PSX5Central
Non Gaming Discussions => Off-Topic => Topic started by: Samwise on November 12, 2003, 07:27:13 AM
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Ever feel like life\'s a rotten piece of mundane sh1t? Me neither... :eek:
Come on guys, I feel like some intellectual discussion. Morons need not apply. ;)
What\'s the point of living? Working your ass off so you can buy more crap, bigger things you don\'t need anyway? Is it suffering a lifetime so you can be a saint in heaven for eternity? Is it getting up every day, going to work, coming home spending the last hours of the day in front of the TV-altar where you don\'t need to think for yourself? Do you even think about this when walking around doing your daily routines like a zombie?
In other words - what makes you tick?
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two words, franz kafka
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you live for franz kafka? :eek:
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Q: what makes you tick?
A: Beer :) oh and Jack De\'s and coke
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Originally posted by ooseven
Q: what makes you tick?
A: Beer :) oh and Jack De\'s and coke
Everyday, I wonder if my mom had triplets and sent one to Scotland....
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I\'ve said it before and I\'ll say it again. There is no point to living. We are simply animals, our only true purpose is to breed and make sure the species continues. The rest is overly complicated by the rules forced upon us by society.
What makes rape and murder wrong? The goverment. The religions. Our most basic instinct is to do both of those things. Take what we want. Survival of the fittest and so on. Our supposed "high intelligence" has only complicated life. Gave us religion. Made us try to find a purpose - when there isn\'t one.
Work. Religion. Marriage. All these things are incidental and not our nature. We as people need to accept that what is "evil" may be natrual. That the rapist, the murders, the theives are our most basic instinct. What we would all be, if it was not for the rules , the regulations forced upon us from our birth. We as people need to realize that there may not be anything after this. Most likely there isn\'t. There is nothing special about us.
Personally, I\'m amazed by the blind faith people have. That the people need, just to make it through the day. They trust in \'God\' , for all the "bad" things that happen. They trust the goverment to make life altering desicions for them, while they go to work and pay taxes. It\'s amazing, through out all our curiousty, that has inspired us to go to space, invent the internet, the most basic thing, to question \'God\' and the goverment is something most people can\'t and will never be able to do.
*see signature*
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Originally posted by politiepet
you live for franz kafka? :eek:
Well, he was mighty attractive. ;)
*applauds LIC for contributing* (*and makes evil eyes at the rest of you* :p)
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Life is just dream ........................................................
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It amazes me how many people still spam this thread - after it was put that Sammy wanted an intelligent thread. Have some respect people. If you have nothing to post on the topic, then don\'t post.
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I believe in what George Burns said in "Oh God!"
Life is as meaningful as we human beings think it is. If we believe that our only purpose is to work, consume, defecate, and watch television, then that is what our meaning is.
If we believe that we can live a more meaningful life and attain greater enlightenment, then that is available to us also.
Just because a meaningful life isn\'t presented to you on your birthday doesn\'t mean you can\'t go out and find one for yourself.
By the way, my "most basic instinct" is not to rape and murder. But that\'s just me, and I\'m glad you live somewhere else, L-I-C. :)
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Originally posted by Coredweller
By the way, my "most basic instinct" is not to rape and murder. But that\'s just me, and I\'m glad you live somewhere else, L-I-C. :)
Why isn\'t it? Because that is what we are told from the very start? If you take someone, who was never taught it was wrong - then they won\'t view it as wrong. Our basic instinct isn\'t surpressed by the rules and regulations put down by the religious and goverment authorites.
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Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
Why isn\'t it? Because that is what we are told from the very start? If you take someone, who was never taught it was wrong - then they won\'t view it as wrong. Our basic instinct isn\'t surpressed by the rules and regulations put down by the religious and goverment authorites.
The prohibitions against rape and murder are not just enforced by religious and government authorities. Humans are social animals, just like gorillas and dolphins. We receive our training to discourage rape and murder from our social group, however large or small that may be. It starts with our parents, siblings, other children, teachers, and extends from there. The Pope and Uncle Sam are not the first ones telling us not to rape and murder. Furthermore, even if we lived in an anarchic state with no religion, our social upbringing would still discourage these behaviors.
You\'re comparing our current state to that of a human being raised in the wild with no social training whatsoever. It\'s true that such a person may have no knowledge that rape and murder is wrong, but that is a very rare circumstance, and it\'s not the normal or natural state for a human being to exist in.
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I definately don\'t think i\'d murder or rape people if there were no rules against it, it\'s not in my nature. You say marriage is unnatural, then why are there several species of animals on this planet that are monagoumous (sp?) for life?
I am one to question the government as I don\'t trust the government to do anything in the general populations best interest. Government is only out to get their hands on everything and controll every aspect of our lives.
What gets me through the day is coming home to my wife to hear how her day was and the love and interaction we have together. When we can finally put the cares of the day behind us for a short time.
Love is what gets me through my daily routine. I think we are on this planet to love each other... and as far as I can tell most people don\'t think the way I do.
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Well LIC, you made some good points. But what is true nature? wouldn\'t it be our true nature, not to be "naturual" ?
I mean, perhaps destorying the planet, forming morals etc is our nature. Your just judging us against animals in general, but we are unique. We have deeper emotions then instinct.
So anyways, I think the point of life is to be a good person. But besides that, ultimate understanding is a nice goal too...
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Originally posted by JBean
I definately don\'t think i\'d murder or rape people if there were no rules against it
actually...you would....it\'s hard to understand/explain, but the only reason you don\'t is because these rules excist....you \'made\' those rules as truth by accepting them.....if they were never made, you wouldn\'t obey them, eventhough you think now, that you would....
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hell... i\'d rape away
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not me
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My personal philosophy on life:
We are animals like LIC said to do nothing but reproduce. But since we are so advanced, we invent these "feelings" like love which leads to marriage. In primitive times, man never loved, they just mated but as humans became so advanced mentally, that all changed.
I feel that man invented religion to better a terrible situation and to make them feel that all this suffering will one day lead to salvation (ok, I\'m talking about Christianity at the Roman times as an example). Then it boomed during the Dark Ages because times were terrible and it gave people hope that they\'ll find salvation after a long hard life. This is why religion has grown so far and I feel doesn\'t really have much of a place in modern times. If you chose to believe, thats you but I chose not to follow any religion.
Religion is used as a weapon now and I think its more powerful than any nuclear bomb or rifle in any arsenal. Governments use it as a tool to get people to stay away from crime. Terrorists and fanatics use it as a reason to get into wars and claim to have a purpose (grr, I just had good ideas but they can\'t seem to make it to my fingers to type :rpissed: ). Infact, in Russia post Russian Revolution era, it was encouraged by Stalin. Why? He used it to keep people in line and to let them forget about the terrible conditions. It also can be used by certain ethnic groups as a reason to invade countries or send missionaries (which I feel missionaries should leave people alone). If I think of better examples, I\'ll post them. I seriously have them :)
Now my philosophy on life. I say in modern times to live life to its fullest. Go out, get drunk, have a threesome or a foursome, enjoy life. You only have one life and its been my philosophy to live it to its fullest. My greatest fear used to be that I will look back on my life and feel I wasted it.
We are here on this earth as animals. Our mission is the same as all other animals. Eat, crap, grow and make more annoying little humans to repopulate the world with. We are just animals but really advanced animals.
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i just try to make my sefhappy , by beng i company of frinds, doing things i find fun, money is not the most important thing to me, i know peep say without money, your not happy, but the hapiest time of my life was wheni had no job.. and i was just out skating all the time
skatig make me happy, about the onlything that stays certain in my life
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As far as the whole raping thing goes, I think I would find it a major turn off if the girl I was trying to get on was all "NO NO NO STOP PLEASE STOP"! and fighting to get away from me.
And as far as my outlook on life... well, I do agree wiht LIC that we are just animals, and we reproduce. I accept that but as long as I\'m here, I\'m going to try to enjoy myself, even if it is worthless:)
P.S. I don\'t ever enjoy anything.
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Hmm, I believe their was a topic similiar to this.
Personally; I think we will never know why we are meant to live. It is something that we will try to grasp- but it is always out of reach. We will never know why, how, and everything else. It just is how it is.
Personally I live each day as any other day, I never plan ahead (Unless its really urgent, Trips, Weed, etc.), and live every second at a time.
In other words; Just live, and live how you want.
I also think every once and a while that our life is predetermined. Their is no way of proving it isnt- I could say I would drink a soda, but not drink a soda- but it could be planned.
Like I said, I am just going to live my life, and live it till the end.
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I live for understanding. I just want to know.
Its hard to explain but it all makes total sense in my head.
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Hah... You see these questions on life and such never plague my mind or drive me crazy cuz it all clicks perfectly.. Faith is such a wonderful thing.
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^^^How does it click perfectly?
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Because like you, it makes sense for me as well.
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To answer you question honestly LIC:
To see what happens tommorrow.
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Another one of my philosophies. The meaning of life is your definition. If you think the meaning of life is living life to the fullest, thats the meaning of life. If the meaning of life is to serve God, that is your meaning of life. Its your own personal feelings on life. My meaning? Live life to the fullest and enjoy myself.
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Originally posted by SwifDi
Faith is such a wonderful thing.
As are lies.
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Originally posted by SwifDi
Hah... You see these questions on life and such never plague my mind or drive me crazy cuz it all clicks perfectly.. Faith is such a wonderful thing.
I have no faith and I think that thinking about the meaning of life without God is a wonderful thing.
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Originally posted by Luke
As far as the whole raping thing goes, I think I would find it a major turn off if the girl I was trying to get on was all "NO NO NO STOP PLEASE STOP"! and fighting to get away from me.
And as far as my outlook on life... well, I do agree wiht LIC that we are just animals, and we reproduce. I accept that but as long as I\'m here, I\'m going to try to enjoy myself, even if it is worthless:)
P.S. I don\'t ever enjoy anything.
i live to to make luke\'s life a living hell by constantly reminding him that he is a homosexual
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Originally posted by SwifDi
Hah... You see these questions on life and such never plague my mind or drive me crazy cuz it all clicks perfectly.. Faith is such a wonderful thing.
Ignorance is bliss, I guess whatever works if you\'re happy.
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Originally posted by SwifDi
Hah... You see these questions on life and such never plague my mind or drive me crazy cuz it all clicks perfectly.. Faith is such a wonderful thing.
I don\'t really see how religion helps in this situation... is it because you "know" you\'ll be in heaven when you die? Because you\'d still have a whole life ahead of you, where you \'have to\' do stuff. Would be kinda boring to just do nothing but jack off every day til you\'re 80.
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*buzz* Wrong.
I don\'t know I\'ll be in heaven, I just know that there is a possibility of more after this life is over. I don\'t "have to do" anything. Like I said, actually step inside a church and educate yourself. You guys are just going off hearsay which you pickup from fellow atheists.
And with faith, I can never worry or become befuddled with question marks dancing in my head. It\'s not ignorance, it\'s self-assurance!
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Originally posted by SwifDi
*buzz* Wrong.
I don\'t know I\'ll be in heaven, I just know that there is a possibility of more after this life is over. I don\'t "have to do" anything. Like I said, actually step inside a church and educate yourself. You guys are just going off hearsay which you pickup from fellow atheists.
And with faith, I can never worry or become befuddled with question marks dancing in my head. It\'s not ignorance, it\'s self-assurance!
You misunderstood me little fellow. I\'ve read the bible btw, don\'t think I\'m on a crusade (hah, get it) against religion. I\'m not even an atheist, I\'m agnostic.
When I said "know" (notice the "") I meant as in you think it\'s a possibility. But I was just curious as to in what way your faith makes your earthly life so easy... you just run on auto pilot thinking "it\'s God\'s will"? That\'s what I was interested in hearing about.
And btw, when I said \'have to\' do stuff I mean like everybody else. You can choose not to do anything with your life, religous or not. But that\'s not very fun as I said above.
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I went to church every sunday for 15 years and went to classes every wednesday for 5 years also. I\'m not completely ignorant like some. I saw what it entails and now have been able to make my own choice.
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Let me rephrase my question for you Freestylah. I wanted to know how your religion helps you in deciding what to do with your life.
I think you might be influenced by your age. When I was your age I didn\'t care/think about the future either... You go to school, hang out with your friends and so on, and that takes up the better part of your life. When you get older though you tend to think more about what you wanna do with your life. Even the most religious people would \'have to\' do something with their lives (or choose not to, if they\'re section 8).
Understand me now?
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Originally posted by Samwise
Ever feel like life\'s a rotten piece of mundane sh1t? Me neither... :eek:
Come on guys, I feel like some intellectual discussion. Morons need not apply. ;)
What\'s the point of living? Working your ass off so you can buy more crap, bigger things you don\'t need anyway? Is it suffering a lifetime so you can be a saint in heaven for eternity? Is it getting up every day, going to work, coming home spending the last hours of the day in front of the TV-altar where you don\'t need to think for yourself? Do you even think about this when walking around doing your daily routines like a zombie?
In other words - what makes you tick?
I had no idea what this thread was about, title is a bit vague;)
What is the point of living. Answer: To live.
Your life as it is right now is a result of the experience you have. The key to making it all work is to see it as something you can work with.
I keep going back to this only because it makes so much sense. Things are as they are as they will be. You can either choose to embrace it or fight it. I think it goes without saying that you will be in an eternal struggle if you fight it and that just isn\'t fun.
Take all that which you are and make it work. Dwell on that which you are not and EVERYTHING becomes a struggle.
Happiness can not be found in material things, they can not love back. You can love what you do by loving who you are, it\'s entirely satisfying. The end result is only as satisfying as the experience to get there.
Myself...I do believe in a higher power. As I said in another thread there is something that naturally drives you forward, it is your ability that you were given that you will only be able to see once you stop looking for it.
If it is natural, that which you are, your life will unfold as it was meant to...even if it does seem a bit odd at times.
Live it and learn.
So what did you do today? I lived and it was fun:)
EDIT: Just to hit on another subject. Fighting for what you believe in is not the way to go. It leads to oppresion and segregation...where we are now.
I don\'t understand why we can\'t leave well enough alone? If you indeed are meant to follow God or whatever higher power you believe in then you will naturally do so as it was meant.
To inflict your beliefs on someone else does nothing more than satisfy your ego. That\'s sin as I understand it.
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Originally posted by Ginko
Just to hit on another subject. Fighting for what you believe in is not the way to go. It leads to oppresion and segregation...where we are now.
I don\'t understand why we can\'t leave well enough alone? If you indeed are meant to follow God or whatever higher power you believe in then you will naturally do so as it was meant.
To inflict your beliefs on someone else does nothing more than satisfy your ego. That\'s sin as I understand it.
Very interesting statement. I can\'t say that I agree. In fact, I totally disagree.
What if it is your beliefs that are being oppressed? I don\'t see how "leaving well enough alone" is beneficial to anyone but the oppressor. If fighting for the right TO believe does nothing more than satisfy your ego why believe at all? Does that mean believing(or wanting to belive), by itself, is indirectly a sin?
BTW, I\'m talking about beliefs in general not just religious beliefs.
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Originally posted by Black Samurai
Very interesting statement. I can\'t say that I agree. In fact, I totally disagree.
What if it is your beliefs that are being oppressed? I don\'t see how "leaving well enough alone" is beneficial to anyone but the oppressor. If fighting for the right TO believe does nothing more than satisfy your ego why believe at all? Does that mean believing(or wanting to belive), by itself, is indirectly a sin?
BTW, I\'m talking about beliefs in general not just religious beliefs.
Then you will forever be in the struggle. You are by choice making yourself a victim.
The oppresors are those who think they know best for everyone else, through some power they are able to influence.
Leaving well enough alone would mean you wouldn\'t inflict yourself(beliefs) upon others. <--- No oppression would be the result if everyone did this. I realize this is not the case but you are making it no better by participating in it.
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How is fighting for your beliefs equal to inflicting your beliefs on others?
Maybe its just semantics but I don\'t see how fighting for what you believe in is bad. Are you saying that it is better to just "believe" by itself than to fight for those beliefs?
[EDIT] Now that I think about it. I do see how the two could be equated.
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Are you saying that it is better to just "believe" by itself than to fight for those beliefs?
:)
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What about acting on your beliefs?
Where does that fit in?
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If you truly believe you will act on them without effort...Do without doing.
Yield to that around you and life becomes so much easier...you become a part of it. You will naturally carry out that which was meant to be because that is what you do, that is who you are.
I can\'t think of any religion that tells you to fight one another for your beliefs.
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Originally posted by Ginko
If you truly believe you will act on them without effort...Do without doing.
What if you believe in fighting for your beliefs?
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Then you will oppress. You throw yourself back in to a struggle.
^How can anyone be happy when their lives are about struggle?
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Are you not in a struggle if you are BEING oppressed?
If the only way to get out of a struggle(and be happy) is to fight off your oppressors then you are doing the right thing, no?
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Say you have two opposing forces. Those forces will continue to fight until one goes down or worse they both go down (die). That is struggle and it accomplishes nothing. Egos are the start of it and unfortunately someone\'s ego is going to get bruised and they will act on that...it leads to awful things. You can trace every single event of oppression to the human ego...
By yielding, that opposing force all of a sudden loses purpose or tires out. There\'s nothing to fight. It just is.
EDIT: I realize that is not the case for some people. I find myself very fortunate.
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Originally posted by Ginko
You can trace every single event of oppression to the human ego...
By yielding, that opposing force all of a sudden loses purpose or tires out. There\'s nothing to fight. It just is.
If the oppression is driven by ego, in the first place, why would they lose purpose? The purpose is to stroke their ego, correct? So wouldn\'t yielding only serve to make things worse?
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Heh, you are making this harder than it is.
You are lending to that purpose by fighting it.
I\'ll use an example from The Tao of Pooh.
Imagine a cork in some water, naturally the cork floats as that\'s what it does. You don\'t want the cork to float so you try to push it to the bottom...but wait a minute, it comes back up. What the hell? I want you to stay down! You can try all you want by that cork is going to come up...you end up losing and wasting your time. You became a victim of your own ego wanting to change that around you instead of taking it for what it is.
When a whole group of the above get together the results can be and have been disasterous.
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Originally posted by Ginko
Imagine a cork in some water, naturally the cork floats as that\'s what it does. You don\'t want the cork to float so you try to push it to the bottom...but wait a minute, it comes back up. What the hell? I want you to stay down! You can try all you want by that cork is going to come up...you end up losing and wasting your time. You became a victim of your own ego wanting to change that around you instead of taking it for what it is.
Yes but the cork is not yielding to the push. Even when you push the cork down it is still pushing back up. You are just more powerful. Its the fact that the cork keeps pushing to the top that frustrates you. If the cork just yielded to your push it would sink to the bottom and never rise up.
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But it will never sink to the bottom because that\'s not its\' nature.
The example is to merely illustrate that things are as they are and it is us who try to change them for our own use to satisfy our wants. Just as we try to change the people around us to satisfy what we perceive to be right and wrong. It will be a never ending struggle and you will never truly be happy.
You wouldn\'t get frustrated if you just accepted things are as they are.
It feels as if I\'ve gone around in a circle several times.
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Originally posted by Ginko
But it will never sink to the bottom because that\'s not its\' nature.
Exactly, its not in its nature to yield to the push. Its nature is to push BACK and rise to the top.
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No, we are the only ones pushing. The cork just is.
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Hmm, maybe we should suggest "The Tao of Pooh" to Black Samurai. If you are interested Black Samurai, I really suggest you check it out, Ginko\'s entire argument is based partially upon this book, it has changed my life.
Exactly, its not in its nature to yield to the push. Its nature is to push BACK and rise to the top.
Its nature is to be a cork, and nothing more. Everything has a point, and its point cannot exceed its limitations. It has no brain, theirfor it cannot think, it cannot want to push, or yield, it is just a cork. And asking "Why?" is trivial in the pursuit of knowledge, knowledge only confuses and muddles things.
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Wait. The cork is the oppressed and the hand is the oppressor, right?
Isn\'t that the symbolism you were going for?
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In a sense yes.
Our natures change with actions, I am now the "Typist", but if I were to stop typing, I wouldnt be the "Typist", I am "Human"
Its all very hard to describe in words, Its almost impossible.
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Originally posted by Black Samurai
Wait. The cork is the oppressed and the hand is the oppressor, right?
Isn\'t that the symbolism you were going for?
Like spudz said, in a way.
To do without doing you will naturally use that around you to your benefit rather than try to change it to what it simply won\'t be. Otherwise you will be in a constant struggle against the way things just are.
People try to change the way things are instead of using them to their benefit. Much like the cork, that is just a life time fight right there. You\'ll eventually go down and the cork will still just be.:cool:
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Originally posted by Samwise
Let me rephrase my question for you Freestylah. I wanted to know how your religion helps you in deciding what to do with your life.
I think you might be influenced by your age. When I was your age I didn\'t care/think about the future either... You go to school, hang out with your friends and so on, and that takes up the better part of your life. When you get older though you tend to think more about what you wanna do with your life. Even the most religious people would \'have to\' do something with their lives (or choose not to, if they\'re section 8).
Understand me now?
Religion doesn\'t control me, God does. I live accordingly, and go about my way, in the meanwhile trying to bring glory to him and try and share him with others as much as possible.
I\'m 17 years old, and believe me the future is on my mind constantly. I\'m not as feeble-minded as you may think. However I do not worry because regardless of what happens, I know that things work out.
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Religion doesn\'t control me, God does.
No one can control another human being, only be an influence.
Sometimes I wonder about my future as well, the only thing promising is my band- when we practice together I know we have the skill, and determination. But I also know its almost futile to think we will be come popular, or release a big time CD.
I\'m 17 years old, and believe me the future is on my mind constantly.
In defense of SwifDi: At 17 years of age, a man can make up his mind. At 10 years of age a child can choose his path, its wisdom. Wisdom does not always come with age, it comes with experience. Age usually comes in hand with experience.
I also worry about some of my point of views; I am trying my best not to contradict myself, but human existance is a questionable state of mind. I do ask "Why?", but when I really start to think about it I just sit and relax and write music- Its human instinct to ask questions, but we can control it to a degree.
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Ummm....last thing i read was about humans true nature and i just stopped reading so ill start off from there.
I don\'t beleive that true nature exists in humans. We have a conciouse which allows us to make our own decisions even if others would not make that decision.
Humans are unique because animals have instincts that they react to certain situations in the same way. Two different humans can be faced with the same situation and do 2 totally different things.
Every human is different and has his or her own thoughts. That is what seperates us from animals. Intelligence lets hus not have a nature, we can\'t have a nature while having a concious.
The only time someone may show any type of human nature is when you must compete for survival. The only thing that might show that humans dont have a nature in that situation is that different humans can come uo with different ways to survive.
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Every human is different and has his or her own thoughts.
Can you explain where those thoughts come from and why they are unique to each individual?
The only time someone may show any type of human nature is when you must compete for survival. The only thing that might show that humans dont have a nature in that situation is that different humans can come uo with different ways to survive.
You must eat, you must sleep, you must take a shit. You are natural...tell me when you rise above that.
Then to address the rest of your post I will ask you..."What makes you tick?" as Samwise put it. Can you explain what it is that makes you compelled to do what you do?
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You must eat, you must sleep, you must take a shit. You are natural...tell me when you rise above that.
I believe he is talking about more shallow things; such as picking the color of your shoelaces.
Just wanted to point that out for you.
My one point on your post cloud345;
You say we are smarter than animals, personally, I have a very contraversal opinion on this, which may lead to some flaming and name calling; but let it be.
Basically, if anyone would want more clarification;
Animals could be more advanced, intellictually than humans. I mean they do nothing, and live their lifes content and happy. They dont need inventions to live their life, they adapt themselves.
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I believe he is talking about more shallow things; such as picking the color of your shoelaces.
That much I figured but I was waiting for a response of his that I\'m pretty certain will be.
I\'ll go ahead and make my point though.
Can you explain what it is that makes you compelled to do what you do?
Nope. You can\'t explain why people get their best ideas when they are not thinking about it or why they are able to think the way they do. They just do. Like everything around you it\'s as simple as is just is. In other words, that which we have labeled nature. You are part of it.
"I think, therefore I am confused."
We are creatures of action/reaction from which you obtain habit. That is why we you are doing something familiar you don\'t even think about it...you aren\'t making any choices whatsoever, you just do what you do and it gets done.
I believe we waste much of our brain capacity on the trivial things. I\'ll quote directly from The Tao of Pooh:
"Gathering, analyzing, sorting, and storing information-these functions and more the mind can perform so automatically, skillfully, and effortlessly that is makes the most sophisticated computer look like a plastic toy by comparison. But it can do infinitely more. To use the mind as it\'s all too commonly used, on the kinds of things that it\'s usually used on, is about as efficient as using a magic sword to open a can of beans. The power of the clear mind is beyond description. But it can be obtained by anyone who can appreciate and utilize the value of Nothing."
On the animal thing...IMHO, we are not superior to them. They live on nature alone as they utilize that around them without even thinking about it. They just do.
Apart from them we are able to build artificial homes, pollute the air, and act on our egos...superior? Can you say that any of those have helped us come closer to understanding ourselves?
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Originally posted by Spudz
Animals could be more advanced, intellictually than humans. I mean they do nothing, and live their lifes content and happy. They dont need inventions to live their life, they adapt themselves.
I won\'t flame you for this. I wouldn\'t doubt if thats true either. What if chimps don\'t want to be more advanced because it could lead to problems? Through evolution, smart animals like octopuses (intelligence of a 3 year old), chimps or even parrots could become more intelligent than humans were 1000 years ago. But we evolved so far that we might not be able to be surpassed at this point.
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Chimps don\'t have a conscious and can\'t act on it...as long as they don\'t have one there will be no problems. They will just do what they do.
I wouldn\'t doubt if animals could become better problem solvers, they can experience and learn just as we can. Their perception is still limited to what is just is though.
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Its been proven chimps have the intelligence of a 5 year old. I think certain mammals have feelings, all can think (but different levels. Ex, a fly. it can only decide where to go, nothing else. Same with all other bugs. Chimps can form letters, fit blocks and other complex thinking), and can solve some problems.
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Right, that\'s what I was saying. They are simply learning and adapting.
I didn\'t know about the feelings though...what kind of feelings?
^I\'m more or less talking about ego, do they have one?
Why I hope they don\'t have one. (http://www.kachina.net/~alunajoy/99nov.html)
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Coco the gorilla proved that animals have feelings. Her cat died and through sign language, she told her trainer she felt sad. It\'s also proven that elephants have feelings when one of their own die. Infact, elephants "bury" their dead (sort of, they put grasses and mud on them). Well, one elephant was shot in this village (wandered into a garden). This is where it gets fuzzy for me (gotta look back in my world cultures notes, lol). The villagers burned and threw the elephants remains in a dump. One elephant took one of the bones of the elephant and put it back into the garden. It baffled people and scientists. Just one example of animal thinking and feelings and intelligence.
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Originally posted by Ginko
Right, that\'s what I was saying. They are simply learning and adapting.
I didn\'t know about the feelings though...what kind of feelings?
^I\'m more or less talking about ego, do they have one?
Why I hope they don\'t have one. (http://www.kachina.net/~alunajoy/99nov.html)
Ha, I have to agree with you there about ego. Just what we need, more things out there thinking they\'re perfect. Humans already do a perfect job at that.Originally posted by Ginko
I wouldn\'t doubt if animals could become better problem solvers, they can experience and learn just as we can. Their perception is still limited to what is just is though.
I have to agree with you 100% there. Their brains may evolve within millions of years but their perception will still be limited.
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Okay...I don\'t see any evidence of egotistical behavior there. Just grieving...
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I wasn\'t saying it was ego. I agree with you about the ego, they aren\'t developed enough to have an ego. I was just saying that they have feelings and can think and do some basic problem solving problems.
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Hmm I dont think you understood me Titan, or anyone else.
I believe it is possible that animals, the simple living creatures they are are actually more sophisticated, more advanced in a way.
They do not need to build stuff, create stuff to live. They dont need math, they dont need government, they dont need rules/laws. They live like they should, and I think humans have ruined that. Their is no way we can go b ack into a state like that.
Im saying is, their simplicity overminds our technology- if that makes sense to anyone. They dont need to prove they are smarter than us, because they know they are.
:laughing: I am very skeptic that it is possible, but hell- their is always a chance.
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Sorry, Titan. I didn\'t mean that you did...just came across wrong.
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Its ok Ginko, you are forgiven :D I see where you are coming from though.
Spudz, I see where you too are coming from now. Thanks for clearing that up. Spudz, you have a pretty interesting idea though.
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Spudz, I see where you too are coming from now. Thanks for clearing that up. Spudz, you have a pretty interesting idea though.
Yes, I talked to some of my family members about some of my theories on life. They are all the "Brady Bunch" Catholics, with their fancy jobs and everything.
Im the odd child in the family. I am kicked out of family dinners if I dont wear something to their standards. I am not allowed to some family weddings because they think I will crash it. They dont allow me to go to family reunions either, and If I do go; Im basically shunned.
Basically; Im the kid no one likes, it takes its toll. But I just think they are ignorant and afraid of something different.
Like now I have really long hair, and am just this drummer punk. Everyone is afraid of me- :laughing:
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Oi, I go outta town for a few days and the topic explodes (thanks Ginko ;)).
BTW, I checked out if the local library had "The Tao of Pooh" (they do) - but suddenly I realised what the \'Pooh\' part was about... it\'s a children\'s book?! Not saying it\'s not good then, but I\'m not going to the kids section of the library to check it out. ;)
I\'ve read about taoism before though and feel compelled to read even more about it now, thanks to Ginko and his praise. :D
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Yes, it is Winnie the Pooh.
Samwise - if your going to go in a child section of a library, make sure you keep your hands to yourself, alright?
I suggest you check it out, I suggested it to Ginko, and he apparently took a great liking to it.
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You\'re welcome, Sammy:D
Great liking?!? It has completely changed my outlook on life, and it\'s so freakin\' simple.
Well, I\'ve only read the one book on Taoism. Tao of Pooh is only 157 pages, very quick read (probably took me 3-4 hours total)...it just uses the characters of Winnie the Pooh to explain different types of life we live. It\'s basically the author describing Taoism then making the point using a character...it\'s very well done.
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Analogies is the word.
"That Tree is a giant"
Lol, I feel all warm and fuzzy inside. Like how I suggested the book, and changed your life completely. I dont want to take the credit, but I think its cool how just a suggestion can do that.
(BTW: I hope this doesnt turn into a book club forum :eek: )
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(BTW: I hope this doesnt turn into a book club forum )
Me neither, I still like my videogames!
I dont want to take the credit, but I think its cool how just a suggestion can do that.
You appreciate just helping:)
Hopefully Sammy will pick up the book soon and discuss...
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Yeah, I\'ll sneak into the kid section (although I\'m banned there ;)) and grab it up some time.
BTW, a book section of the forum doesn\'t sound all that bad. :) I just read a few books by Kurt Vonnegut this weekend. Cat\'s Cradle and Timequake (at least I think that\'s what it\'s called in English).
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Read "Breakfast of Champions" sammy. One of the weirdest things you\'ll ever read.
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Hmm, think mm even reads?
My favorite book:
Red Badge of Courage
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I just read(as in a month or two ago) The Republic by Plato.
Its a pretty good read.
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Anyone read:
Dot Con?
Its on the creation of the internet, very interesting.
I think we should have a book forum, for more intellectual posts.
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I\'m reading "How to win friends and influence people" now. It is required reading for a lot of business courses(according to my prof).
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Either that or you are just VERY antisocial Black Samurai :p
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Originally posted by Spudz
Anyone read:
Dot Con?
Its on the creation of the internet, very interesting.
I think we should have a book forum, for more intellectual posts.
That forum would have all of three posts. One about Pooh\'s taoism, one about your blooming internet book and another one about playboy. My point? It isn\'t going to happen. The interest and "intellectual" posts are not there.
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Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
The interest and "intellectual" posts are not there.
Why not? It\'s not all about ghey sex and riced up cars. I read a book or two a week and I\'m sure other people here do as well.
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Yes, I read books.
Probably one every month, and discuss it with some other people as well.
If your against it; well thats you. I am for it, although it may seem dry, why the hell not? Just replace it with the trading forum, that thing is bone dry.
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A reading forum?
*sigh*
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Yes, some of us can read SwifDi.
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Originally posted by Samwise
Why not? It\'s not all about ghey sex and riced up cars. I read a book or two a week and I\'m sure other people here do as well.
I\'m a firm believer if you want to talk DVD\'s - go to a DVD dedicated forum. Want to talk about books? Go to a book forum. Want to talk about cars? Go to a car forum. This is a videogame forum, for cryin\' out loud.
Maybe I should clarify the above statement. If you want to talk dedicated DVD\'s / Cars / Books, then you should go to a forum that is dedicated to those thing. Until then, why not just bring up the occasional subject in Off-Topic, like I do with DVD\'s and Racer does with cars? There simply is not enough interest in cars, movies or books to warrant their own forum and the last thing we need is another worthless forum (see: Trading / Hints and Tips and as of late Console Debating / Console Discussion).
It\'s not up to me though. Bring it up to MM in the suggestions forum. It\'s his or Ryu\'s choice.
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Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
I\'m a firm believer if you want to talk DVD\'s - go to a DVD dedicated forum. Want to talk about books? Go to a book forum. Want to talk about cars? Go to a car forum. This is a videogame forum, for cryin\' out loud.
Bingo. This man speaks the truth.
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Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
I\'m a firm believer if you want to talk DVD\'s - go to a DVD dedicated forum. Want to talk about books? Go to a book forum. Want to talk about cars? Go to a car forum. This is a videogame forum, for cryin\' out loud.
Maybe I should clarify the above statement. If you want to talk dedicated DVD\'s / Cars / Books, then you should go to a forum that is dedicated to those thing. Until then, why not just bring up the occasional subject in Off-Topic, like I do with DVD\'s and Racer does with cars? There simply is not enough interest in cars, movies or books to warrant their own forum and the last thing we need is another worthless forum (see: Trading / Hints and Tips and as of late Console Debating / Console Discussion).
It\'s not up to me though. Bring it up to MM in the suggestions forum. It\'s his or Ryu\'s choice.
Alrighty, I see your point.
But since this is a videogame forum, why do we have:
- Current Events and Political Debate
- PC Hardware/Software forum
- The Central Journals
Not that I mind...
PS. SwifDi you ghey spammer, no need to mock people who can read just for +1 posts.
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Originally posted by Samwise
Alrighty, I see your point.
But since this is a videogame forum, why do we have:
- Current Events and Political Debate
- PC Hardware/Software forum
- The Central Journals
Not that I mind...
PS. SwifDi you ghey spammer, no need to mock people who can read just for +1 posts.
Honestly, I don\'t know about the PC forum. I see no purpose for it.
Current Events was made when the war on Iraq was waged - and way to moderate the trolls..etc. I see no reason to keep it around now though.
As for the Central Journals - that was an idea with Ryu that I supported. It was an idea to cash in on the blogging craze and let members get to know each other better.
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The journals were cool but I\'m more or less a private guy when it comes to my feelings and no one cares what happens in my day so I don\'t post much. I am thinking about posting in it there. I think it would be cool to have a books forum. I mean, this may be a PS2 forum but as of right now, there is no PSX2Central. There is no site, just the forum. We should have our fun now before it comes back with multiplatform. Then there will be a lot of gamers coming to the boards and nothing but games again. This is just my 2 cents btw. I do see your point LIC though.
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My PS2 forced me to learn how to read.. She likes it when I read bedtime stories to her.
(https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fw1.480.telia.com%2F%7Eu48019256%2Fps2natti.jpg&hash=3deb73316aaa3fd7d7dd67aa93c389ba691cd5d2)
She prefers Donald Duck.
Honestly though, I read books (REALLY), but it takes some time because I tend to lose interest :P
Last book I finished was 1984, Im now reading All Quiet On The Western Front and "En tid för hjältar - A time for heroes"
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All Quiet on the Western Front was a terrific book. I loved it. Catcher in the Rye is my favorite followed by Breakfast of Champions, Enders Game and Fallen Angels.
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LOL Fastson. :D