PSX5Central
Playstation/Gaming Discussions => Gaming Discussion => Topic started by: NPYYZ on January 24, 2002, 06:59:12 PM
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The facts speak for themselves The most powerfull system is without a doubt the X-box. Just wait a few months, it\'s still new. Wait until the game developers utilize it\'s full potental. Then we will see................
The PS2
Specs
CPU: 128-bit Emotion Engine at 294.912MHz
Main Memory: 32MB Direct RDRAM
Graphics: Graphics synthesizer at 147.456MHz, embedded cache VRAM--4MB
Sound: SPU2 with 48 channels plus software, sound memory--2MB
Input/Output Processor: CPU Core--PlayStation CPU+ at 33.8688MHz or 36.864MHz (selectable)
Media: CD-ROM and DVD-ROM
Disc Speed: 24x CD-ROM, 4x DVD-ROM
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The X-BOX
The Specs
CPU:
Intel Pentium III 733MHz processor with Streaming SIMD Extensions
Graphics Processing Unit:
300MHz custom 3D graphics processor by nVidia
300 million micropolygons/particles per second
150 million transformed and lit polygons per second
100+ million polygons per second sustained performance (shading, texturing)
4 simultaneous textures
Compressed textures available at 8:1 compression
Full-scene anti-aliasing
Memory:
64 MB of RAM (unified memory architecture)
6.4GB/sec memory bandwidth
Storage:
8GB hard drive
4X DVD drive with movie playback
8MB memory card
Sound:
Custom 3-D audio processor
64 Audio channels
3-D Audio support
Midi/DLS2 support
AC3 encoded game audio
Network:
100 MBPS Ethernet Port
Optional Modem
Input/Output:
4 game USB controller ports
Expansion port
Proprietary A/V connector
Video:
DVD movie playback
1920x1080 maximum resolution
HDTV support
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oh yeah, a few more kabuki warriors and sony will be out of business
:rolleyes:
my favorite line
CPU: 128-bit Emotion Engine at 294.912MHz
npyyz, do you own a PS2?
/me braces for response
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Pulling out the specs for a debate will only make you look stupid
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Yes I bought a PS2, my daughter currently has it at her house. I have the X-box and the no longer used Dreamcast here at my home.
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Originally posted by Bozco
Pulling out the specs for a debate will only make you look stupid
Actually pulling out the specs shows that the debate is useless, there is no debate.
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BWAHAHAHA! He\'s using specs!
When I was playing with Metal Gear Solid 2, Dynasty Warriors 3 and Gran Theft Auto 3 - I couldn\'t help but THINK ABOUT THE DAMN SPEX ON PS2 WAS SO INFERIOR TO MY.......car.
Puhleez. We got the games. You get the "hand me downs".
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I think there is a debate. Because we are debating. Are you denying the existance of the debate that obviously exists? Do you deny the existance of the sun, too? How about other obviously existant objects, like your computer? Maybe you don\'t even exist.
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Originally posted by GmanJoe
BWAHAHAHA! He\'s using specs!
When I was playing with Metal Gear Solid 2, Dynasty Warriors 3 and Gran Theft Auto 3 - I couldn\'t help but THINK ABOUT THE DAMN SPEX ON PS2 WAS SO INFERIOR TO MY.......car.
Puhleez. We got the games. You get the "hand me downs".
What hand me downs?
I dont\' remember Halo, Munch, Amped, PGR, Wreckless, Project Ego, Unreal Championship, Elderscrolls, Gun Valkerie, Bloodwake, Sega GT 2002, Jet Grind Radio Future, etc being announced and released for PS2 first. In fact, all the above are exclusive.
Can you out weigh my list above with ports from PS2 to Xbox?
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i dont say ports from PS2, i said ports
and out of those games you listed, that are even released, with the exception of halo, ARE B RATED AT BEST like i said before
yer complimenting me :)
*yawn*
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Originally posted by mm
i dont say ports from PS2, i said ports
and out of those games you listed, that are even released, with the exception of halo, ARE B RATED AT BEST like i said before
yer complimenting me :)
*yawn*
You still haven\'t given me a list of the ported games...
Project Gotham, Halo, Munch, Bloodwake, NFL Fever, NHL Hitz, Amped, Azurik, Dead or Alive 3...All exclusive for the time being.
And the whole "B rated" arguement...where is that going to go? I could name ALOT of PS2 B rated games, but that would be a long and somewhat big post.
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LET\'s see.....the ones you mentioned ARE exclusive...but they suck. So they don\'t count. :D
Silent Hill
Grand Theft Auto 3 (in about 2 years)
Metal Gear Solid (in about 2 more years)
Final Fantasy XI (in your wet dreams)
Tony Hawk\'s Pro skater 3
Oh....I\'m sure there\'s more. :D
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check the other xbox bashing thread to see my list of ported games
im gonna stick out and say that 25-40% of all xbox games are ports from dcast/ps2/pc etc etc
just a quick guess, dont really care if im wrong
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And what\'s your point?
Ports, originals, blah blah blah=more games for me!!:D
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yeah, more sub-par games to blow $50+ on
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Originally posted by NPYYZ
Actually pulling out the specs shows that the debate is useless, there is no debate.
Plz, even if graphics were the main thing to games xbox still isn\'t showing this power yet, but what you must remember is that there is this little thing called Gameplay
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yeah, i\'d rather play pac-man, than 95% of the xbox and perhaps 60% of the PS2 games out there
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Originally posted by mm
yeah, i\'d rather play pac-man, than 95% of the xbox and perhaps 60% of the PS2 games out there
I feel the opposite about it. There are only 3 games on PS2 I like. And I can\'t think of any in the near future I\'m interested in.
Xbox on the otherhand...I already have 8 games. There are 3 in Feb I\'m going to get, and then 5 more in March. That\'s another 8 in the next 2 months...
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not me, i own two. halo and oddworld.
i waited FAR too long for the next oddworld [my all time fav franchise] only to be sinfully letdown
being i have the job i do, i get to play all the games, and believe me, i have. it helps me classify 90% of them as B grade material
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There is no debate
There is no sun
There is no daughter
and lord knows, there are no trolls
BUT
we
got
SPECS FOR SALE!!!!
GET YOUR
RED HOT SPECS
RIGHT HERE!!!!
We see your CPU MHz and we DOUBLE IT!!!
We see your GS and raise it a Doubley damn Doubley GPU
We checked your RAM, Doubley damn Doubley it and for good measure UNIFIY IT!!!!!
Just WAIT A MINUTE!!! These graphics are gonna be so dang good your eyes is gonna BLEED!!! BLEE EE EE EED I SAY!!!
A Devs dream come true!!! IT\'s all Cake and Pie boys
Just look at what at what we got from the getgo
HALO- locked in at th th th THIRTY FRAMES PER SECOND!most da time, anyway
Hows about some DoA3? U gots to admit, dem titties is niiiiiiiice.....
MUCH GREATER GAMES TO COME!!!
Pay no attention to the little man behind the curtain
:rolleyes:
BTW, I pretty sure those x specs are a bit dated
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:laughing:
thats all I can do
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Okay, so where is that clown that was defending this guy in an another post. Kimathi or something like that.
Please just go away and love your xbox.
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heh amazing i didnt know xbox had dvd playback and PS2 didnt i guess you didnt research the specs huh maybe you just cut and paste
and everyone already knows xbox is more powerful system but that proves nothing
. . . and ginko what three games for PS2 do you have out of curiousity?
and what games are you buying for Xbox soon?
just something i wanted to know
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Too bad the specs don\'t compare to each other. How are these numbers supposed to "wow" me if they don\'t have any comparason value. You presented a stat for one machine, but neglected to produce that smae stat for the other.
Please do some real research and make a better presentation.
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Originally posted by Sublimesjg
. . . and ginko what three games for PS2 do you have out of curiousity?
and what games are you buying for Xbox soon?
just something i wanted to know
No problem, but I didn\'t say I have a PS2. I said there are only three games I like on it...That would be ICO, Final Fantasy X, and Jak and Daxter.
Wreckless 2/5
Elderscrolls 2/15
Jet Grind Radio Future 2/19
I have those preordered!
Then in March...can\'t remember the exact days though.
Unreal Championship 3/15
Sega GT 2002
Gun Valkerie
House of the Dead 3
Rallisport Racing
then I think Brute Force is due in late March or April, can\'t remember...
anything else?
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thats cool
just trying to see what exactly you like and what games you enjoy - since you seem to believe ps2 doesnt offer those games up to your standards which is fine by me since its your opinion
and thats about it :)
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You want Sega GT 2002 yet you don\'t list GT3 under your PS2 list:rolleyes:
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maybe he prefers sega
people have their rights to favor what they like - most people on this forum favor PS2 - not so much they are fanboys but they support it more so to speak - i myself am a squaresoft hor - at least rpg wise i hardly play any other rpgs that they dont make
i just enjoy theirs more - pretty biased i know but i am entitled to be biased i guess - doesnt mean i dont enjoy other ones though like star ocean 2 and etc. just prefer sqaure - i tend to like their stories more
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Originally posted by Bozco
You want Sega GT 2002 yet you don\'t list GT3 under your PS2 list:rolleyes:
I do prefer Sega and I am bias in that aspect...I tried the GT series, and I didn\'t like it...why, I can\'t exactly explain...
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Originally posted by GmanJoe
Puhleez. We got the games. You get the "hand me downs".
:laughing: There is only some PS2 ports that goes to Xbox but there is lots of new breeds of game that is born on the Xbox.
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Originally posted by Ginko
I do prefer Sega and I am bias in that aspect...I tried the GT series, and I didn\'t like it...why, I can\'t exactly explain...
I can\'t debate with your opinion, but I can agree with the bias, I can\'t think of one aspect Sega GT will beat GT3 on
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Originally posted by Bozco
I can\'t debate with your opinion, but I can agree with the bias, I can\'t think of one aspect Sega GT will beat GT3 on
I can\'t explain it, otherwise I would lay it out for you. I am a huge Sega fan though, that\'s a large part of it....
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I am a huge Sega fan though
glad we see eye to eye on at least one thing
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Originally posted by NPYYZ
The facts speak for themselves The most powerfull system is without a doubt the X-box. Just wait a few months, it\'s still new. Wait until the game developers utilize it\'s full potental. Then we will see................
The PS2
Specs
CPU: 128-bit Emotion Engine at 294.912MHz
Main Memory: 32MB Direct RDRAM
Graphics: Graphics synthesizer at 147.456MHz, embedded cache VRAM--4MB
Sound: SPU2 with 48 channels plus software, sound memory--2MB
Input/Output Processor: CPU Core--PlayStation CPU+ at 33.8688MHz or 36.864MHz (selectable)
Media: CD-ROM and DVD-ROM
Disc Speed: 24x CD-ROM, 4x DVD-ROM
.........................................................................................................
The X-BOX
The Specs
CPU:
Intel Pentium III 733MHz processor with Streaming SIMD Extensions
Graphics Processing Unit:
300MHz custom 3D graphics processor by nVidia
300 million micropolygons/particles per second
150 million transformed and lit polygons per second
100+ million polygons per second sustained performance (shading, texturing)
4 simultaneous textures
Compressed textures available at 8:1 compression
Full-scene anti-aliasing
Memory:
64 MB of RAM (unified memory architecture)
6.4GB/sec memory bandwidth
Storage:
8GB hard drive
4X DVD drive with movie playback
8MB memory card
Sound:
Custom 3-D audio processor
64 Audio channels
3-D Audio support
Midi/DLS2 support
AC3 encoded game audio
Network:
100 MBPS Ethernet Port
Optional Modem
Input/Output:
4 game USB controller ports
Expansion port
Proprietary A/V connector
Video:
DVD movie playback
1920x1080 maximum resolution
HDTV support
Wow, it\'s odd how you want to fight with specs but mention just about 1/3rd of the PS.2 spec list, I mean you mention the I/O ports on the X-Box but sadly fail to mention the PS.2 I/O ports, and you talk about the amazing Xbox polygon power, well the PS.2 is no slouch.
And I may be wrong on this, but wasn\'t the GPU originally intended to be at 300Mhz, then it was lowered to 250Mhz and then finally to 233Mhz?
Sadly I must tell you this that horsepower wise the Xbox wins, but technoligy wise the PS.2 slaughters the Xbox the paralell design of it exists nowhere else. And the PS.2\'s teeny weeny lil\'l 128 bit slaughters the Pentium, I mean it\'s a MIPS proc SGI uses MIPS processors in their workstations and coupled with the vector units we have the most powerful cpu of all the consoles.
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Really great way to debate...
Someone lists the games they like/are interested in and you respond with "THOSE GAMES SUCK!!!", then post your own list.
Can you say "lamer"?
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Originally posted by Ashford
Really great way to debate...
Someone lists the games they like/are interested in and you respond with "THOSE GAMES SUCK!!!", then post your own list.
Can you say "lamer"?
Maybe debating games isn\'t so lame. Consider a genuine mismatch in specs, PSX vs DC and one year after launch the DC was still being outsold by a system over 5 years older. More advanced, online ready, same price, legendary rep for making good games yet still painfully whipped by an outdated system, ancient in silicon age reckoning. It\'s got to make you wonder about the power of good games vs the power of specs alone.
nO-One on the other hand took up the challenge as if it were sincere and eloquently made a mockery of the tenet ‘there really is no debate\' by offering pertinent spec info. Cheers for nO-One! Funny, I was sure no one would bother and I turned out to be right, in a lopsided fashion. It will be a wonder if the junior member can reply without seeming even more of a stooge than the specs and title of this thread would have us believe. My guess is the only aim was to cause trouble.
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BACK in the REAL world the POST SHOULD read something like this
There really is no debate....
PS2 28 million SALES
X box 1.5 million
PS2 out selling Both the X box and Gamecube combined !
// me hands Bill Gates the 2nd place CUP ! then take it of him and hands ot to Nintendo.......... then takes it of them and hands it to Bill Gates then take it of him and hands ot to Nintendo.......... then takes it of them and hands it to Bill Gates .
Damn wont they make up their mind who wants to be second ;)
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Heretic...
What are you talking about???
I\'m talking about how lame it is to respond with "THOSE GAMES SUCK" when debating which system is better. Especially when that person posts his/her own list.
Great way to argue...
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Ashford...
I was talking about the subject of the debate being switched from specs to games being justified. If your intent was only to point to the lameness of "yours sux vs mine rox" then ok, sorry, my mistake.
Since I didn\'t quite catch the "THOSE GAMES SUCK" quote anywhere in this thread, I hope you can forgive my pointing out in a case where the gap in specs is not so wide, a debate over consoles based on games rather than paper power makes sense.
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Trog pretty much ended what little bit of a specs debate there was. Obviously, you can\'t have an intelligent debate with someone who dosen\'t even have half the facts. Trog forgot one point though, many of those specs aren\'t directly compairable. You have to have an indepth knowlage of the programing archetecture of each machine and the capabilities of the hardware involved.
NPYYZ the Xbox\'s 733mhz Celeron is more powerful than the PS2\'s 300mhz EE. (Well the mhz are doubled!) Sorry, but the EE (128bit RISC) spanks the Celeron (32bit CISC) preformance wise.. and I don\'t think there\'s ANY debate about that. Unless it\'s over which can handle the new version of Microsoft Office Suite better. Not to say that the Xbox on the whole is less powerful, but face it.. the Nvidia GPU carries the Xbox.
Streight spec numbers, taken at face value, are decieving.
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Originally posted by Bozco
Plz, even if graphics were the main thing to games xbox still isn\'t showing this power yet, but what you must remember is that there is this little thing called Gameplay
Great point, have you tried the X-box? At the moment I only own 2 games , Project Gotham Racing and NFL Fever 2002 and both of these games are the smoothest best reacting games I have ever played. I have also rented several other X-Box games and I have yet to play one, which did not impress me.
You want game play , can you say HALO!!!!!!!!
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gameplay yes, for a little bit, then you realize that yer going thru the same levels three times. :rolleyes: but you forgot to add eyestrain and cramped hands to that list also
oh and nfl fever 2002 = sux0r
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Originally posted by nO-One
Wow, it\'s odd how you want to fight with specs but mention just about 1/3rd of the PS.2 spec list, I mean you mention the I/O ports on the X-Box but sadly fail to mention the PS.2 I/O ports, and you talk about the amazing Xbox polygon power, well the PS.2 is no slouch.
And I may be wrong on this, but wasn\'t the GPU originally intended to be at 300Mhz, then it was lowered to 250Mhz and then finally to 233Mhz?
Sadly I must tell you this that horsepower wise the Xbox wins, but technoligy wise the PS.2 slaughters the Xbox the paralell design of it exists nowhere else. And the PS.2\'s teeny weeny lil\'l 128 bit slaughters the Pentium, I mean it\'s a MIPS proc SGI uses MIPS processors in their workstations and coupled with the vector units we have the most powerful cpu of all the consoles.
Ah we have someone who actualy knows a thing or two. I admit the spec\'s I posted for the PS2 were limited but that\'s all I could seem to find on line. Let\'s do a little comparing shall we......
We all know about the X-box\'s superior Graphics, Nvidia\'s NV2A GPU, and yes the PS2 does have an impressive Graphics-processing Architecture, but it doesn\'t match up to the NV2A
X-Box GPU speed 233 MHz PS2 GPU speed 147.456 Mhz
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Ah the questionable Processor...
the X-box pent lll 733 MHZ processor
The PS2 features a 294.912 MHZ central CPU
Even the Game cube has a 405 MHZ power PC which is slightly more powerfull then the PS2
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Lets talk Dolby Digital 5.1 for a bit.
The X-box has dolby digital 5.1 sound in gameplay. The PS2 proudly trumpets the fact that it supports Dolby Digital 5.1 sound, but what it doesn\'t say is that it only supports it during DVD movies and FMV sequences.
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Lets talk memory.
I bought my X-box, $299.00, and one game, $50.00 ,and brought it home and was able to play and save my game so I would not have to start it all over again. I bought my PS2, $299.00 ,and one Game$50.00 and brought it home and I realized I had to go spend another $34.00 for a memory card. then soon that memory card was full and I need another and another, but my XBOX has 50,000 blocks of memory right on the hard drive, which will never be full I think I can safely say.
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lets talk DVD, you will like a part of this one.
Yes with my X-box i had to run back to the store and spend $24.00 for the DVD kit so i could watch movies. With my PS2 I could watch them right away with no added cost. Although i had to spend a few bucks to access the DVD feature, I have to say it looks much better to be able to operate the DVD feature with a remote when company is over, you know instead of having to use a gamepad with a cable no less.
Oh yeah and the X-box is the only console with progressive DVD scan which means the X-box actually improves the output of the DVD medium by using the extra resolution afforded by HDTV sets.
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Max Resolution.......
On an HDTV the X-box max resolution of 1920x1080 is a glimpse of what is possible. X-box features like bump mapping add full scene anti-aliasing look truely incredible at those resolutions.
One key problem with the PS2 architecture is memory issues.Becuase of this it is extremely difficult for game developers to use high resolution textures in their PS2 games. Even if the PS2 could match the x-box\'s highest\'s resolutions, (which it can\'t) the texture would still look dark and grainy.
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Boy I really would like to be able to listen to some of my CD\'s while playing a game. Oh wait with the X-box CD copier I can. Sorry PS2 fans.
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Hey 3 of my friends are coming over and we all want to have a game of Madden 2002, oh that\'s right we will use the X-box insted of the PS2. The X-box allows 4 controllers to be connected at once without any adaptors.
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Want more????? OK
Polygon Throughput::::::
I know there just numbers but the X-box can push 125 million polygon per second, Almost twice as many as the PS2.
I know you will most likely say that polygons aren\'t important, hell I would to if the x-box was so out powered by it\'s competitors, but it\'s not. Look at the environments, the characters, and the objects in the game. The more polygons a console can push, the better things look.
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Pixel Shaders::::
For those of you who may not know a Pixel shader is a graphics function that calculates visual effects on a surface one pixel at a time. This means that the graphics processor must render, light, shade, and color millions of pixels for each frame, at 60 frames per second. For most graphics processors this is too much of a load, but not for the X-box. The importance of pixel shaders is that they help the game developers turn the typical, flat surfaces in video games into textured, organic, and realistically bumpy-looking surfaces. Oh you know how I mentioned how Pixel shaders are too complex for most graphic processors? Well the PS2 and Gamecube are part of that group.
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You know I could go on and on, there is much more the X-box can do that the PS2 can\'t, but i think i have made my point. Now I think it\'s time for a game of the graphicly stunning , and superior racing game, Project Gotham Racing found ONLY ON XBOX.
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Originally posted by SonyFan
NPYYZ the Xbox\'s 733mhz Celeron is more powerful than the PS2\'s 300mhz EE. (Well the mhz are doubled!) Sorry, but the EE (128bit RISC) spanks the Celeron (32bit CISC) preformance wise..
Streight spec numbers, taken at face value, are decieving.
I believe it\'s a Pentium lll Not a Celeron much different.
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People are wasting far too much time responding to this thread. You think specs rule the world, that\'s great for you. I\'m sur eyou\'re one of those people that think the Pentium 4 is the best processor out there, G4\'s suck because their clock speeds are only around 1 ghz, and Athlon\'s are terrible because they are cheaper. That\'s great for you, but to the people who know how to squeeze performance and fun factor out of their machines, console, PC or otherwise, how "Fast" a processor is on a board means nothing to them if it can\'t even hold a candle to another systems game library. Want something to talk about? Talk about why so many PS2 games that are out there are must-buys on a system that is "graphically inferior." Please, you keep playing Project Gothem, I\'ll just go online with GT4 and Auto Medolista.
Thread closed for ignorance on NPYYZ\'s part. Everyone here who has played games for a sizeable amount of time, let alone your 20+ years of "extensive experience," knows that specs don\'t mean trash and for a guy who has been "playing games all his life," you sure do know very little. Remember, brain farts are not tollerated on this forum. :)
PS NPYYZ, do not spam the forum by posting multiple times in one thread consecutively. Combine your replies into one post in the future.