PSX5Central
Playstation/Gaming Discussions => Gaming Discussion => Topic started by: Living-In-Clip on October 20, 2002, 10:27:49 PM
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Okay, here\'s how it goes. I\'ll list a couple catergories and you all tell me who should win the PSX2Central Lifetime Achivement Awards...
Most amazing Techincal Achievement
Best Story .
Best character design
Greatest franchise
Most sought after import
Best game design
Most important Company
Now remember, everyone is entitled to their own opinion\'s. But, please explain your answers also. Oh and only one per catergory.
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Hmm... great topic and the answers I\'m sure will be very interesting when they are posted and I\'m sure I\'ll forget quite a few games when I list my "winners" and I\'ll have to ammend my answers. Off of the top of my head though, these are my picks:
Most Amazine Technical Achievement:
StarFox (SNES) - Although Donkey Kong Country looked far superior in terms of polish, StarFox was one of a kind in its day and age. Sure, it was on rails, sure it was just plain repetetive shooting, but the game was incredible fun with a few creative branching paths on each difficulty. The beauty of it all was that it was the first to use the FX chip and still has yet to be emulated today. *hugs his original 16-bit copy*
Best Story:
Metal Gear Solid (PSX/PC) - Although I know that there are some games out there with much deeper plots and much more rich characters, namely RPG\'s, no game has captured me like Metal Gear Solid has. Its chracters are very odd, but none of them are totaly unbelieveable and the writing involved makes them that way. Such rich story with espionage, intrigue, and plot twists galore, make for one that I appreciate and love to this very day.
Best Character Design:
Street Fighter (NES - ?) - A lot of people see the Street Fighter characters as generic (bunch of morons I say), but the Street Fighter gang have been ones that are used for constant comparisons. The fighting character standards if you will. Ryu alone has been compared to Sub Zero, Kyo, Mitsurugi, Jin, Haomaru, and a number of other characters from many other fighters because he is the main character standard that all others are defined by. The warrior always striving to be the best. Not to mention an Indian who stretches into almost any direction, a Russian wrestler fighting for his country, and of course an enormous sumo wrestler with a belly full of laughs. It just doesn\'t get much more varied than that.
Greatest Franchise:
Street Fighter (Capcom) - Did you expect anything less from me, the guy who names himself after Ryu? ;) Well, honestly, I pick Street Fighter because it has been here since the 8-bit days in plenty of forms, ones we love, ones we hate, but all of them had their differences for one reason or another. And although Capcom has milked this franchise more than just about any other, it\'s because it is that damn good. Stop and think just how many versions you\'ve played over the years and you\'ll see that each one stood out above another for plenty of different reasons with each one, only slightly different in name, changing greatly from release to release both at home and in the arcades. It truly is the best fighter there is, the best there was, and in my opinion, the best there ever will be. *Kills Takara* ;)
Most Sought After Import:
Ikaruga (DC) - Although this will see a release on the Gamecube early in 2003, it\'s still the best shooter Treasure has ever made. If you don\'t believe me, just read my impressions of the DC import on intensity-magazine.com in the previews section. It\'s completely awesome and has some twists that are used to effectively. It\'s just an all around amazing import that every Dreamcast owner should have in their library.
Best Game Design:
The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past (SNES/GBA) - I tried to think of the most simplistic of games but still managed to be incredibly entertaining and incredibly varied all at the same time and LttP manages to be just that. The puzzles are very interesting albeit simple, and there\'s only two sword techniques, but the combat still has plenty of depth when mingled with other items and weapons. Not only that, but the game manages to tell an interesting story while you explore the beautifully colorful and amazing 16-bit world that everyone who claims to be a gamer should have fond memories of.
Most Important Company:
This is quite possibly the hardest question out of the bunch. Do I pick Squaresoft or Enix because of their sheer selling numbers? No... Especially since I am tired of the current RPG format. Do I pick Nintendo and their typically fun Mario and Zelda games? No... All they make are Mario and Zelda games and hand all their other franchises off to someone else. Should I pick Capcom because of the complete Street Fighter whore I am? No... Although I love them for Street Fighter, I\'m sick of Resident Evil and their shooters aren\'t all that interesting either. What about Konami? No... If I picked them, it would be for only one reason and I hate DDR. Nope, none of them, so who is it do I appreciate the most?
Sega (SoJ\\SoA) - Yes, I pick Sega as the most influential and by far the most original and most important developer for all of gaming. Their Sega sports titles have been totaly amazing ever since VC started making the 2K series and Smilebit has proven time and time again that they can do quality gaming with the releases of Jet Set Radio and soon to be released Panzer Dragoon orta. SonicTeam has also prove that their varied abilities really can adapt and change to fit the ever growing industry with their 3D controller and NiGHTs, Phantasy Star Online, and of course the ever important platform games that the company is named after, Sonic. Lets also not forget their arcade dominating prowess present in Virtua Fighter, Space\\Planet Harriers, Hang-On, Virtua Cop, Gun Blade, and a whole slew of others make them competitors in just about every genre. They deserve our respect moreso than any other company.
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Most amazing Technical Achievement
Dune 2 - The Battle for Arakis (PC/Genesis)- While Herzog Zwei and Populous were released before it, Dune 2 was the first ever Real-Time Strategy game as we know it and took the newly made genre and transformed it into the genre we see today. This game employs techniques that are still being used today in RTS\'s. In fact, apart from water vehicles (which would have served no real purpose in the game, seeing as Arakis is a desert planet with no water) and the ability to select more than one unit at a time, I can\'t really see any element in modern RTS\'s that weren\'t in this game.
Best Story
Metal Gear Solid: Tactical Espionage Action (PSX/PC) - While fantasy games are deep and involving in their own unique way, this game had a story with real world implications. Commenting on everything from atomic weapons and genetic manipulation, to sibling rivalry. Adding more depth, charm and character to that of your standard Espionage novel, this game will always stand out as having the greatest story ever.
Best character design
Magus (Chrono Trigger) - The sleek and almost sexy (stfu) character design is simplistic enough and typifies the bad guy characters uniformly present in today\'s games. Very gothic design and dress, with almost elvish like features, he has the respsonsibilty of being the \'bad guy\' character to whom I compare all others.
Greatest Franchise
Final Fantasy - Most people wouldn\'t be surprised by my choice. Released every other year with an all new story, and an all new magic system, I still haven\'t gotten sick of this stellar series. From Final Fantasy 6 to Final Fantasy X (I\'m working on FF4) every single iteration would be present somewhere in my top ten, or twenty games of all time. What else need be said?
Most sought after import
Chrono Cross - I want it, and I haven\'t got it. It will be mine!
Best game design
Resident Evil - You can only carry 6 items at a time. You have a gun and a small clip taking up 2 spots. You have a green herb taking up another. You are carrying a key, and an object needed for a puzzle. You have no more health in your inventory, and you\'re already on caution. You walk out the door and hear a terrifying clicking noise slowly working it\'s way to you, but you can\'t see who, or what is making it because of the wonderful use of camera angles. This is a situation in the game that can occur at any one time, and has yet to be successfully replicated by another game. Truely amazing.
Most important company
Squaresoft - I have never played a game by Squaresoft I havent loved (although I do avoid some intentionally :D) If they were to develop exclusively for a console, you could bet that little box would be in my house as soon as possible. \'Nuff said.
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Most amazing Techincal Achievement
For this category I would have to name AM2\'s Shenmue and Shenmue II as clear winners.. tho many may disagree. What they have done with this game is shown exactly what talented individuals who know their hardware can do when motivated and encouraged. This game isn\'t just amazing in it\'s visuals which one would think are impossible on the Dreamcast.. but in the plethora of calculations going on underneith the surface. Calculations which determine things like weather patters, character reactions, NPC schedules, timed events, and so much more. This game is a marvel for it\'s time and it\'s hardware.
Best Story
Tho I\'d like to name Gabriel Knight as the winner here for it\'s rich atmosphere and deep involving character interactions, I have to agree with Ryu and Bobby and say that MGS does indeed have a superior storyline, and enough action to keep it flowing at a fast pace which helps draw players in in a fashion that GK cannot match.
Best character design
This award would have to go to Square.. not for a single game.. but for the plethora of memorable characters they\'ve made over the span of many games. From Chrono to Tidus to Sephiroth to Kefka.. Square\'s characters remain etched in many gamers hearts and minds.
Greatest franchise
I can\'t personally see how anyone can doubt the power of Mario when it comes to talk of best franchises. The fat lil plumber originally named Jumpman has appeared in hundreds of different games spanning a nearly 20 year career.. many of which are acclaimed as being revolutionary. Weither it be the unprecedented lines around software shops waiting for the release of Mario 3 or the fundamental shift in platformer design brought about by Mario64.. Mario has always been Nintnedo\'s strongest Trump card, and one of the few franchise characters who could actually live on long after his parent company fades away. Mario has transcended from a videogame icon, to a cultural one.
Most sought after import
I\'m not big on the import scene, so I would have to mention the game I\'ve heard the most good things about.. Panzer Dragoon Saga. However this award comes with an * as I\'ve never actually played the game myself.
Best game design
IMO, best game design would have to go to Quest for Glory. Despite it\'s flaws, this game series was accomplishing things back in the late 80\'s to early 90\'s that current games are only now being recognised for. Weither it be dynamic dialouges, branching storyline paths, real-time day/night transistions, unprecidented freedom of exploration, real-world life sustaining needs, as well as combining RPG elements in with action in the form of real-time combat to keep the action flowing at a brisk pace.. this game series was truely ahead of it\'s time.
Albiet.. tho it did have it\'s flaws, mainly in the form of bugs which were brought about by short development cycles and underfunding, the core of this game stands stong. Although it may not have recieved the attention I may think it deserved, the awards it\'s followers recieve are a testiment to just how revolutionary it really was.
Most important Company
Of course, following on the heels of my QFG speil (in typical fanboy fashion) I\'m going to name Sierra as my most important gaming company. Sierra started off with a revolution.. before they were even a company no less. By adding the 3rd dimension into games with their tech demo "King\'s Quest" for the IBM jr, Ken and Roberta Williams started a trend in gaming.. and pushed an industry. Overnight, Sierra almost singlehandedly created markets for VGA graphics, Sound Cards, and CDRom drives in home PC\'s by vigorously persuing new technology to incorperate into their games and informing the home user of the benefits of these new technologies through pamphelets placed inside of their games and articals in their gaming newsletters. They, above any other company, pushed the PC market to expand.. while the competition felt only the desire to create software within "average specs" of most home users.
Not even counting their games which span several frachises successful enough to make it into their seventh to ninth incarnations and garner huge cult followings.. their actions to further improve gaming experiences has lead me to name them the most influencial gaming company around.
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Most amazing Techincal Achievement
I don\'t have a solid answer for this one, but from the looks of what\'s to come in the new PS2 Haven game, I might suggest that title, IF it lives up to the current description. The fact that you can move from a fight in space, then pilot your vehicle to the planet below, then go from a desert to an ocean and take a boat to anywhere, and all with no loading between sections, just sounds amazing. I know it\'s not finished, so my answer about this is a speculative one.
Best Story
I agree that the Resident Evil series went downhill after the first couple of games, but I have always loved horror movies, and the first RE game really captured my attention and pulled me in as far as story goes. So, for me the first game in the RE series (which I actually played on the Sega Saturn) had the best story.
Best character design
A lot of people may disagree with me on this, but I\'m going to say Ico. How can I list characters from a game that doesn\'t even have much dialogue? Simply because when I finished this game, these characters seemed more real to me than characters from any other game I\'ve played. Sure, they don\'t speak much, but the relationship between the characters that builds because of their constant interaction and dependency on each other made me care about them.
Greatest franchise
Although I don\'t play many RPGs, I would have to say Final Fantasy. The first one I played was FF4, and even though I haven\'t played much of any FF game since then, it\'s clear to see the impact that the franchise continues to have on gaming, and the dedication that fans in general have to the series.
Best game design
I have to agree with Bobs_Hardware on this. I would agree on Resident Evil, for most of the same reasons already listed.
Most important Company
Although they aren\'t currently my favorite company (but by no means do I dislike them), I would list Nintendo as the most important company. After Atari made their huge fiasco with their poor Pac-Man port and extremely poor sales from the E.T. licensed game that killed the video game industry for awhile, Nintendo was the company that breathed new life into the world of video games with the NES, and things have just picked up momentum since then. I would list Sega as the second most important, because they had a huge hand in perpetuating the momentum that Nintendo started after Atari\'s mistakes.
:alien:
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Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
Most amazing Techincal Achievement
Free Radical for Timesplitters
60 FPS and a right scream of a multplayer.
detailed Reason
Timesplitters may of been on of the most superb games i have ever played that was developed in such a small development time (due to the launch of the PS2)
ok so Story mode was just a "capture" the flag... but the Multiplayer made up for it.
and due to this Both TS & TS2 can\'t realy be compaired to unreal T or other FPS due to the fact that its Aimed at multiplayer fun rather than Whaoooo factor that unreal T 2003 has with its "rag Doll" physics.
in short
Timesplitters the game your PS2 multitap was made for.
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SonyFan...
Why import PDS when its available in the US?
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Most amazing Techincal Achievement
Got to be GT3 in my opinion, even after 18 months nothing has come close to it for amazing graphics depth and playability. To unlock everything will take you months of playing and the car tweaking and tuning adds to the lastability even more. This game is still the benchmark title on the ps2 IMO that has yet to be rivalled.
Best Story
Zelda 64 Ocarina of time. Time travel, meeting different people, lots of enemies to defeat. A truly massive game which certainly kept me hooked to the end. The way things were different depending on which time of day you visited was amazing.
Best character design
Sonic the Hegdehog, he was the sega mascot when the Master System and Megadrive were released and helped make sega\'s 8-bit and 16-bit consoles a success.
Greatest franchise
Got to say the Streetfighter franchise as this is the benchmark that spawed all the beat em up games we have today.
Most sought after import
Dunno, probably Chrono Trigger on SNES because it was never releaed in europe.
Best game design
I would say GTA3, no other game gives you so much freedom to do what you want and recrates a mini city with so much detail. (Roll on Vice City!).
Most important Company
This has gotta be Atari as they are the ones responsible for the first consoles and games. They started the whole console industry and helped to make it what it is today. (With the execption of the Jaguar!)
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most amazing technical achievement
This has got to be Naughty Dog with Jak & Daxter. This game was the first to prove the PS2 biggest critics wrong: from pushing millions of polygons, amazing texture detail, jaggy and shimmer free, absolutely no loading times and an animation sure enough to impress. But, that\'s not the reason why I herald them for their achievement. No, the main reason is their ability to be the one developer, still after more than 2 years, that\'s pushing the PS2 more than anyone. Not only that, but they also managed to achieve something quite special: create an engine that can render one entire world with no loading times, no limits. Look anywhere you want and you will see things exactly as they are. Nothings hidding. To do something like this requires amazing engineering as all objects further away must be simplified into objects which much lower detail. Pack this all up into one game locked at 60 fps and you\'re got one amazing achievement there.
best Story
Hmm, this one was quite hard to decide between the MGS series and FFVII. I\'ll have to go with FFVII though, as this game simply impressed me greatly with the detail of every character. The story kept you playing til the end and this is what makes this game so unique. Something I have, unfortunately, never quite experienced since then.
best character design
Never gave much thought to that, but Square certainly has some of the most amazing characters in games to date IMO. Every FF title I have played thus far has amazing characters and I must say that I really like the design to them.
Most important company
For obvious reasons, Squaresoft. Sony inhouse teams are coming very close though (Naughty Dog being one, EvolutionStudios, Polyphony Digital etc).
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Ashford - PDS is available in the US?? Woah.. ya learn something new everyday. I\'ve always heard it refered to in context of an import game and I\'ve certainly never seen it on the shelf of any Videogame trader shop around here. I was actually pretty oblivious to the goings on at Sega durring the 32 bit days since Sega never saw fit to distribute anything to my area and all the Saturn got around here (when the Saturn acutally got some shelf space) was crap games and games which were already on the PSX. Still to this day it\'s hard to find ~GOOD~ Saturn titles in this part of Indiana.
Kurt Angle - Sonic was not Sega\'s mascot in the 8 bit days. He made his debut in 1992 on the Sega Genesis and his first title was later ported to the Sega Master System 2 which had been re-released with ports of GameGear games and new content. Some of the SMS\'s best games didn\'t come until after it was eclipsed by the Genesis.
Up until that point, Alex Kidd was Sega\'s mascot.. and his game "Alex Kidd in Wonder Land" was built into the revised MasterSystem 2. (The original SMS also had a game built in - a small but fun Snail-Maze race type game)
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PDS is considered to be the best Saturn games and is one of the best RPGs, ever...
A unique battle system that kicks Square\'s a$$...
4 Discs...
Very nice cinemas...
This is one of the most sought after Saturn games because Sega released only about 5,000 copies in the US...
I made the mistake of not picking it up when I had the chance so I had to rely on eBay...
Scored an almost mint copy for $100...
Well worth it...
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yes, sega released 1000 copies of PDS in the US
the SMS actually had two games built in games, hang on and safari hunt (light gun title)
the non built in game version was the one with the snail game, so it kinda did have a built in game anyways :nut:
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No.. I\'m pretty positive that Alex Kidd in Wonder Land was the built in game for the SMS2, it\'s in a Sega Visions magazine I have around here somewhere. I think Hang-On/SafariHunt were -Packaged- with the SMS2.. much like Hang-On/AstroWarrior was for the original SMS.. but were not a part of the hardware like Alex Kidd was.
Not sure.. did they even make a MasterSystem3? Maybe that was one we\'re getting confused on. I know there was a Genesis 3, but it wasn\'t built by Sega.. it was by some other 3rd party hardware manufacturer who simply licenced the technology from Sega.. and came out well after the Saturn and PSX had already launched.
EDIT: Clarification right here - Goldmine of SMS history (http://www.thepong.com/Sites/Left/Sega/MS/Hist.htm)
In what seems to be a tradition with game systems, Sega of America released the Sega Master System II in 1990 in order to increase it\'s current user base via inexpensive (though downscaled) hardware. This "2nd generation" SMS (comparable to the Atari 2600 Jr. and remodeled NES) is missing some features the first version had, namely the Reset-Button, a power led and the card-slot (which means no games on the Sega cards and no 3D-games, too). Very much the opposite of the original model, the SMS II looks similar to the remodeled 16-bit Genesis system. Smooth curves, rounded corners, variable degrees of black and gray colored plastic, plus an enlarged, white Pause button for those "dive for the system" type of action games. As an incentive, Sega included Alex Kidd in Miracle World as a built-in freebie.
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Yes, I know the Genesis 3. I saw it at KB Toys about 4-5 years ago. Man, what a waste of time!
Much like the revived Game Gear.. ;)
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This has gotta be Atari as they are the ones responsible for the first consoles and games. They started the whole console industry and helped to make it what it is today. (With the execption of the Jaguar!)
..Atari... did not start the console industry..
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Panzer Dragoon Saga (US) on list of must buy\'s. I just got to find a copy to score. Once I do, I\'m all over it.
I\'ve seen plenty of import copies, but it is one of those games that is how do we say, context heavy?
:D
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Originally posted by SonyFan
Up until that point, Alex Kidd was Sega\'s mascot.. and his game "Alex Kidd in Wonder Land" was built into the revised MasterSystem 2.
not that it matters much, but I think the game was called:"Alex Kidd in miracle world"
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atari may not have started the console industry, but they certainly broke it wide open. like sony did again, years later
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Most Amazing Technical Achievement
Jak & Daxter. There was some slowdown and some instances of pop-up but both were extremely rare. The beautiful environments, no loading times, and no draw distance.
Best Story
That\'s a tough one. I\'m not really all that fond of any game\'s story line. So N/A.
Best Character Design
Squaresoft and the Final Fantasy series. Obvious reasons if you\'ve played a FF.
Most sought after import
I\'d say Shenmue II, not for me though.
Greatest Franchise
Zelda...they attract so much attention, are nearly done to perfection, and sell by the truck loads. Celda just might turn things around as I don\'t see it having such mass appeal because of the graphic style. Maybe people aren\'t as shallow as I think. /shrugs shoulders.
Best Game Design
The 2-D Sonic games. It\'s still fun to go ripping through those games. For the most part the levels are designed for maximum speed.
Most important company
I\'m not really sure on this. I\'d say Squaresoft carries alot of weight with them.
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Technical Acheivement
Shenmue for Saturn or Crazy Taxi for Dreamcast/arcade.
We don\'t really know how Shenmue for Saturn would\'ve turned out, since it was very far from completion. But if the small view into Ryo\'s world at the completion of Shenmue II was any indication. AM2 would\'ve been pushing Saturn to it\'s breaking point, and Saturn was much better than it was EVER made out to be.
Crazy Taxi was one of the first truly free-roaming games. A HUGE world compared to what had been seen for years in games. Sure there was some slowdown when the action got frantic, but the game was seamless, and fun to boot.
Best Story
Shenmue I and II
RPGs are regurgitated. Story\'s are hackneyed, thrown together, recycled, and done all over again, ad infinitiam, ad nauseam.
With Shenmue. Your interest is piqued within the first 5 minutes. What significance does the mirror play? Who do Hazuki-san kill in the past? Who is Lan-Di? While the first half of the game may drag on, the second half is no slouch. Slowly, you begin learning clues about Lan-Di, Charlie, and Chinese black marketers. The Story is told with some pretty terrible dialog and just plain bad voice actors, yet, the story works so well. Many things that make NO sense in the first game, fall right into place while playing, and later completing the second. Shenmue II leaves you stranded, alone, and poor in a completely new place. While I won\'t go into depth about Kowloon and Guilin\'s stories so as not to spoil anything, I will say that Discs 3 and 4 have some of the best \'Story\' in games, ever.
If you don\'t agree, you can go slog through another Final Fantasy game. FOREVER!
Best Character Design
Capcom, specifically the Street Fighter Series
Sure Final Fantasys, Phantasy Star Online, etc. have all had great character design. Nothing meets the overall quality of a great SF character.
From the odd (Birdie, Necro), to the forever copied (Ryu), Capcom has truly created the most memorable looking character designs in the SF series.
Most Sought After Import
Ever? Shenmue II without a doubt. highest imported game of all time. It will never be one for the ages ever, though. Since it is getting it\'s stateside release. I think the prize of most sought after import will forever rest on Radiant Silvergun for Saturn. The years have proved hard for some of the[/b] imports. DBZ:Shinbutohden, Dracula X (PC-E), etc. Used to pull in much higher than 100 dollars, easily falling into the 150 range, but both and others have fallen much further down. RS is still one of the those games that shooter aficianados scream for. And why not, I prize my copy as one of my best.
Greatest Franchise
Street FIghter
No game series, nor individual game, has had me play longer than the Street Fighter series. Literally THOUSANDS of hours have gone into playing these games. I have played 3rd Strike enough to make even the most hard-nosed Everquest addict cry themselves to sleep. Most perfect games ever.
Best Game Design
a really tough one.
Shinobi for GG 2: The Silent Fury, Sreet Fighter III: 3rd Strike, or Virtua FIghter (all).
I have my reasons. All should be pretty obvious if you have played any of them and like well made games.
Most Important Company
You\'ve got to be kidding me. Sega has so much influence on this industry it isn\'t even funny. Ever since 1989 on the homefront and basically FOREVER in the arcade scene, their technological and gameplay acheivements FAR outweigh any company. Nintendo had alot of influence pre-1990. Since then. They have done much less.
Screw your \'one per category thing. :P
Eric Jacob
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Technical Acheivement
~Goldeneye: 007~ (N64)
Huge breakthrough when it came to FPS\'s on home consoles. Since GE\'s triumphant release, the following FPS\'s all followed in GE\'s footsteps.
Best Story
~Zelda:OOT~(N64)
Shiggy\'s ability to blend time travel with a great storyline really made this game successful. The story in general is pure brilliance and broke the stereotypical, "Save the princess" routine.
Best Character Design
I originally had another character in mind, but after reading what Ryu said, I\'m definately gonna say that Ryu from the Street Fighter series has had the most dramatic impact on the gaming industry.
Greatest Franchise
Zelda. Hands down. No questions.
Perhaps the most successful franchise, with over five titles spanning across all Nintendo consoles, each Zelda game has had a great influence on adventure games that follow it and contained the most unforgetable characters you could ever meet.
Best Game Design
~Banjo-Kazooie~ (N64)
During the N64\'s "pre-expansion pack" era this was the game that had everyone\'s jaws on the floor. The environments seemed endless and lush is an understatement. The levels seemed to be alive and contained their own emotions within themselves.
Most Important Company
Nintendo. They have paved the way for so many gaming elements its ridiculous. They created the foundation of great gaming.
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Most amazing Techincal Achievement
Naughty Dogs Jak and Daxter.. Ratchet and Clank might take over soon ;)
Best Story
I like my stories complex, MGS2 :)
Greatest franchise
Hmm, hmmm, HMMM!
Final Fantasy.
Most important Company
Squaresoft.. They made the PlayStation the huge success it is today. Keyword, Final Fantasy 7.
2nd runner, Sony.. Bigger, badder (lol) and better than everyone else :fro:
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Squaresoft made the PSX a success it is today when several N64 games and some PSX games sold better than it? The only thing FFVII did for PSX was to introduce RPGs to the youngin crowd and help validify RPGs on consoles in America.
Squaresoft is hardly important, especially anymore.
Eric Jacob
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So the massive sales spike in the PSX\'s favor AFTER FF7\'s release was just co-incidence? Or perhaps Metal Gear Solid was announced and sold systems in advance (like MGS2 with PS2)?
Try to downplay FF7\'s importance all you want, but it was a major game last generation as far as Sony is concerned.
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Originally posted by AlteredBeast
Squaresoft made the PSX a success it is today when several N64 games and some PSX games sold better than it? The only thing FFVII did for PSX was to introduce RPGs to the youngin crowd and help validify RPGs on consoles in America.
Squaresoft is hardly important, especially anymore.
Eric Jacob
FFVII has sold huge numbers of PSXs.When it was released it was one of the best selling games if not the best.It has sold 2 million copies in 2 days only in japan when released.
The PSX gain even more fans and even more fame with FFVII.
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The PSX\' success can be contributed to a steady flow of good games.
Twisted Metal 2, FFVII, Gran Turismo, Tekken 2, EA Sports, etc. Made the PSX take off in and around 1997, with other great selling and great playing games that came later.
PSX\' success didn\'t come with one game. The whole time around FFVII, great games were released, too, you know. FFVII is NOT that important in the scheme of things.
Eric Jacob
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Twisted Metal2 never had the same impact.GT came in 1998,EA sports havent made anything particularly amazing.
Lets agree that many games playied their part to the PS success but FFVII made things a lot rosy.The PS1 would have still been a success without it but not as succesfull as it is today.FFVII playied the major role for 1997.The greatest positive impact for PS of 1997.
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Crash Bandicoot had more of an impact on PSX\'s sales than FFVII.
Eric Jacob
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Agree\'d. The only thing FVII did was establish Square as Sony\'s whore and bring RPG\'s to a certain mass appeal.
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a simple ,collecting apples jumping and swirling platformer vs a complex and huge RPG.
Crash sold because it was the only good platform game, great looking,simple and fun to play.While Final Fantasy was for its complexity,variety,story and great graphics.
FF wasnt the game to be bought by everyone.But it gained more admiration on PS.Crash although sold more,it wasnt the game that showed to the world the complex,cinematic,huge and an amazing looking game on PS1 for the first time.It has surpassed anything a gamer had expected from PS1.It wasnt a typical everyday game.It wowed more than Crash.BTW I dont think a 6-14 year old gamer would prefer FFVII over Crash:rolleyes:.And there was an enormous number of very young gamers then to buy it.Dont u think?Especially when from the simpler and 2D 16bit games we went to the 3D,need getting used to 32-bit games for the first time.
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Did we argue that FVII showed the people a lot of great cinema\'s and what not? No. We just argued that Crash was more of a boost for Sony than anything. Hell, Crash at one time was considered the un-offical mascot for Sony and Sony did nothing to dispell the feeling that he was.
Sony was aiming towards the teenage market when FVII had came out - word spread that it was a great game. More people got it, etc. It brought RPG\'s to a mass public and lead the RPG surge we under went durin\' the 32 bit era, but never was Cloud considered to be a Mascot for Sony. That was unfathomable.
Not to mention, due to Crash, platformers starting finding a home on the PSone and it gained Sony the younger crowd which at the time Nintendo did have a hold on, even with the cartridge based "fun machine". That "swirling platformer" gained Sony another part of the market share that they wasn\'t even aiming for at first.
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Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
Did we argue that FVII showed the people a lot of great cinema\'s and what not? No. We just argued that Crash was more of a boost for Sony than anything. Hell, Crash at one time was considered the un-offical mascot for Sony and Sony did nothing to dispell the feeling that he was.
Sony was aiming towards the teenage market when FVII had came out - word spread that it was a great game. More people got it, etc. It brought RPG\'s to a mass public and lead the RPG surge we under went durin\' the 32 bit era, but never was Cloud considered to be a Mascot for Sony. That was unfathomable.
Not to mention, due to Crash, platformers starting finding a home on the PSone and it gained Sony the younger crowd which at the time Nintendo did have a hold on, even with the cartridge based "fun machine". That "swirling platformer" gained Sony another part of the market share that they wasn\'t even aiming for at first.
Did we argue that FVII showed the people a lot of great cinema\'s and what not? No.
No but I mentioned them to express the reasons why FF7 was revolutionary for PS1.
Crash was the first platform game published from Sony,PS owners needed a mascot,Sony saw people liked him ,mentioned him an unnofficial mascot and he became one.You should have seen Sony\'s Crash Bandicood presentations in Video Game exhibitions.Yes Sony tried to make Crash an un-nofficial mascot.
Crash\'s sales have been huge but FFVII showed more the importance of the PS.
Sony tried to market PS for all ages since PS1 early days especially after seeing WipEout attracting mature gamers to the Playstation.Besides FF7 is a game very young gamers wouldnt have chosen,and very japaneese(super deformed characters anyone).17 years ware more likely(and previous FF fans) to buy it.
Cloud no way he could have become a mascot.He is a character made by Squaresoft for a genre not as easily acceptable as platform games.The most famous mascots are Mario and Sonic.Simple story,main good guy and the usual bad guy.And a platform game.
(btw:All characters in FF had the same importance.He wasnt a born hero afterall).
I dont think a mascot mean anything here.Cloud has been a better character in a much better game.He wasnt ment to become a mascot anyways.
Yes Crash offered so much for PS1 but FF7 gained not the younger crowd.But crowd from various ages.And most importantly mature gamers.Crash was an easy seller and sold more due to its simplicity and FFVII sold great due to its perfection.It showed PS1\'s true capabilities and what developers could achieve from it.It was a true next gen PS game.It ment a lot for the future PS1 games while Crash\'s appearance made the PS name more common known and famous.
FFVII was the most revolutionary game in 1997 for the console.This kind of greatness mean a lot more and have different importance for consoles than easy selling simple games.Which game do u think is more important?An easy seller like GT3 and Fifa(to make things worse:Tomb Raider 3,4,cronicles?) or games like ICO,Pro Evo and Shenmue?(The difference from the last 3 titles I mentioned is that FF7 got the reputation,credit and sales it deserved.So it influenced).
Its like saying a mediocre game is more important than a revolutionary game of a different genre just because it\'s sold more.Sales are also determined from the kind of genre a tilte belongs to.
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FFVII was the most revolutionary game in 1997 for the console.
Revolutionary? I don\'t know about you, but I felt the tip of respect towards FFVI seeing as how the games are so incredibly similar in gameplay. Maybe you missed it, but FFVII is more of the same gameplay wise to previous RPG\'s then you\'ll ever realize. A revolution with console RPG\'s is FFVIII, a game that sold more than FFVII and was regarded as a much worse title, but trayed incredibly far from their typical formula. Phantasy Star Online is a more revolutionary title because it introduced online play to console RPG\'s for the first time.
I\'m not saying that FFVII was bad, I actually loved it a great deal, enough to go through it twice, but my reasons are completely different than yours. You see FFVII as revolutionary, but have you deled into FFVI? Have you ever tried Chrono Trigger? Revolutionary, only if you\'ve never played previous titles in the series.
Which game do u think is more important?
I think the game that is important are the ones that set standards in the genre. FFVI is still the RPG standard if you ever played it just like Street Fighter is the 2D fighter standard that all others are compared to and just like GT is the racing simulation standard. Each of those games are revolutions on the genre... FFVII is evolution at its best.
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Here is how important Crash was to Sony. Crash was Sony\'s answer to Mario and that is common knowledge, he even came out around the same time and the commercials was him torturing Nintendo, etc. Sony realized they needed that marketshare and used Crash for it and he was and probably will always be the un-offical mascot for Sony. He launched the PSone success not only to older gamers but to people who had kids and was paying out of the ass for more "kiddy" games on the N64.
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Then I guess FF7 was just another great game?I cant see it that way.From all the 32-bit titles in 1997 it was the one that wowed the most.And not just graphically.
It had more variety in gameplay than any other game in 1997 and before on PS.Huge not just in lenght.But on content as well.
A revolution with console RPG\'s is FFVIII, a game that sold more than FFVII and was regarded as a much worse title, but trayed incredibly far from their typical formula.
I think the game that is important are the ones that set standards in the genre. FFVI is still the RPG standard if you ever played it just like Street Fighter is the 2D fighter standard that all others are compared to and just like GT is the racing simulation standard. Each of those games are revolutions on the genre... FFVII is evolution at its best.
Seeing your first paragraph and the second at first you mention FF8 a revolutionary better selling game than FF7 and then you mention that the games that are important are the ones that set standards in a genre.Crash hasnt.Sold more than FFVIII.No way its revolutionary.And neither has FFVIII set new standards in the RPG genre.Even if it has sold more.
FF7 influenced a lot more the RPG genre.
GT was a very influencial title for the next racing games to come.GT3 though hasnt influenced at all.Why?Because it wasnt much improved gameplay wise.But FF7 has been influencial when older Final Fantasies existed before it.Why?
I dont think FF7 got some critics like "could be the best game ever" accidentally.
The first PS1 title to be called like that and the second after the N64\'s Super Mario64.
Here is how important Crash was to Sony. Crash was Sony\'s answer to Mario and that is common knowledge, he even came out around the same time and the commercials was him torturing Nintendo, etc. Sony realized they needed that marketshare and used Crash for it and he was and probably will always be the un-offical mascot for Sony. He launched the PSone success not only to older gamers but to people who had kids and was paying out of the ass for more "kiddy" games on the N64.
I never said Crash had insignificant importance for Playstation\'s success.I said that FF7 and crash had different importance.
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Final Fantasy 7 was critical to Sony being a massive success in Japan. That is all.
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I am not talking exclusively about sales here.
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Seeing your first paragraph and the second at first you mention FF8 a revolutionary better selling game than FF7 and then you mention that the games that are important are the ones that set standards in a genre.Crash hasnt.Sold more than FFVIII.No way its revolutionary.And neither has FFVIII set new standards in the RPG genre.Even if it has sold more.
FF7 influenced a lot more the RPG genre.
You\'re mixing two arguements together as if they were one. I never mentioned crash in relation to final fantasy. I don\'t care about crash and that\'s why I didn\'t mention them. Leave crash to your arguements with LiC and Altered Beast, but don\'t respond to me as if I care about such frivilous things. My point was to show you that although FF7 may have been a good game, the only thing that changed about it were its graphics, but it\'s otherwise a rehashed FFVI. You didn\'t comment on whether you\'ve played FFVI before... have you, or perhaps did you play it *After* you played FFVII?
But FF7 has been influencial when older Final Fantasies existed before it.Why?
FFVII is not an influential title on other RPG\'s. That\'s your own imagination talking. Square showed us that they can take the formula of FFVI, rename it, rewrite it, and then upgrade its graphics and pass it off as completely new when in fact, it\'s not really new at all, but you\'d know this if you\'ve played FFVI. Just face it, FFVII made RPG\'s mainstream, but as far as improving the overall genre, they did NOTHING that hasn\'t been done before with that game. At least FFVIII actually strayed from the typical formula that square was rehashing.
I dont think FF7 got some critics like "could be the best game ever" accidentally.
The first PS1 title to be called like that and the second after the N64\'s Super Mario64.
What does that have to do with revolutionizing the genre? FFVI got the same acclaim as did Chrono Trigger when they were released and some critics said the same about FFX. So because they liked the game a lot, it automatically means that the game was revolutionary? Please, come out from under a rock and play some other RPG\'s post FFVII and Pre FFVII and you\'ll see that a lot of the same crap they use today in games is no different than the stuff they used so many years ago. The genre now has more fans because of these games, nothing more. The gameplay is still 2D no matter how you look at it.
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My opinion on this is that FVII was simply an evolution of the RPG, an evolution which took place on the PSone, a 32-bit console...The first RPG to really do this. Then you add Sony\'s hype and you have what made FVII such a critical success. Let\'s face it, if Sony had not of hyped it, FVII would of went unknown the American gamers, much like all the great SNES RPG\'s did. Instead, Sony saw what FVII was and how the new improved graphics, great cinema\'s and story would sell and they hyped it. Therefor, FVII brought RPG\'s to the masses because of one main thing...HYPE.
Is that revolutionary? No. Could Sony of survived without FVII? Yep. Did it help them? Yes.
As for FVII influencing the RPG genre, I truly doubt that. Honestly what did it do? All it did was take the genre and throw some fresh paint on it, making it look a lot prettier than it was in the 16-bit days. Yes , the story was more mature than American and Uk gamers were use to , but Japanese gamers had seen that before.
I understand your love for FVII and the need to see it as a revolutionary game. I had the same problem with Resident Evil - a game which I thought was revolutionary, but it wasn\'t. If anything, Alone in the Dark was. Resident Evil just threw a fresh coat of paint on it and tried to improve on the previous formula. My point? Sometimes your love for a game can blind you. I know I have been there.
;)
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Well L-I-C.. with Resident Evil, what is it that doesn\'t make it revolutionary? (unless that term is too broad).
Alone in the Dark may have been the first real Survival Horror, but Resident Evil was the one that popularised the genre. Resident Evil was the one that revolutionised the Survival Horror genre. AitD may have innovated, and created, but it wasn\'t (directly) responsible for the mainstream popularity of the genre. RE was.
I also think that\'s what Unicron is trying to get across, in his own... sadistic way. ;) FF7 popularised RPG\'s to a western audience.
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I think we have different opinions of revolutionary. I see revolutionary as a new genre or something done that has never been done. Basically, I don\'t see much as revolutionary. I don\'t count popularizing a genre revolutionary....
I see Resident Evil a evolution of survival horror and AitD has the revoluationary title...Same with FVII...it was evolutionary.
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Originally posted by Ryu
You\'re mixing two arguements together as if they were one. I never mentioned crash in relation to final fantasy. I don\'t care about crash and that\'s why I didn\'t mention them. Leave crash to your arguements with LiC and Altered Beast, but don\'t respond to me as if I care about such frivilous things. My point was to show you that although FF7 may have been a good game, the only thing that changed about it were its graphics, but it\'s otherwise a rehashed FFVI. You didn\'t comment on whether you\'ve played FFVI before... have you, or perhaps did you play it *After* you played FFVII?
My confusion and my mistake.Yes I ve mixed 2 argumenst together.I apologise, and I know you are the last person to care about that kind of subjects.But lets say I havent mentioned crash or I ve mentioned it as an example of a great selling game what prooves FFVIII a revolution?The sales?I am only saying this because you mentioned FF8 sold more than 7.
FFVII is not an influential title on other RPG\'s. That\'s your own imagination talking. Square showed us that they can take the formula of FFVI, rename it, rewrite it, and then upgrade its graphics and pass it off as completely new when in fact, it\'s not really new at all, but you\'d know this if you\'ve played FFVI. Just face it, FFVII made RPG\'s mainstream, but as far as improving the overall genre, they did NOTHING that hasn\'t been done before with that game. At least FFVIII actually strayed from the typical formula that square was rehashing.
Developers out of japan have been trying to compete the success and greatness of FF7.RPG interest and development spread even more outside Japan.FF7 may not have been revolutionary for the genre.For a PS1 title it was.No other game has showed so much for the PS1 then.I didnt say anywhere that FF revolutionised the genre.
BTW:FFVIII was the first westernised FF.I cant see anything especially new beyond that.
What does that have to do with revolutionizing the genre? FFVI got the same acclaim as did Chrono Trigger when they were released and some critics said the same about FFX. So because they liked the game a lot, it automatically means that the game was revolutionary? Please, come out from under a rock and play some other RPG\'s post FFVII and Pre FFVII and you\'ll see that a lot of the same crap they use today in games is no different than the stuff they used so many years ago. The genre now has more fans because of these games, nothing more. The gameplay is still 2D no matter how you look at it. [/B]
It has nothing to do with it because it is not what I ve been trying to say all the time.I am not saying it revolutionised the genre. It was a revolution as a PS1 game.Thats what I ve been trying to say.
BTW: I do play other RPG\'s.
They ve said the same thing about FFX?That surprises me.
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Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
I think we have different opinions of revolutionary. I see revolutionary as a new genre or something done that has never been done. Basically, I don\'t see much as revolutionary. I don\'t count popularizing a genre revolutionary....
I see Resident Evil a evolution of survival horror and AitD has the revoluationary title...Same with FVII...it was evolutionary.
Well, I was thinking along the lines of a revolutionary title is one that causes a revolution.
You were obviously thinking of one that breaks the mould.
;)
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I had the same problem with Resident Evil - a game which I thought was revolutionary, but it wasn\'t. If anything, Alone in the Dark was. Resident Evil just threw a fresh coat of paint on it and tried to improve on the previous formula. My point? Sometimes your love for a game can blind you. - L.I.C
*Sigh* Finally someone could take their blinders off and see what I\'ve been yelling about all this time... and a Capcom fanboy no less. ;) Seriously, the only things scary about those two games is just how similar they are to each other. I\'m almost surprised Infogames didn\'t slap Capcom with a lawsuit when RE1 released.
Considering just how much RE obviously draws from AitD, it makes you wonder if there even WOULD be an RE if it wasn\'t for AitD. Wouldn\'t that make AitD revolutionary Bob.. since it sparked the game which you consider the revolution?
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Indirectly it is.
Had Resident Evil not been made, the survival horror genre would not have taken off for years, if ever. Alone in the Dark may have been the inspiration for RE, but it was RE that caused all the hub-bub.
Meh.. who cares :)
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I think the problem here is the confusion or personal opinion on what "revolution" means. Bobby has a different meaning of it, than we do Sonyfan.
As for this comment...
*Sigh* Finally someone could take their blinders off and see what I\'ve been yelling about all this time... and a Capcom fanboy no less
:D
I\'m not a "fanboy", I\'m a Capcom whore . There\'s a difference. Fanboys don\'t see the light and can\'t see the bad in a given companies products , I can and do often. I just prefer Capcom products over any other company ....:D
Don\'t confuse my genre, damnit!!
;)
Honestly though, I realize that RE was not a revolution - it was an evolution of AiTD. It only brought survival horror to the mainstream (which is a big task - and shouldn\'t be downplayed). Street Fighter 2 on the other hand, that was a revolution, in my humble opinion.
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I\'m not a "fanboy", I\'m a Capcom whore . There\'s a difference. Fanboys don\'t see the light and can\'t see the bad in a given companies products , I can and do often
Hmm..
Originally posted by Living-In-Clip:
I beat Mickey\'s Magical Mirror and I can safely say....it isn\'t that bad
End of story.
;)
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Hmm... LiC started this thread and he hasn\'t posted his thoughts... What a bastard. ;)
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Most amazing Techincal Achievement
Metal Gear Solid 2: I don\'t think any video game wowed us more then MGS2 did
Best Story
Final Fantasy 7: Alot of twists and turns, happy moments, sad moments its all here.
Best character design
The Bouncer
Greatest franchise
Final Fantasy
Best game design
Final Fantasy 7: The game had no weakness. The only game I\'ve ever played with no weakness.
Most important Company
EA
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Damnit, Ryu!
Tehincal Acheivement.
Shenmue.
Best Story
I would like to say Shenmue, due to the expansive depth of the series - but we don\'t know the full story and may never know it ...so....
Zelda: A Link to the Past.
It was simple, yet engrossing. That\'s the best story for me.
Best Character Design
CastleVania ... Alucard was amazing and the different ways they can make Dracula look just blows my mind, for some reason. Not to mention the bosses . ;)
Greatest Franchise
As much as I wanna say Street Fighter, I can\'t.... For one reason, at one time Nintendo\'s own Mario was more well known than even Mickey Mouse.
For this, I give it to Mario.
Best Game Design
CastleVania: Sotn .
It took the best parts of Super Metriod, added to them and then took great artwork, character design and sound to become one of the greatest games ever.
Most IMportant Company
Capcom!
:)