Square officials that FF Online is indeed coming. The only reason why Square hasn\'t *announced* it yet is because they are under exclusive contract with Sony. Also, with the pending release of their biggest PS2 game FFX, it would be *idiotic* to steal some of the hype and thunder away.
One last note.....
Just because something is *not* official does not make it less real. I think it is actually *more* real than not. It is known fact that Sony has exclusivity towards Square\'s title, and rather obvious they are not allowing Square to say anything regarding their Xbox plans.
It is cool to be a high skeptic, but sometimes being *too* jaded makes you...umm ignorant.
You\'re saying that Twisted Metal, Wipeout, And Baldur\'s Gate are a \'far cry\' form top franchises.
Yes that is exactly what I am saying. Baldur\'s Gate a *top* PS2 franchise? Since when?!!! Twisted Metal has lost its touch since the 3rd incarnation. The series took a nose dive. Wipeout is not exactly the *main draw* of the PS2 either. GT and MGS2 is, and not Wipeout. I\'m not saying they are bad games. Just that if the PS2 ever have to depend on those games alone, the system will simply not sell.
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T-Shirt you make good valid points.... I like your style.
Agree 90% percent with everything you said, I would love to further explain my points, but I see you have already done a good job at that.
Oh and don\'t bother with the nintendo thing, i have tried many times to explain the same thing to people about nintendo=Kiddy. It seems people just don\'t get it, I\'m mean hey If you guys like Nintendo all the power to you, but please don\'t try and make the big N look like a mature console.
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The first Capcom game to appear on Xbox will be Genma Onimusha (tentative title), an enhanced version of the worldwide hit Onimusha that will deliver new dimensions of gameplay that harness the power of Xbox. According to Keiji Inafune, producer of Genma Onimusha, the tremendous technological power of Xbox has enabled him to expand on his original vision for the game, resulting in new features and enhanced gameplay options. "I’m going to create an enhanced version of Onimusha, the sort of game people will want to play over and over again."
Heres the link: http://www.msxbox.com/php/full_post.php3?id=1278
Not Onimusha 2, it\'s an enhanced Onimusha 1. This is coming from msxbox.com. That puts that argument to rest.
Now, on with my post...
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. Like I said before, do some research before posting here.
I sugesst you do the same,
"Ooops, my mistake. I have never been a sports game fan (the only sports game I\'ve ever had was NBA Jam on the Genesis ), so I didn\'t know that. Thanks for correcting me though."
so he was mistaken by one thing, considering that was not the main point of his arguement, it\'s not that big of a deal. In other words you were both wrong at one thing, BIG DEAL. I would like to see what you have to say about the rest of what T-shirt has said in his response, since I think he has brought up really good strong points.
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TShirts, nice work, youve come in here new, and posted some interesting stuff. Although i do disagree with most of it, there is too much stuff to reply to (seriously, there is ****loads of stuff, and i couldnt be ****ed)
so basically, ill say Welcome. I hope you continue to back up your point well in the future of our forums, and i hope to get into some nice arguements with you
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First thing I\'m going to say is you were right about something. MGSX is an enhanced version of MGS2. I\'ll just post the article and put that argument to rest.
http://www.coremagazine.com/interviews/29.php3?0
Now onto the Nintendo=Kiddie thing. I think it\'s more like Nintendo=chartoony. They are two different things. Is it wrong for an adult to want to play another Mario game? Personally, I don\'t want anything to do with the NGC. I am happy with my PS2. But there are a lot of adults who still like playing Mario games, and I don\'t think that will ever change.
The only game they showed that would appeal to the mainstream mass was Rogue Squadron, Too Human, Eternal Darkness, and Metroid Prime. Neither games are launching at the same time and/or will be released in a window of 5 months. That is not what I would call "breaking into the mainstream mass".
The mainstream market will be split between the Xbox and PS2 and *not* the GC.
So you\'re saying that the NGC will have a hard time breaking into the mainstream market? I hate to break this to you, but KIDS ARE THE MAINSTREAM MARKET!!! There are way more kids that play video games than adults. The only adult video game players for the most part are hardcore gamers. Nintendo will not have a problem selling their machine off.
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IronFist: I would not consider any of those games "franchises." Franchises are games that the system is known for AND there has to be more than one game with that franchise name on the system (like the Tekken series was a franchise on the PSX because there were 3 of them).
Tshirts: So the PS2 is not *known* for Madden, Nba Live, SSX, MGS2, Crash, Silent Hill 2, etc? You have to be kidding me!
Like I said before, I made a mistake about Madden and NBA Live. Maybe you forgot that when there is an "and" in between two sentence fractions, you combine both statements for the whole sentence to be true. Read the part after the "AND."
SSX is not a franchise (you can\'t have a franchise with only one game.) Crash isn\'t being made by Naughty Dog anymore, so who cares about Crash? Its now going to all consoles. MGS2 and SH2 are not franchise games. There has only been one of each game (on the PSX, I might add). So how could one game be considered a "franchise?"
Second, there is a reason to believe Square is coming to the Xbox: They said it themself.
Oh, thanks for the link to a source in advance (in other words, give us some proof!)
Fifth, Nihon Keizai Shimbun..
I think you mean "shinbun". "Japan Business Newspaper."
Just because something is *not* official does not make it less real. I think it is actually *more* real than not. It is known fact that Sony has exclusivity towards Square\'s title, and rather obvious they are not allowing Square to say anything regarding their Xbox plans.
Yes, but without proof, it means nothing. I still hope that the Xbox gets FF11, because that would make it the ultimate FF game. The more, the merrier. :)
Yes that is exactly what I am saying. Baldur\'s Gate a *top* PS2 franchise? Since when?!!! Twisted Metal has lost its touch since the 3rd incarnation. The series took a nose dive.
Twisted Metal was taken over by 989 Studios for the 3rd and 4th. Now the original team is back making TMB.
Wipeout is not exactly the *main draw* of the PS2 either.
Maybe not to you, but to the people who actually support the PS2, Wipeout Fusion is one of the most anticipated games. I don\'t see how you could call SSX a franchise, but not call Wipeout, a game that has been on the PSX since the beginning, a franchise.
I never said this before, so I\'ll say it now. Welcome to the forums Tshirts. I have a feeling we will have a lot of good arguments in the future. :)
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Nice. I just got done looking for rumors and info at Segaweb, and low and behold.. guess who put a flamitory post about us in order to get the Segaweb people pissed off and pump up his own image. (Which is rather low even over there from what I gather).
Now I can\'t speak for the other people from here that he quoted, but he took my post EXTREEMLY out of context. Tell me shirts, why didn\'t you post my whole message? Or furthermore.. why didn\'t you post a link to these forums so the people there could see for themselves exactly how much of a "biased" and "hatefilled" troll all of us are? Oh.. that\'s right.. it\'s because YOU\'RE the troll.. and posting a link, not to mention the whole of what we say and not just what sounds incriminating, would destroy your feeble attempt to insult us here.
Pathetic.
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Not Onimusha 2, it\'s an enhanced Onimusha 1. This is coming from msxbox.com. Like I said before, do some research before posting here.
Why don\'t you take a look for yourself!
Here is a pic of the Xbox version...
http://mb.vgdirectory.com/May/genmaonimusha2.jpg
That was in the Magicbox.com archives, May 18. Notice how they marked "genma Onimusha 2.jpg"
Here is the PS2 version of Onimusha 2....
http://mb.vgdirectory.com/Jun/oni28.jpg
Its the exact same game.
Then again, I could be wrong. Sorry! I\'m not too sure, but both screens look quite similar. Anyhow, let\'s just wait and see. If I am wrong, then I am sorry. My bad!
One more thing. Why do you keep on saying negative crap like this is some sort of mud slinging contest. Am I making you that nervous? Lets just have a peaceful debate so neither of us ends up getting ban ok? Thanx!
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I realized how jerky I was acting when I was writing that last post. Sorry about that.
From what I\'ve seen, Onimusha 1 looks a lot like Onimusha 2 on the PS2. I am not even interested in Onimusha 2. I\'m sick of the prerendered backgrounds, and I know Capcom is going to milk this series for all it\'s worth just like all the others. I\'m going to get out of it before it just gets old. Devil May Cry on the other hand... :)
And again, sorry for being such a jerk.
And don\'t worry about being banned. I haven\'t seen anyone get banned for a long time. As long as we keep the debating in the "Console Debating" forum, we\'ll be fine. :)
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I never said this before, so I\'ll say it now. Welcome to the forums Tshirts. I have a feeling we will have a lot of good arguments in the future.
Thanx! Me too!
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I love my PS2, but I love games above my PS2, and if i see a console with a sh!t load of great games, i will buy that console, :D I will still play my PS2, cause i think all 3 consoles might have worthy games that deserve play time ! WOOWOOOO!
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About MGSX.. sorry but what you are talking about was a made up interview done by one of the lesser quality sites last year during the flurry of made up stories about what MGSX was going to be. Just about every site had their own "inside sources" and "interviews" that stated that MGSX was this or that, and each sites info were all different. It ranged from MGS1 to MGS2 to a mix of MGS1 and MGS2 and even a couple said a whole new game.
.....
....
(https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.contrabandent.com%2Fpez%2Fotn%2Flaughing%2Flol2.gif&hash=b5d935cc38e54d1653e0bbda9fd54d2cb0680cd8) Are you serious? Yes, they all told lies to the gaming world. It\'s all made up. I heard the X-box is all made up too and it is just a bomb and when you plug it in it blows up. (https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.contrabandent.com%2Fpez%2Fotn%2Flaughing%2Flol2.gif&hash=b5d935cc38e54d1653e0bbda9fd54d2cb0680cd8)
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Tshirts,
You say xbox is getting all Sony\'s great games?!?!
...Well, I guess maybe in your eyes.
You see, my genre of choice has always been RPG\'s. And I really don\'t see the xbox getting many of the PS2\'s.
Sooo.. For me, no, the xbox is not getting the PS2\'s best games.
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I\'d reply to everything said here but there\'s no point, so I\'m just going to say a few things:
- EA Sports have never been a Playstation franchise/exclusive/whatever. They, in fact, support the PC market more than the console market (although that\'s beginning to change). They also supported the Nintendo 64 with their Sports games. The recent system they didn\'t support was Dreamcast, but that\'s fine since I enjoy Sega Sports games more anyways.
- XBox isn\'t getting all the Japanese-oriented PS2 games, like RPGS, etc. That is why it will still have difficulty taking off there, although it seems to be getting a good backing by a few companies. Also, Tekken has not yet been confirmed for XBox. Namco has said there is one coming for Gamecube (probably a port of TTT), but nothing about XBox.
- I\'m not going to start the debate about Nintendo being "kiddie". You\'re completely wrong that the whole world views Nintendo as kiddy. They may have games that don\'t feature blood and gore and sex, but when does that ever make anything kiddy? I can tell you right now that I\'d prefer an innovative game than a repetitive slash-em-up. In the minds of many gamers, Nintendo still makes innovative and challenging games that kids probably can\'t even beat. Same goes for Sega.
- As for Gamecube not touching the gaming market. Trust me it will. I will be buying a Gamecube, as well as many people I know, over an XBox this holiday season (and most of us already own PS2s). I may eventually buy an XBox, but Microsoft and Nintendo WILL be competitors this Christmas, and only a few hardcore gamers will be able to afford both at the same time.
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Originally posted by Tshirts
Why don\'t you take a look for yourself!
Here is a pic of the Xbox version...
http://mb.vgdirectory.com/May/genmaonimusha2.jpg
That was in the Magicbox.com archives, May 18. Notice how they marked "genma Onimusha 2.jpg"
Here is the PS2 version of Onimusha 2....
http://mb.vgdirectory.com/Jun/oni28.jpg
Its the exact same game.
Then again, I could be wrong. Sorry! I\'m not too sure, but both screens look quite similar. Anyhow, let\'s just wait and see. If I am wrong, then I am sorry. My bad!
One more thing. Why do you keep on saying negative crap like this is some sort of mud slinging contest. Am I making you that nervous? Lets just have a peaceful debate so neither of us ends up getting ban ok? Thanx!
well i hate to break it to you but if that site Magicbox is trying to lead you on i guess because last i knew Samanouske is not in Onimusha 2 - and if you look at te pic very closely
(https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmb.vgdirectory.com%2FMay%2Fgenmaonimusha2.jpg&hash=00828ec1c918a0e3bec0d6cb95de0f5f848f4a21)
you can tell its him since the main man in Onimusha 2 has a different armor and hair stlye
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Holy crap I just had a very weird moment... I was reading the thread thinking about something else and then drifted off and now I don\'t know where I am!
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A new Xspawn has landed, he goes by the name Tshi*t or some such, spewing there is no reason for owning PS2 because currently all possible titles will be on xbox plus mo\'betta\'. In other words SOS. Sadly mistaken on several key points as a few here have tried to politely point out, nothing new there either. Kudos to you Jumpster for not taking the GC=kiddie bait. You must be growing.
Hmmm... games that will sell PS2s but not xboxs. GT3, FFX, Jax n Dax
Will xbox launch on time? Will anyone care? Will MS ever get the hardware to work as foretold?
These question and more need to be answered for a debate to have status above that of WB (why bother?)
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A new Xspawn has landed, he goes by the name Tshi*t or some such, spewing there is no reason for owning PS2 because currently all possible titles will be on xbox plus mo\'betta\'. In other words SOS. Sadly mistaken on several key points as a few here have tried to politely point out, nothing new there either. Kudos to you Jumpster for not taking the GC=kiddie bait. You must be growing.
Hmmm... games that will sell PS2s but not xboxs. GT3, FFX, Jax n Dax
Will xbox launch on time? Will anyone care? Will MS ever get the hardware to work as foretold?
These question and more need to be answered for a debate to have status above that of WB (why bother?)
Report this post to a moderator
LMAO, damn this forum keeps getting better and better over time!
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Hey, just wanted to stick in my two cents:
I decided to go for PS2, and currently don\'t plan on getting an XBox because:
A) I never owned a PSX so being able to play both 1 and 2 games opened up a huge game library for me.
B) I wasn\'t very patient and PS2 came out first.
C) Rumors are flying around of a new PS coming out in around 2005, which is supposedly like having 16 PS2\'s stuck in one. So why buy XBox and have two machines basically the same when I can hang on to PS2 and wait for the "next, next generation" of gaming machines.
That\'s how I justified myself in the purchase of a PS2 December of 2000. I\'ve been happy, though impressed by XBox, since I could only afford one, I\'m content with my PS2.
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So why buy XBox and have two machines basically the same
This is where you are sadly, sadly Mistaken, but hey if you wan PS2 then get it, makes sense since you want to play the old ps1 games, plus PS2 is out right now, XBOX is not.. It\'s all good my friend.
PS. Not only when XBOX comes out, but when it get\'s itself welll established(online play) you will see how big a difference the two systems are. Although a 1 year and a half from now XBOX might be cheaper, so who knows?
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Saotome
Tekken has not yet been confirmed for XBox
Of course not. I was just speculating. In fact we don\'t know anything about Namco\'s plan for the Xbox other than 2 brand new games and 6 prior franchises (online??). If they continue with the trend (every 3rd party company releasing their biggest franchises on the system) then it is highly concievable either Tekken or SC will find its way over.
- I\'m not going to start the debate about Nintendo being "kiddie". You\'re completely wrong that the whole world views Nintendo as kiddy. They may have games that don\'t feature blood and gore and sex, but when does that ever make anything kiddy? .
Yes. I am sorry but that is *your* personal opinion on why they are not kiddy. I tried to present you with some objectivity and if it doesn\'t register then so be it.
As for Gamecube not touching the gaming market. Trust me it will. I will be buying a Gamecube
Yes, and I am sure many of a selected group of your friends will buy it too. :D
In the minds of many gamers, Nintendo still makes innovative and challenging games that kids probably can\'t even beat
In the minds of *what* gamers exactly? Is there an experiment that shows an accurate conjecture of the amount of gamers who *don\'t* think Nintendo is kiddy such as yourself? I am sorry for sounding so anal, but that is just what you merely speculated correct?
Speculation does not equal fact.
Herectic
A new Xspawn has landed, he goes by the name Tshi*t or some such, spewing there is no reason for owning PS2 because currently all possible titles will be on xbox plus mo\'betta\'.
Thanx for putting words in my mouth. :D
Sadly mistaken on several key points as a few here have tried to politely point out, nothing new there either
I am sorry if I was inaccurate in anyway. Then again, if I was as bad as you make me seem, why didn\'t you take the opportunity to tear me up yourself?
Hmmm... games that will sell PS2s but not xboxs. GT3, FFX, Jax n Dax
Granted I am sure they will.....
These question and more need to be answered for a debate to have status above that of WB (why bother?)
Gee thanx.
As I am aware this is a discussion forum. *Discussing* is what this forum is all about. Speculating, and merely discussing about any topic is not in line with fact. Therefore, each and everyone of us has the right to *argue* and present our views on what we believe is right or wrong. Why don\'t you present some of your intelligent views on why you *don\'t think* my dispute is in line with yours . So instead of dismissing my ideas, why don\'t you try and make new ones and let yourself be heard. Please. Like I said before I am open to all discussions and I would appreciate it if you do the same. Thank you.
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well said!
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Yes. I am sorry but that is *your* personal opinion on why they are not kiddy. I tried to present you with some objectivity and if it doesn\'t register then so be it.p
You were not being objective, you were merely stating your opinion then saying that the whole world feels this way too, which was completely moronic. You don\'t know how the world feels about Nintendo nor does he. I\'m sensing some hypocrisy here since you just told him that was just *his* opinion when all your doing is trying to state yours as facts.
Kudos to you Jumpster for not taking the GC=kiddie bait. You must be growing.
I don\'t respond to everyone\'s uneducated opinions. In fact, I haven\'t had a "Nintendo is kiddie" type of argument with someone in months.
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That\'s probably because *most* of the people here have grown up and realize that while it\'s obvious that Nintnedo does cater to a younger audience, that they\'re games are bought and enjoyed by gamers of all ages regardless of the rating on the box. Not to mention some of the N64\'s best games are made specifically for older audiences. (I.E. Perfect Dark, Golden Eye, CBFD (although I personally don\'t care for the game), and Killer Instinct.. just to name a few.) I\'m sure Jumpman or Livin in Clip can rattle off quite a few more than I can.
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Originally posted by Tshirts
Saotome
a) Yes. I am sorry but that is *your* personal opinion on why they are not kiddy. I tried to present you with some objectivity and if it doesn\'t register then so be it.
b) Yes, and I am sure many of a selected group of your friends will buy it too. :D
c) In the minds of *what* gamers exactly? Is there an experiment that shows an accurate conjecture of the amount of gamers who *don\'t* think Nintendo is kiddy such as yourself? I am sorry for sounding so anal, but that is just what you merely speculated correct?
d) Speculation does not equal fact.
[
a) And it is your opinion that they are"kiddy". I believe you said that the whole world thinks Nintendo is kiddy. Unless I am not part of the world, I believe you were already wrong on that subjective opinion, not an objective fact.
b) I don\'t select my group of friends based on what kinds of video games they like. In fact, half of my friends do not even play video games, and the other half are pretty much Playstation 2 fans, some of which are already planning on buying a Gamecube and (maybe) and XBox.
c) I believe you speculated that all gamers believed Nintendo was kiddy. Note that I didn\'t say all gamers shared my opinion, I said most. And when I say gamers I mean people who enjoy video games because of the obvious gaming aspect, not aesthetics.
d) Just keep on telling that to yourself and maybe it\'ll sink in one day.
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I believe you said that the whole world thinks Nintendo is kiddy
Yes I did. It was an overstatement made by me in a *humorous-type* of context. I didn\'t literally mean the whole world. LOL. Funny how you took what was obviously a *hyperbole* so seriously.
You were not being objective,
I merely stated my opinions riding off of the objectivity that was provided for me from various discussions Nintendo had with the press, whereas Saotome speculated on what he thought was true. In this case...
In the minds of many gamers, Nintendo still makes innovative and challenging games that kids probably can\'t even beat
[/b]
I simply ask for some sort of basis (in this case an experiment) where he can lay claim to that assertion. If he couldn\'t provide any (facts) then it is no more than a speculation. I had mine derived straight from the mouths of Nintendo and I merely opinionated on what was already a foundation of truth. There is a difference.
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well it seems that rumours aren\'t always true then huh
since i have shown you that your Omimusha 2 on Xbox was not true - it kinda says hey maybe you were wrong and you should wait for the official release of a companies dealings - since its is their game and what not - if its not official then its a rumour - and they can go either way but most rumours are false or not completely true
i am asuming you read my post - if not then you prob have no idea what i am talking about
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Originally posted by Tshirts
Yes and he also stated the updated MGS2 will be available for the Xbox with better graphics and more levels.
Would you happen to have a link to that statement? And unless it was made by Kojima himself don\'t bother posting it.
Still. They won\'t be a factor. The mainstream market will be split between the Xbox and PS2 and *not* the GC.
Once again your arguments are overwhelming. :rollseyes:
Wrong! *Yet again* Onimusha Gen is indeed an upgraded version of Onimusha 2.
I\'m beginning to see a pattern here. Do you have any facts to support your claims? Other than that one screenshot depicting Samanouske which seems to harm your cause rather than help it?
First of all, FFXI will be an mmorpg. That\'s massive multiplayer online rpg for those that don\'t know and these type of games are broadband games and usually use hard drives. And we all know the Xbox comes with broadband and hard drive inside. Now here\'s the beautiful part. Now that Square is making an mmorpg, Sony no longer has the largest user base. Only people with broadband make up the user base for the game, hence every Xbox sold is part of that user base. But with the PS2 and GC, people will have to buy peripherals. I\'m not saying that people won\'t buy them, but I think it\'s a very good possibility the Xbox will offer Square a larger user base for their game, because I believe more Xbox\'s will sell than broadband adapters. So even though Sony may have the largest user base, things change when it comes to FFXI.
Second, there is a reason to believe Square is coming to the Xbox: They said it themself.
Third, They\'ve been in negotiations with Microsoft for 2 years now. We know they are trying to work something out.
Fourth, at E3 they announced FFX as an exclusive PS2 title for a year (meaning it could go somewhere else) and made no mentioning of FF XI even though it was one of the premier showings. When asked about it, Square officials simply said "no comment".
Fifth, Nihon Keizai Shimbun..
You guys do know who they are right? Well they are the same guys who ran the "Sega is developing for Sony" story. The first group to report that story. Noone believed them, but they turn out to be right and everyone else was wrong.
Anyway......
Those guys have recieved *confirmation* from Square officials that FF Online is indeed coming. The only reason why Square hasn\'t *announced* it yet is because they are under exclusive contract with Sony. Also, with the pending release of their biggest PS2 game FFX, it would be *idiotic* to steal some of the hype and thunder away.
One last note.....
Just because something is *not* official does not make it less real. I think it is actually *more* real than not. It is known fact that Sony has exclusivity towards Square\'s title, and rather obvious they are not allowing Square to say anything regarding their Xbox plans.
Frankly I do admit the possibility of FFXI comming to another console which might include X-Box. However Square has stated on several ocassions that it is not currently in development for anything other thn the PC.
Secondly they have it running on a 56k network, so whatever you meant about broadband being required seems unfounded. I don\'t see the necessity of a hard drive either (key word is necessity, obviously it would help but it is not neccessary).
Sony made the right move by switching from their broadband only strategy to a 56k/broadband solution. The fact of the matter is broadband is slow comming and it will probably not be in this generation when we see all the broadband deliverable games and entartainment content that Sony originally envisioned and now Microsoft is trying to attain.
It is cool to be a high skeptic, but sometimes being *too* jaded makes you...umm ignorant.
It\'s cool to be highly gullible, but... oh wait. That\'s not cool.
Yes that is exactly what I am saying. Baldur\'s Gate a *top* PS2 franchise? Since when?!!! Twisted Metal has lost its touch since the 3rd incarnation. The series took a nose dive. Wipeout is not exactly the *main draw* of the PS2 either. GT and MGS2 is, and not Wipeout. I\'m not saying they are bad games. Just that if the PS2 ever have to depend on those games alone, the system will simply not sell.
You have no idea.
In anycase welcome to the forums. :) Remember, have fun!
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I merely stated my opinions riding off of the objectivity that was provided for me from various discussions Nintendo had with the press
First of all, your opinions will never be objective since everyone is unfluenced by something will causes them not to be fully objective(that didn\'t sound right, but you get the point).
While Nintendo clearly focuses on the younger market and doesn\'t deny it, they\'ve made an obvious attempt to break in to the older market with more adult orientated games than before and making they\'re NGC games more appealing to all audiences(EG- everyone at E3 had fun with Luigi\'s Mansion even though it appears to be a kiddie game). You didn\'t see both sides of this Nintendo not having an impact on Xbox and PS2 argument because they\'re focused only on the younger audience and that\'s why I said you weren\'t being objective.
Also, the GameCube is being released three days before the Xbox and costs 100$ less. It WILL have an impact on the Xbox\'s launch, I don\'t think anyone will disagree with me on that one.
I did a project regarding objectivity recently so pointing out that you were not being objective was very easy for me.
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I did a project regarding objectivity recently so pointing out that you were not being objective was very easy for me.
I know I wasn\'t being purely objective.
I said:
"I merely stated my opinions riding off of the objectivity that was provided for me from various discussions Nintendo had with the press."
For example: The GC uses a cartridge like device for its games. From that I conclude it is because they don\'t want the little kids to scratch it. I was pointing out my opinions on why I think they are kiddy base on that objectivity. That was what I meant.
Saotome ( sorry for using your name so blatantly) simply just speculated with no groundwork of objectivity. That was the problem I had.
Although it is not quite the same, it is in line with a fanboy coming here and shouting "Xbox will fail!" just because he *happens to think so* or something.
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I know I wasn\'t being purely objective.
Of course, but the problem wasn\'t with you, it was with this.
"I merely stated my opinions riding off of the objectivity that was provided for me from various discussions Nintendo had with the press."
There was no objectivity given from the press, they made their own conclusions on what Nintendo said. The word objectivity is irrelevant here.
For example: The GC uses a cartridge like device for its games. From that I conclude it is because they don\'t want the little kids to scratch it. I was pointing out my opinions on why I think they are kiddy base on that objectivity. That was what I meant.
Again, I don\'t see why the word "objectivity" is even here. Your stating your opinions, your coming up with [n]your[/b] own conclusions with were pretty inaccurate in my opinion. The NGC discs can easily be scratched just like Xbox\'s and PS2\'s discs. While you may think Nintendo chose those special discs for children not being able to scratch them, your still completely wrong. There was no objectivity there. Just speculation.
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Who cares guys, I just want SUPER MARIO TWINS for the NGC. I hear it\'s got 8bit graphics and a killer sound track.
YOU LIKE THAT YOU IDIOT, LMAO
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First of all, your opinions will never be objective since everyone is unfluenced by something will causes them not to be fully objective(that didn\'t sound right, but you get the point).
I am sorry I don\'t quite get that.
While Nintendo clearly focuses on the younger market and doesn\'t deny it, they\'ve made an obvious attempt to break in to the older market with more adult orientated games than before
On what basis did you conclude that? It would be nice if you lay out some sort of fact for your groundwork of argument. Anyway here is my rebuttal:
Before I continue this argument, I would like to point out that the "sports category" is a hard one to brand. It appeals to both adults and children, and you cannot negate it in anyway. It can neither be label as "mature" or "kiddie". I would like to call it the "dark horse", and ask you to not use it on the basis of this argument. The whole issue can turn into a whole different argument in itself. If you agree to this, then read further. If not, then you can stop now and disregard the rest of the post. Thank you.
Since everybody is arrogating on what they believe is "mature" and what isn\'t, I would like to provide you with a definition straight out of the Marriam Webster dictionary:
Mature = characteristic of or suitable to a mature individual [/i]
The only "mature" games I see on the GC using that definition are the following:
Die Hard
Rogue Squadron
Mission Impossible 2
Resident Evil O
Metroid Prime
Eternal Darkness
Duke Nukem
Perfect Dark 2000
Raven Blade
It looks like quite a list but upon further examination I would like to point out the following:
All information provided by Videogames.com[/i]
The games that currently have no dates:
Die Hard
Mission Impossible 2
Resident Evil O
Duke Nukem
Perfect Dark Zero
Eternal Darkness
Metroid Prime
The one that does:
Rogue Squadron 2
Raven Blade
- Rogue Squadron 2 is the only launch title and Raven Blade is slated sometime in 2002.
- Metroid Prime is currently "not a legitimate working title".
- Eternal Darkness and Resident Evil O are straight ports off of the N64 and not first concieved on the GC.
Which is a strong point. The games are just *port overs* from the dying N64 system. Although it has landed on the GC, it was not intended for the system so you cannot lay a literary contention of "Nintendo is aiming for the adult market with the GC" using those two games. The history of those games I do not know of but if I have to guess their first conception came after the success of Perfect Dark and *not* because "Nintendo is trying to attract the adult buyers with the GC".
- I cannot comment on the games that have no dates. They can be released next year, five years from now, or even be cancelled altogether. We know nothing about them other than a couple of tech demos/screen shots (of Eternal Darkness, PD, & Metroid) and that it is indeed *confirmed* for the GC.
As you can see, it is hard for me to fathom how they are "breaking into the adult" market with such a low profile of softwares that are still obscure. We only have "two" set dates. Rogue Squadron at launch alone will do very little to attract even a small portion of the adult market in contrast to what is available on the Xbox and PS2. Raven Blade is the only other known set date, and the game won\'t be released until 2002. The competition (PS2, Xbox) will have high profile "mature" games such as MGS2, Silent Hill 2, Final Fantasy X, Panzer Dragoon, DOA3, etc. Is it accurate to conclude the system will have a hard time attracting the adult audience considering the competition and the outlook of the system?
(EG- everyone at E3 had fun with Luigi\'s Mansion even though it appears to be a kiddie game)
Again, this goes back to my argument with Saotome (see above). I can just simply say a handful of my friends think Luigi\'s Mansion is for kids and refute your argument. Since you don\'t have a basis of objectivity to derive off of, I don\'t need one either.
You didn\'t see both sides of this Nintendo not having an impact on Xbox and PS2 argument because they\'re focused only on the younger audience and that\'s why I said you weren\'t being objective.
I would appreciate if you questioned me rather than arraign me of "not knowing" the contrast side of Nintendo not being kiddie. I have been in various debates and I can assure you I am fully aware of the "otherside" of things.
Also, the GameCube is being released three days before the Xbox and costs 100$ less. It WILL have an impact on the Xbox\'s launch, I don\'t think anyone will disagree with me on that one.
I can easily argue with you on that one because it is not a fact but a mere speculation on your part (unless if you are a proven psychic). I will not delve deeper into this because your statement/opinion/speculation seems to be quite true and I don\'t think I can draw a more accurate assessment. Then again there is the possibility of both just attracting their targetted audience and ignoring one another entirely. IMO of course. :)
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Again, I don\'t see why the word "objectivity" is even here. Your stating your opinions, your coming up with [n]your[/b] own conclusions with were pretty inaccurate in my opinion. The NGC discs can easily be scratched just like Xbox\'s and PS2\'s discs. While you may think Nintendo chose those special discs for children not being able to scratch them, your still completely wrong. There was no objectivity there. Just speculation.
Since you obviously don\'t understand where I am coming from, I will say it in simpler terms.
Fact = Nintendo uses a "cartridge like" device.
Opinion = It is so the kids won\'t scratch it.
Saotome...
Fact = None
Opinion = They may have games that don\'t feature blood and gore and sex, but when does that ever make anything kiddy? .
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Ok so were moving a step backwards...
I am sorry I don\'t quite get that.
I don\'t blame you, dut I\'ll try again. No one is fullu objective unless they\'re merely stating the actual facts without their own opinions. I hope that was better.
On what basis did you conclude that? It would be nice if you lay out some sort of fact for your groundwork of argument.
While NGC may be getting alot more mature games than the N64, I meant to say that they\'re making their games more appealing for adults(Nintendo\'s exact word, I know it seems like I\'m trying to sneak out of an argument but I\'m not).
Sports titles would be considered appealing towars adults and all the games you mentioned. There\'s all the proof I need for my "Nintendo trying to break into the mature crowd audience". I could elaborate more but I\'m in a hurry to go somewhere now(hence I\'m not going to bother checking my spelling nor am I going to care about my grammar or vocabulary).
Oh yeah, PD2 is shedculed for a 2002 summer release, RE:0 should definitely be out sometime in 2002 since they\'ve been working on it for quite a while now, Eternal Darkness is coming out in December, and Metroid for sometime in 2002 but I suspect it should be out by summer 2002 since Retro has more of their focus and resources on it.
Again, this goes back to my argument with Saotome (see above). I can just simply say a handful of my friends think Luigi\'s Mansion is for kids and refute your argument. Since you don\'t have a basis of objectivity to derive off of, I don\'t need one either.
I got my argument from various gaming sites like Gaming-Age, PlanetGameCube, IGNcube, and more. They said everyone who left playing that game had a smile on their face, and all of those people were adults. I guess it had SOME kind of people on adults.
I would appreciate if you questioned me rather than arraign me of "not knowing" the contrast side of Nintendo not being kiddie. I have been in various debates and I can assure you I am fully aware of the "otherside" of things.
It didn\'t look like it.
I can easily argue with you on that one because it is not a fact but a mere speculation on your part (unless if you are a proven psychic). I will not delve deeper into this because your statement/opinion/speculation seems to be quite true and I don\'t think I can draw a more accurate assessment. Then again there is the possibility of both just attracting their targetted audience and ignoring one another entirely. IMO of course.
Agreed.
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Originally posted by Tshirts
Since you obviously don\'t understand where I am coming from, I will say it in simpler terms.
Fact = Nintendo uses a "cartridge like" device.
Opinion = It is so the kids won\'t scratch it.
Saotome...
Fact = None
Opinion = They may have games that don\'t feature blood and gore and sex, but when does that ever make anything kiddy? .
ok here is your fact
GC has those disks so that the games can not be copied so easily not so a kid won\'t scratch it - heck i don\'t know why you think that - maybe the music industry should change so kids won\'t scratch their fav cds - oh wait that would be a stupid reason huh
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Compare the following statements, Tshirts, and see if you can find anything similar.
Statement 1 (By yours truly)
The whole world KNOWS that Nintendo is kiddy, FACT!
Statement 2 (By me)
The whole world KNOWS that Microsoft makes ****ty OS\'s; therefore the X-Box will most likely bomb, FACT!
Now on to the actual argument...
You\'ve said these two things make Nintendo kiddy; 1) their games, and 2) them choosing catridges as their platform of choice for the N64.
1) Here\'s a convenient list of games coming to the NGC, divided into Mature, Neutral, and Kiddy categories.
Mature
Raven Blade
Thornado
Metroid Prime
Turok Evolution
Perfect Dark Zero
Rogue Leader
Eternal Darkness
Resident Evil: 0
Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dradon
Tekken Tag Tournament (Still in negotiations)
Too Human
Rogue Spear
Duke Nukem Forever
Neutral
Picassio
Saffire
NBA Courtside 2002
RRV (Still in negotiations)
1080 2 Snowboarding
Zelda GameCube
F-Zero (Rumored)
Wave Race: Blue Storm
Phantasy Star onlin Ver 2
Batman
NFL Blitz
NHL Hitz
Crazy Taxi
Extreme G3
18 Wheeler: American Pro Trucker
Legends of Wrestling
All Star Baseball 2002
Madden NFL
Tony Hawk\'s Pro Skater
SSX: Tricky
Virtual Striker 3
"Kiddy"
Mario Gamecube (Not in my opinion, but since everyone else thinks so)
Kameo (Again, I disagree, but I regress)
Luigi\'s Mansion
Smash Brothers Melee
Rayman Tribe
Pikmin
Monkey Ball
Mario Kart
Donkey Kong Racing
I\'ve gone and done some math, and here\'s a percentage comparison between games that are not kiddy (which includes the neutral ones) versus "hardcore kiddy fanfare."
Not kiddy: 79.07%
Kiddy: 20.93%
So your post would be factual if you changed it to "Nintendo caters to the younger audience moreso than the competition, but spends an equal amount of resouces in developing mature games. However, combined with efforts from third-parties, the NGC will have a library mostly consisting of games that are not kiddy. The whole world knows THAT."
2) Actually, the decision to use catridges over CD\'s with the N64 was largely affected by Miyamoto, not because Nintendo was afraid little kids might cry over scratched games. Miyamoto wanted to simulate as realistic a virtual world as possible with Mario 64, which meant that it would lack load times among other things. That was currently impossible with a CD.
Another major reason that Nintendo opted with catridges was to protect their games from piracy. As you may well know, burned PSX games are a hot commodity in China; not so with catridges. I have yet to see any N64 titles illegally distributed or copied, nor have I seen anyone bothered to so.
At the time the N64 was in development, when 16-bit consoles were still around, catridges were efficient and widely used. So the Nintendo R&D figured that it wouldn\'t be a problem to utilize catridges. Also in Yamauchi\'s own words, back when the N64 was still crawling towards its launch; "CD\'s are merely a fad." When the N64 hardware was reaching its end of development, it was too late to turn to CD\'s, as everything was almost finalized. Even had Nintendo realized their mistake, they would have had to let it go.
I hope that clears up a few things on why Nintendo chose catridges over Cd\'s.
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Originally posted by Sublimesjg
GC has those disks so that the games can not be copied so easily not so a kid won\'t scratch it - heck i don\'t know why you think that - maybe the music industry should change so kids won\'t scratch their fav cds - oh wait that would be a stupid reason huh
To be fair, I have to say this. Kids don\'t buy CDs. The target audience is Teens to Adults. I don\'t know why it even matters though. I\'m just really bored right now.
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Originally posted by hyper
Statement 2 (By me)
The whole world KNOWS that Microsoft makes ****ty OS\'s; therefore the X-Box will most likely bomb, FACT!
Wrong. Yes, the whole world knows Microsoft makes crappy OSs. But NO, the Xbox will not most likely bomb because of this. That was just your oppinion.
1) Here\'s a convenient list of games coming to the NGC, divided into Mature, Neutral, and Kiddy categories.
Mature
Tekken Tag Tournament (Still in negotiations)
Tekken Tag Tournament is mature? Since when? :)
I agree with everything else you said though.
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Opinion = It is so the kids won\'t scratch it.
That\'s a reason, not an opinion. Just wanted to point that out.
I won\'t even bother getting into these useless debates.
- dm
- the trick is to keep breathing.
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Jumpman
Sports titles would be considered appealing towars adults and all the games you mentioned. There\'s all the proof I need for my "Nintendo trying to break into the mature crowd audience".
In contention, I can say "sports titles also appeals to little kids" so that makes the system kiddie. Now who is more right and who is more wrong?
Oh yeah, PD2 is shedculed for a 2002 summer release, RE:0 should definitely be out sometime in 2002 since they\'ve been working on it for quite a while now, Eternal Darkness is coming out in December, and Metroid for sometime in 2002 but I suspect it should be out by summer 2002 since Retro has more of their focus and resources on it.
Yikes! It is one thing to refute me but quite another to controvert a reliable and respectable site like videogames.com. In this case, I would have to ask for a link since you are trying to disprove a highly reputable site such as this.
hyper
You\'ve said these two things make Nintendo kiddy; 1) their games, and 2) them choosing catridges as their platform of choice for the N64.
I can assure you I said more than that.
1) Here\'s a convenient list of games coming to the NGC, divided into Mature, Neutral, and Kiddy categories.
I am sorry but your list has too many questionable titles with no release dates and current status. Everything is too vague to draw up any kind of accurate assessment. For example: On my list, I stated Metroid Prime was "not a legitimate working title" and Rogue Squadron 2 is a launch title and Raven Blade is going to be released sometime in 2002. To me, it is nothing more than *just a list* to make the GC look good. You have to go into more detail and delve deeper into each title....such as release dates, confirmation on title, status, etc.
I hope that clears up a few things on why Nintendo chose catridges over Cd\'s.
Yes. Those are some really good points.
But......
Straight from Nintendo themselves:
Nintendo stated that, "This 8cm pocket size disc that can fit in your pocket was designed to be an advanced medium that can be easily inserted/removed from the main drive and is user-friendly for all levels."
As well as this, the discs contain advanced piracy protection devices, which will prevent mass-piracy as is being seen at present in the current software market.
http://www.gamecubest.com/faq.html
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Originally posted by Tshirts
hyper
I can assure you I said more than that.
[/b]
From your posts (Concerning "Nintendo is kiddy"), I stripped everything down to a bare-bones level, and those were your two main points.
I am sorry but your list has too many questionable titles with no release dates and current status. Everything is too vague to draw up any kind of accurate assessment. For example: On my list, I stated Metroid Prime was "not a legitimate working title" and Rogue Squadron 2 is a launch title and Raven Blade is going to be released sometime in 2002. To me, it is nothing more than *just a list* to make the GC look good. You have to go into more detail and delve deeper into each title....such as release dates, confirmation on title, status, etc.
[/B]
If you think I\'m talented enough to pull even half of those titles out of my ass, just to make Nintendo look good, then I\'m truly grateful. But this being summer vacation as it is, (and to show you how sad my life is :p)I\'ll provide a source for every one of those titles.
Mature
Raven Blade - http://cube.ign.com/previews/16579.html
Thornado - http://cube.ign.com/previews/1971.html
Metroid Prime (This is a legiminate title in development. Why would you think otherwise??)
- http://cube.ign.com/previews/15316.html
Turok Evolution (It seems I was wrong about Turok. Substituting Turok, Acclaim is bringing eight titles to the NGC, none of them kiddy. I\'m not going to bother listing all eight here though.) - http://cube.ign.com/news/35221.html
Perfect Dark Zero - http://cube.ign.com/news/35693.html
Rogue Leader - http://cube.ign.com/games/15337.html
Eternal Darkness - http://cube.ign.com/games/15887.html
Resident Evil: 0 - http://cube.ign.com/games/15353.html
Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dradon - http://www.fgnonline.com/playstation2/news/18057.html
Tekken Tag Tournament (Still in negotiations) - I can\'t find the link.
MK5 - http://cube.ign.com/news/33440.html
Too Human - http://cube.ign.com/games/15333.html
Rogue Spear - http://cube.ign.com/news/35212.html
Duke Nukem Forever - http://cube.ign.com/games/16464.html
Neutral
Picassio
Saffire
NBA Courtside 2002
RRV (Still in negotiations)
1080 2 Snowboarding
Zelda GameCube
F-Zero (Rumored)
Wave Race: Blue Storm
Phantasy Star onlin Ver 2
Batman
NFL Blitz
NHL Hitz
Crazy Taxi
Extreme G3
18 Wheeler: American Pro Trucker
Legends of Wrestling
All Star Baseball 2002
Madden NFL
Tony Hawk\'s Pro Skater
SSX: Tricky
Virtual Striker 3
"Kiddy"
Mario Gamecube (Not in my opinion, but since everyone else thinks so) - I\'m not gonna bother with this one.
Kameo (Again, I disagree, but I regress) - http://cube.ign.com/games/16571.html
Luigi\'s Mansion - No link needed.
Smash Brothers Melee - No link needed.
Rayman Tribe - http://cube.ign.com/news/35212.html
Pikmin - Not needed.
Monkey Ball - http://cube.ign.com/news/35725.html
Mario Kart - Not needed.
Donkey Kong Racing - Not needed.
I\'ll get to the rest tomorrow.
Yes. Those are some really good points.
But......
Straight from Nintendo themselves:
Nintendo stated that, "This 8cm pocket size disc that can fit in your pocket was designed to be an advanced medium that can be easily inserted/removed from the main drive and is user-friendly for all levels."
As well as this, the discs contain advanced piracy protection devices, which will prevent mass-piracy as is being seen at present in the current software market.
http://www.gamecubest.com/faq.html
I don\'t seem to see your point there...
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is it just me, or is this thread really boring???
TShirts, if you believe half that crap yove spewed out, then you truly are a \'fanboy\'. I read this thread very subjectively at first (as you would see in my previous post) But some of your posts are filled with absolute bull****. Start up another thread and ill be happy to have a debate with you (not that you would give a ****), this one is too long, and to damn boring, someone just close it.
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hyper
Thank you for all the links.
Still, you haven\'t added much from what I said before. Other than Too Human being on the list and Eternal Darkness having a *set date*, everything else is pretty much the same as I stated in the other post. Sorry, but I still stick by what I said at the beginning. Nintendo still does not have the ammunition to compete against the likes of Microsoft and Sony to grab a fair share of the adult market.
I must apologize for sounding so anal, but I am still not swayed. Although your estimation (Not kiddy: 79.0 Kiddy: 20.93% ) is quite interesting, I hate arguing with personal taste. I don\'t believe anyone is in line to tell someone else how they should think. That is why I tend to stick with objective matters rather than anything subjective. In this case, you find so and so games mature (like Gamecube Mario as stated above) and some not mature. That is your personal taste and what you *think*. I on the other hand don\'t think everything (some, and not everything) you just listed is in line with maturity or even kiddie for that sake, so the percentages you present to me is just irrelevant (sorry!) because we don\'t have the same *personal taste* in what we conceive as mature. To stray from the whole subjective matter, in my other post I presented to you with a defintion of "mature" straight out of the Mariam Webster dictionary and derived my groundwork of argument from there. In this case, how do we determine what is the *set* level of mature. You have your personal views on what you think, and I have mines. This argument can go on forever! I have an idea! Let\'s just lay it all to rest, and just enjoy the games ok? :D
I don\'t seem to see your point there...
As for the quote:
Nintendo stated that, "This 8cm pocket size disc that can fit in your pocket was designed to be an advanced medium that can be easily inserted/removed from the main drive and is user-friendly for all levels."
Notice how Nintendo themselves said the cartridge format was indeed there to make it more "user friendly for all levels". Basically, they just supported what I have been saying all along "regarding the reason why Nintendo uses a cartridge like device is to prevent kids from scratching it". Surprised me too!
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Damn hyper, you really do have no life. :D
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Originally posted by Tshirts
hyper
I have an idea! Let\'s just lay it all to rest, and just enjoy the games ok? :D
[/B]
Agreed!! Saves me from digging up a hundred links.
As for the quote:
Nintendo stated that, "This 8cm pocket size disc that can fit in your pocket was designed to be an advanced medium that can be easily inserted/removed from the main drive and is user-friendly for all levels."
Notice how Nintendo themselves said the cartridge format was indeed there to make it more "user friendly for all levels". Basically, they just supported what I have been saying all along "regarding the reason why Nintendo uses a cartridge like device is to prevent kids from scratching it". Surprised me too!
So by your analogy, I can say "Since forks are user-friendly to all age groups, it must be made for the kids." Wait, something\'s not right there, is it.
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Originally posted by SonyFan
Damn hyper, you really do have no life. :D
Nonsense! My life is filled with exotic women and rapper friends. Why, I got my first shag long before you were even born...
Wait, I just fell down the stairs that time... :crying: *proceeds to crawl back under rock*
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I think XBox will bomb 2 out of 3 times, if they have a M$ OS in the box, if they have Linux, then they might have a stable system LOL :D
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Toxical, that\'s like the 50th time I\'ve seen you crack an XBox joke.
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Tshirts: Just how MANY forums have you posted this same topic on? I counted 2 so far, but just how many has it reached? Are you trying to gain attention? Are you attempting to convince yourself that your decision to stick with the X-Box is the right one? Are you trying to convince others that the right choice is the X-Box? What is the point of this debate anyways?
Being perfectly honest with you, I read your entire thread of all the people who replied along with all of your replies and the only real conclusion anyone can draw is that it\'s a great time to be a gamer. Games make a system popular no matter what anyone says and debating about what games system A will have over system B is pointless. Just buy every damn console and enjoy all of the splendor that it will be. If you can\'t buy every system, go out and make some friends who own other systems and trade accordingly. Just understand that lots of people are gamers and needing an excuse to choose any one console over another is so 1980\'s.
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everyone keeps harpin on how good xbox graphics are, and they do look good,but there is more to gaming than graphics alone. graphics is very important but so is game quality and playability. Im big into sports games on pc and ps2. I definately know that on pc sports games microsoft games are nothing to bragg about. in football easports definately #1 (Madden series), not microsofts football game. In golf tiger woods definately #1( also easports)and microsoft golf sux. Same goes for baseball and basketball. So microsoft better figure out how to make better sports games or they wont even touch sony\'s PS2. Im very pleased with the graphics on PS2, that stuf about xbox twice better graphics, thats bullchit. They may be little better but not that much. PS2 will be just fine.
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So microsoft better figure out how to make better sports games or they wont even touch sony\'s PS2
Huh, you are making no sense. XBOX has visual concepts and EA sports.
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There\'s a lot of discussion earlier about how Nintendo still caters to a "kiddy" market with games like Luigi and Pikmin and SSB. I thought that was odd since I am anticipating all three of those titles. Then I realized that 1) the games will be fun for all ages in those cases and 2) maybe videogames brings out the kid(dy) in me, so that\'s OK, too.
I\'ve said it before, the only market Nintendo "caters" to is the one made up of gamers.
-Eik
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You are right ElAsesino :D
I got to lighten up the mood here, it is getting long winded. :D