PSX5Central
Playstation/Gaming Discussions => Gaming Discussion => Topic started by: rastalant on November 11, 2001, 08:50:43 PM
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http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011111/tc/tech_videogames_dc_1.html
By Ben Berkowitz
LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - In the purple corner: a short, squat plumber with suspenders and a mustache. In the black corner: the world\'s richest man, a geek with glasses. It\'s Mario versus Bill Gates (news - web sites) in a battle for a $20 billion industry.
The next seven days mark the most anticipated and hyped week in the 29-year history of the video game business: the Thursday launch of the Xbox (news - web sites), a sleek black console from software giant Microsoft Corp. (Nasdaq:MSFT - news), and next Sunday\'s debut of GameCube, a colorful next-generation platform for Mario and Nintendo (news - web sites) Co. Ltd.\'s (7974.OS) other famed characters.
Analysts expect the twin launches, combined with sales of the year-old PlayStation 2 (news - web sites) from Sony Corp (news - web sites). (6758.T), to ignite a five-year growth cycle in the video game industry, which already outranks Hollywood movies as a magnet for entertainment dollars.
The anticipation for the product launches, which come just ahead of the year-end shopping season, has turned the video game industry into ``Donkey Kong,\'\' the big gorilla to beat.
Shares in game publishers, such as Activision Inc. (Nasdaq:ATVI - news) and THQ Inc. (Nasdaq:THQI - news), which create software for all three next-generation platforms, have more than doubled in 2001 even as the Nasdaq has lost more than a quarter of its value.
By year-end, no fewer than 225 video games will be available for the next-generation platforms, which feature faster processors and richer graphics.
\'UNPRECEDENTED TIME\'
``This is an unprecedented time for the industry,\'\' Peter Moore, president of video-game publisher Sega of America, told Reuters.
The $199 GameCube, which comes in purple and black, is a compact and colorful bundle designed to appeal to children and younger gamers that make up Nintendo\'s core audience for games such as the classic Super Mario series.
Microsoft\'s $299 Xbox, by contrast, looks like a mean machine -- black and heavy, with a signature green plastic gem embedded on top and a claim to faster chips, more memory and other features designed to appeal to the 18- to 30-year-old men who favor high action and fast fun.
The new game consoles will compete with Sony\'s PlayStation 2 at a time when economic indicators all point to a recession but there is no evidence that it has touched the $20 billion video game industry. Analysts expect both units to sell out fast.
``We pre-sold our entire initial allocation for both units,\'\' said Peter Roithmayr, vice president of the video games division at game retailer Electronics Boutique (Nasdaq:ELBO - news). ``On day one we will not have any Xboxes or GameCubes available.\'\'
The holidays might be even better than the already-high expectations, since people are traveling less and spending more on stay-at-home entertainment since the Sept. 11 attacks, said Michael Wallace, an analyst at UBS Warburg who follows the industry.
Microsoft initially said it would ship around 600,000 units at launch but is now expected to have about 300,000 units on day one, and 1 million to 1.5 million by year-end. Most analysts and industry executives expect to see the low end of the range.
Nintendo will have 700,000 units at launch and 1.1 million by year-end, although some analysts say the Japanese company might ship as many as 200,000 extra in a bid to keep up with demand.
SONY READY TO RUMBLE
Sony is not doing more than usual to sell the PS2 and has held the line against calls for a discount to its $299 price tag. Microsoft and Nintendo, meanwhile, have unleashed marketing blitzes.
Even so, retailers appear to be staking more on Sony rather than risking much on the two newcomers.
A survey of 25 top specialty toy and video game retailers ranked PS2 as the likely best-selling console this holiday season, and Konami Co Ltd.\'s (9766.T) ``Metal Gear Solid 2\'\' as the likely best-selling game.
Two GameCube titles made the top-10 game list; not a single one of the 30 Xbox games expected this year made the top 10.
``Metal Gear Solid 2,\'\' the most anticipated game of the year, also launches on Friday with an estimated 2 million customer pre-orders at a retail price of $49.99.
As the rookie in the $20 billion-a year gaming arena, Microsoft has earmarked $500 million to generate buzz for the Xbox, unleashing teaser television ads and serving up promotions in some 7,000 Taco Bell restaurants.
Advertising and promotions are also key to Nintendo\'s $75 million marketing plan, which included setting up ``Cube Clubs\'\' -- a kind of a street party for gamers --in 12 major cities.
Sony\'s approach is quieter, and analysts say it can afford to be because it has already sold more than 5 million boxes.
The Japanese company is looking to broaden its audience, bringing more women to the PS2 with campaigns in magazines such as Elle, Shape and Better Homes & Gardens.
All three game machines represent a quantum leap from the platform widely recognized as the first home-game console, the Magnavox Odyssey, which was released in 1972.
The Odyssey, now a collector\'s item, lacked a central processor and relied on plastic screen overlays to generate game backgrounds.
Holy Crap!!!!!!!!!! 2 million mgs2 preorders in the U.S. only?!?!!?!?! Most unbelieveable numbers I;ve ever heard. I\'m ready for next week picking up da box along with project gothem, halo, and mgs2.
:thepimp: :fro: :fro: :fro: :fro: :fro:
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doubt it.
2 million orders by the stores seems more realistic. There weren\'t even 2 million preorders for Pokemon (x color), or PS2. It will probably sell 2 million total, or near to that, but at the Best Buy I work at, I have had maybe 15 to 20 people ask me when it was comin out, but no one asked if they could pre-order it. It will be big, no doubt, probably outsell all of the X-Box and GC games.
But installed base factors alot in here.
Eric Jacob
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
doubt it.
2 million orders by the stores seems more realistic. There weren\'t even 2 million preorders for Pokemon (x color), or PS2. It will probably sell 2 million total, or near to that, but at the Best Buy I work at, I have had maybe 15 to 20 people ask me when it was comin out, but no one asked if they could pre-order it. It will be big, no doubt, probably outsell all of the X-Box and GC games.
But installed base factors alot in here.
Eric Jacob
You know what I\'m being to have second thoughts about those preorders. If its true thats amazing last time I heard in japan dragon warrior 7 had 2 or 3million preorders or something. I know FFX had 1.5 million preorders in japan.:fro: :fro: :fro:
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The next seven days mark the most anticipated and hyped week in the 29-year history of the video game business:
I don\'t think so. Just last week when I went to get CvsSNK2 at Babbages, they were still taking preorders on the Xbox -- just 1 week before launch. The PS2\'s launch was easily the most hyped and most anticipated week in video game history IMO. If you didn\'t fully pay for your PS2 at least 4 or 5 months in advance, you didn\'t really have a chance to get one.
And I believe that 2 million preorders number. MGS2 is probably the most hyped and most looked forward to game in history. I know a lot of people who bought a PS2 just for this one game. It was arguably "game of the show" at E3 for two years in a row. I wouldn\'t be surprised if the game sold 1 million the first 3 days, and 2 million within the first two weeks (there will probably be a shortage, which is why it will be 2 weeks before it reaches 2 million.) Those are my predictions at least. It\'s going to be interesting to see if I\'m right. :)
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I think you are over-estimating here, buddy :)
I know that two of my friends got PS2s without preordering without much trouble. Much to say they were pissed when they didn\'t play any games for 3 or 4 months (because they sucked, of course) but now they are loving it. I must say, they both bought it for MGS2 though.
1 million in 3 days is unrealistic at best. I work Thursday, when we put it out at Best Buy and I will tell you what we sell most of, but I highly doubt 1 million in even the first week.
Eric Jacob
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
I know that two of my friends got PS2s without preordering without much trouble. Much to say they were pissed when they didn\'t play any games for 3 or 4 months (because they sucked, of course) but now they are loving it. I must say, they both bought it for MGS2 though.
For the people who wanted to be garanteed a PS2 on launch day, they had to completely pay for it months in advance. Lots of people who preordered half a year in advance didn\'t even get one because they didn\'t pay for it in full. Your friends just got lucky IMO, because tons of people who camped out in front on non-preordering stores didn\'t get one. The PS2 launch was huge, and I don\'t see the Xbox or NGC, or the combination of the two, beating the hype and the excitement that came from the PS2 launch.
1 million in 3 days is unrealistic at best. I work Thursday, when we put it out at Best Buy and I will tell you what we sell most of, but I highly doubt 1 million in even the first week.
We will see. Like I said, those are just my predictions. It is very possible that it won\'t be that good, but I\'m sticking to what I said -- 1 million in 3 days, 2 million in 2 weeks.
BTW, does Best Buy take preorders for video games? If so, do you know how many copies of MGS2 have been preordered so far at that store?
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We take preorders on games (not systems though) and I havent personally taken any preorders on it, when people ask me when it comes out, they never take the final step and actually reserve it, just walk off. That isn\'t to say that we havent, because as a student I only work like 25 hours a week, some of the other guys may have taken preorders, I havent seen any though.
Eric Jacob
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We take preorders on games (not systems though) and I havent personally taken any preorders on it, when people ask me when it comes out, they never take the final step and actually reserve it, just walk off. That isn\'t to say that we havent, because as a student I only work like 25 hours a week, some of the other guys may have taken preorders, I havent seen any though.
Most people don\'t think anything about pre-orders. Why spend the money now when you can spend it later? People like to take chances and wait till the last second. That\'s why X-Box pre-orders are still being taken right now. Besides, games are always in abundance, pre-ordering them is kinda pointless unless you live in an area with tons of gamers and can\'t get to the store until late at night. Who knows though, we\'ll know sales figures in like a month or so.
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Originally posted by rastalant
the Thursday launch of the Xbox (news - web sites), a sleek black console from software giant Microsoft Corp.
Doesn\'t he mean, "This Thursday the launch of the XBox, a sleek black giant console from software Microsoft Corp?"
He makes the XBox out to be powerhouse. Never listen to people who try and do Video Game articles, when they aren\'t even a video game reporter.
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look at the specs, any non-game reviewer will do so and see that X-Box has the best.
And X-Box is a powerhouse.
Eric Jacob
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I might have to do another campout for the X-box this year. What day, the 15th?
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I don\'t feel the excitement around as it was for the PS2 launch date... I think Xbox might have a decent launch, but it is pretty much watered down... like games with better graphics only ;)
The XBox\'s titles remind me of the PS2 launch titles, nice graphics, not enough must have titles.. IMO. Although in a year, XBox might have some really cool titles. ... . ... .
The PS2 launch was my favorite console launch yet !
I mean people knew about the PS2, and i mean old people in their 40\'s ... i was waiting for a cab, and this janitor was mopping the floor, he sees the PS2 in my plastic bag, and he was all excited about it... I got a 2 and half hour break at lunch to go get my PS2 ... lol, then i came back to work, and parade it around all the offices :D
I scored the mother-load, a couple days before the actual release date..
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*AlteredBeast looks at PS2 launch list*
*AlteredBeast looks at Toxical\'s comment*
*AlteredBeast laughs*
you have got to be joking! It looks like the same games with better graphics?!?!
The PS2 launch was FILLED with sequels of PSX games with hardly a touch of improvement. X-Box has the most unseen by consoles games there. Sure it has Munch Even though it is completely different, it seems, than past Abe games), DOA3, and Madden, etc. but it also has Halo, Fuzion Frenzy, Project Gotham, etc.
Eric Jacob
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I dunno about you..
But I had alot of fun with Tekken Tag, SSX and TimeSplitters..
But thats just me.. The PS2 whore. :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
you have got to be joking! It looks like the same games with better graphics?!?!
I did not exactly say that, nor did i mean it to come out that way :D
The Xbox does have some good titles:
Halo (FPS – “whoppdidoooo Basil, but what does it do?” Quote provided by Austin Powers :D Another FPS, can’t wait to buy mouse and keyboard for this one lol )
Star Wars Starfighter (seen it, played it, although this is a “special version” for the LunchBox.)
Project Gotham Racing (Gran Turismo wannabe)
DOA3 (hmmm, DOA2 with better graphics)
Oddworld: Munch\'s Oddysee (done that…wow )
NFL Fever 2002 ( another NFL game wow)
Tony Hawk\'s Pro Skater 2X ( What happened to THPS3?)
AirForce Delta Storm ( this one is destined to shatter all sales records)
I can continue with the list, I don’t see any system sellers, unless the “nice graphics” for DOA3 count as something you would have to get… :D
Don\'t get me wrong though, i will get an XBox eventually, but not just yet, no particular title makes me wet my pants yet... :laughing:
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Halo\'s controls are supposed to be extremely intuitive. It is also supposed to be shooter of year.
Star Wars - thought the PS2 one was crap. This will be crap too.
Project Gotham (not trying to be or beat GT3, it is a different form of racing game, and from what IGN says, a damn good one)
DOA3 - who cares.
Oddworld (really, you have played a 3D oddworld game?!?! where!?!?)
NFL Fever - series previously unseen on this console.
THPS2X (5 new levels, all the 1st games levels, all tricks and secrent characters, this game is like a THPS anthology, I will be getting it, no doubt about it)
Air Force Delta Storm (who cares abut sales. It is how the game plays, and this one looks like it plays excellent)
Go ahead and continue the list if you want, but I think I have proved my point.
Eric Jacob
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
*AlteredBeast looks at PS2 launch list*
*AlteredBeast looks at Toxical\'s comment*
*AlteredBeast laughs*
you have got to be joking! It looks like the same games with better graphics?!?!
The PS2 launch was FILLED with sequels of PSX games with hardly a touch of improvement. X-Box has the most unseen by consoles games there. Sure it has Munch Even though it is completely different, it seems, than past Abe games), DOA3, and Madden, etc. but it also has Halo, Fuzion Frenzy, Project Gotham, etc.
I posted this in a different thread when I was debating with Docwiz, so I\'ll just quote it:
I have a question. Why did you leave out lots of great PS2 launch games? Here is a better comparison:
Xbox........................................................PS2
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Halo....................................................Timesplitters
DOA3..................................................DOA2:HC/TTT
Project Gotham...................................Ridge Racer V
NFL Fever/Madden 2002.....................Madden 2001
Amped/THPS2X...................................SSX
***Note: Amped and Ridge Racer V are not really known as being great launch games, but I included them to show how similar the two launches really are.
Other than those great games, the rest of the games in both launches are less-than-stellar. So why is the Xbox launch is so much better than the PS2 launch was? Oh yeah. Because the PS2 launch was a whole year ago. :rolleyes:
The Xbox launch games are not as great as you are making them out to be Altered. It\'s almost like the PS2 launch with better graphics, and remember what you think about the PS2 launch? (read the red part of my sig).
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
Oddworld (really, you have played a 3D oddworld game?!?! where!?!?)
I did not mean i played this particular title ;)
I meant to say this game isn\'t super original/ground-breaking/system selling.
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The difference, Ironfist, is that many of the other games (and some of those) sucked ass becaue they were rushed, or merely graphics-upped versions of PS2 titles.
THPS2X is adding a ton.
Oddworld has gone 3D
Halo just sounds great (I HATED TS\'s controls, so pointless, MoH controls are the best EVER!)
Madden 2002 and NFL Fever have both been given adequate time to be finished and such.
DOA3 I am sure is an instant classic if you care about those type of things.
Fuzion Frenzy is a party game, I don\'t remember any on PS2 at launch (or even now for that matter)
etc.
PS2 launched sucked ass, I will reiterate that fact. X-Box is nothing to shake a fist at, but it is sizeably better than PS2\'s. Dreamcast or Saturn remain as the greatest launches of all time!
Eric Jacob
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
DOA3 - who cares.
[SIZE=8]I CARE AND DON\'T FORGET IT OR IRONFIST AND ME WILL COME 2 UR HOUSE AND BEAT U[/SIZE]
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
The difference, Ironfist, is that many of the other games (and some of those) sucked ass becaue they were rushed, or merely graphics-upped versions of PS2 titles.
And I guess the PS2 games weren\'t rushed at all. You are justifying the Xbox launch suckiness by saying the games were rushed, yet you are completely ignoring the fact that the PS2 games were even more rushed on a harder to develope system.
There are a few great titles, and then there is crap for both launches. Do you know where I could find a full list of Xbox launch games? Has Microsoft even released that yet? I want to show you how much trash there really is. There are like 15 launch games from what I\'ve heard. A handful of games are talked about, and the rest, well, are not. They are garbage just like the garbage games for the PS2 launch.
THPS2X is adding a ton.
But with THPS3 coming to both the PS2 and NGC, THPS2X doesn\'t seem that great.
Oddworld has gone 3D
And it is kind of flawed because of it. It is not getting awful reviews, but it isn\'t getting good ones either. From what I\'ve heard, it gets repetitive. (go read a review to see what I mean) It would not be considered a game to remember, or a system seller by any means.
Halo just sounds great (I HATED TS\'s controls, so pointless, MoH controls are the best EVER!)
How are Halo\'s controls any different from TS\'s? Oh yeah, you have to take your finger off the right analog stick in order to jump, making it almost impossible to do cool jump/turning moves. I don\'t see how Halo\'s controls are intuitive.
And IMO, TS\'s controls are the best for a console ever. The R analog is like the mouse, and the left analog is like the keyboard. It was easy going from a PC FPS player to a console FPS player because of the good control setup. And you do know that the TS controls were customizable don\'t you?
Madden 2002 and NFL Fever have both been given adequate time to be finished and such.
So? I don\'t see what you\'re getting at here. The PS2 already has Madden 2002, and it will be getting NFL 2k2 soon. And at the PS2 launch, we got Madden 2001. How do these two football games make the Xbox launch good?
DOA3 I am sure is an instant classic if you care about those type of things.
Yeah, and DOA2:HC was an instant classic if you care about those type of things. But the thing is, most of us don\'t like the DOA series. The only reason DOA3 would become a classic is because of a lack of better games on the Xbox.
EDIT: Sorry Emperor, but I am not that big on the DOA series. But it\'s fine if you are.
Fuzion Frenzy is a party game, I don\'t remember any on PS2 at launch (or even now for that matter)
So has this game been getting good reviews? If not, then it\'s just like the PS2 launch\'s "Summoner." It is a game that isn\'t that good, but the other launch doesn\'t have anything to match it.
How many people have even heard of Fuzion Frenzy? How many people are getting it on launch, or ever really? How many TV ads have you seen for this game? Fuzion Frenzy is not really a system seller, and it doesn\'t really make the Xbox launch good.
IMO, the Xbox launch is not any better than the PS2 launch. That is kind of pathetic given the circumstances (the Xbox is much easier to program for, and the developers had more time to developer for it). Buying an Xbox right now would be a waste of money IMO. The only game for the Xbox that even interests me is the over-hyped Halo (the graphics are not nearly as good as people are making them out to be). For the most part, buying an Xbox now would be getting the same things we got last year on the PS2 just with better graphics.
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How are Halo\'s controls any different from TS\'s? Oh yeah, you have to take your finger off the right analog stick in order to jump, making it almost impossible to do cool jump/turning moves. I don\'t see how Halo\'s controls are intuitive.
And IMO, TS\'s controls are the best for a console ever. The R analog is like the mouse, and the left analog is like the keyboard. It was easy going from a PC FPS player to a console FPS player because of the good control setup. And you do know that the TS controls were customizable don\'t you?
The turn rate in all FPS\' using a controller is what bothers me the most. If there is someone behind you, you can\'t do anything about it, you just kinda die. That\'s also the part that gives me huge headaches because I can\'t look behind my back as fast as I want to. In counter-strike, checking everywhere is a necessity and in a 2-player\\4-player deathmatch like Halo, I\'m sure it is there as well. That\'s why I love Keyboard\\mouse combos because you can change the sensitivity as you seefit and make it fast or slow depending on your preference.
I also disagree that Timesplitters was the best controlling FPS... Medal of Honor led the way for how FPS\' should control on videogame consoles. Even though I still don\'t like the controls for that game much either, the style of the game didn\'t irk me nearly as much as Halo, Red Faction, and Timesplitters does.
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Originally posted by Ryu
The turn rate in all FPS\' using a controller is what bothers me the most. If there is someone behind you, you can\'t do anything about it, you just kinda die. That\'s also the part that gives me huge headaches because I can\'t look behind my back as fast as I want to. In counter-strike, checking everywhere is a necessity and in a 2-player\\4-player deathmatch like Halo, I\'m sure it is there as well. That\'s why I love Keyboard\\mouse combos because you can change the sensitivity as you seefit and make it fast or slow depending on your preference.
Yeah. That\'s why the mouse/keyboard setup will always be the winner. I agree 100%.
I also disagree that Timesplitters was the best controlling FPS... Medal of Honor led the way for how FPS\' should control on videogame consoles. Even though I still don\'t like the controls for that game much either, the style of the game didn\'t irk me nearly as much as Halo, Red Faction, and Timesplitters does.
I haven\'t ever played that game, but from what I\'ve heard, the left analog is the looking, and the right is the moving -- just opposite of Timesplitters default controls. To me that sounds backwards, but I guess once you get used to it it could be good. But I don\'t think I\'ll ever switch to that. I love Timesplitters\' contols setup. And you can always change your controls in Timesplitters to match MOH\'s. :)
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ummm, IronFist, I meant to say PSX and not PS2 in that quote. re-reread my post and now reply. I think you will see it makes more sense in both directions. sorry for the confusion.
Eric Jacob
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Originally posted by IronFist
IMO, the Xbox launch is not any better than the PS2 launch. That is kind of pathetic given the circumstances (the Xbox is much easier to program for, and the developers had more time to developer for it). Buying an Xbox right now would be a waste of money IMO. The only game for the Xbox that even interests me is the over-hyped Halo (the graphics are not nearly as good as people are making them out to be). For the most part, buying an Xbox now would be getting the same things we got last year on the PS2 just with better graphics.
I agree,
I\'m sure the XBox titles will get better in time as have the PS2 titles, but the launch isn\'t something to brag about, those titles are comparable to the PS2 launch titles. I guess that is the thing that bothers me, i was expecting way more... especially with the XBox\'s "theoretical" easy programming environment, and off the shelf components. I guess somebody has been Nop\'ing too many idle loops in their code :nut:
There ain\'t too many games with the "drop your jaw" type of appeal. IMO.
The PS2 launch wasn\'t great, so i played DOA/TTT/SSX for the first month. It was a slow start from the gates, since it took more time to develop quality titles for the PS2... These titles are now appearing, so I’m quite happy with my PS2 purchase... took a while though,.. :)
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no you can\'t IronFist. Becaue the control in MoH were - d-pad for movement, left analog for camera, I believe.
That is the way it should be. It was darn near perfect. In Timesplitters and Red Faction, you cant even use those as an option. That is why MoH 3 has me more hyped than any FPS period.
Eric Jacob
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
That is why MoH 3 has me more hyped than any FPS period.
Eric Jacob
Ture but now a days all the AAA titles no matter what platform has the high risk of being over hyped.
thats the price we pay for having near enough day to day news on the development of top notch games
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too true, double o, I am disappointed by many a game becaue I am spoiled by up to the minute coverage of it, praising it to high hell.
Which is one of the reason I avoid Shenmue news like the plague and MoH like Anthrax.
Eric Jacob
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
no you can\'t IronFist. Becaue the control in MoH were - d-pad for movement, left analog for camera, I believe.
That is the way it should be. It was darn near perfect. In Timesplitters and Red Faction, you cant even use those as an option. That is why MoH 3 has me more hyped than any FPS period.
I don\'t understand. You move with the dpad, then in order to look somewhere else, you would have to take your finger off the dpad and move it over to the L analog stick? That can\'t be right, because that would really suck.
ummm, IronFist, I meant to say PSX and not PS2 in that quote. re-reread my post and now reply. I think you will see it makes more sense in both directions. sorry for the confusion.
That\'s what I thought at first, and I even wrote a responce to that if that was the case. But then I over analized it until it made sense with PS2 being there. :)
So I\'ll post it again (but I have to hurry -- I have to leave soon)
The difference, Ironfist, is that many of the other games (and some of those) sucked ass becaue they were rushed, or merely graphics-upped versions of PSX titles.
The good games for the launch were all original titles -- not rehashes of PSX games. Timesplitters, SSX, DOA2:HC, TTT, and even Madden 2001 (I think, but I\'m not sure about that one) were more than rehashes with better graphics.
What games on the PS2 launch were just PSX games with better graphics? I really can\'t remember any.