PSX5Central
Non Gaming Discussions => Off-Topic => Topic started by: THX on February 04, 2004, 03:59:28 PM
-
Put aside the homophobia for a second and think about this. Who are we to say 2 people can\'t get married of the same sex. Gays have come a long way this past century in just about every aspect of life except maybe politics and marriage.
With all the US states creating more controversy over allowing a gay or lesbian couple to get married what do you think the outcome of it all will be in say, 50 years?
-
They have the right to live together as long as they dont corrupt others
-
"Corrupt?" Hmmm, nice way to start the thread. I can see there isn\'t going to be any hostility in THIS one. :(
-
You need a "I don\'t care" opinion
-
I dont care if they get married, and it will change.
Also; most religions in some form or fashion are against gay marriages correct? Its going to tear religions apart, and families.
-
sorry, figured those who didn\'t care wouldn\'t bother to open the thread, lol.
But if a mod is bored it would be nice to have the last option say, "Undecided/doesn\'t matter to me"
-
Originally posted by Unicron!
They have the right to live together as long as they dont corrupt others
Give me a break. Corrupt others? What the hell are you smoking? In no way does someone being homosexual corrupt others. It\'s not something that "spreads" or "infects" people.
And there, ya\' go THX.
I changed it for you.
-
Man this is sooooo heading down towards a religious road, but I\'m going to steer clear of that.
Here\'s my take... I don\'t care. However, I am against them having children. I will list my reasons if anybody cares.
-
^^^To what LIC said.
Agreed. Homosexuals only "corrupt" others if the others decide to turn gay. Unicron, are you afraid to turn gay if you see two gay people together?
*Gay= Two guys/Two girls
I think they should be allowed as long as they don\'t try to make any religion accept it as a fact. To the Government yes, to Religion no.
I think they should be allowed to adopt children, as long as they raise the child properly. If they pull the "I\'ll make sure to turn him gay" stuff on them then they shouln\'t. Other than that, I don\'t think a kid would be affected as much if they are raised by a homosexual couple.
-
Yup, I\'m with SirMystiq on that one.
-
Originally posted by Unicron!
They have the right to live together as long as they dont corrupt others
LIC, make that 3 ignorant people on the boards. Sorry but that is pretty stupid. Gays are not viruses. You don\'t catch gay when you talk to a gay guy. As for my opinion, I really don\'t care. If the government decides to allow gay marriages, fine; if they don\'t, fine. Its not going to affect me seeing as I\'m not gay.
-
OMG, I THINK I HAVE CAUGHT TEH GHEY.
:ghey:
-
Originally posted by SwifDi
Man this is sooooo heading down towards a religious road, but I\'m going to steer clear of that.
Here\'s my take... I don\'t care. However, I am against them having children. I will list my reasons if anybody cares.
I\'d like to see that list.
And I am very much for them having the same rights that any straight couple has. Marriage and everything else.
-
Originally posted by SirMystiq
^^^
Agreed. Homosexuals only "corrupt" others if the others decide to turn gay. Unicron, are you afraid to turn gay if you see two gay people together?
*Gay= Two guys/Two girls
I think they should be allowed as long as they don\'t try to make any religion accept it as a fact. To the Government yes, to Religion no.
An added note is that the goverment and religion are seperate. No one is asking for religion\'s to accept the fact, but by law, I see nothing wrong with two homosexuals being married. The only thing that keeps it from happening now is the fact that we haven\'t truly seperated the religious backgrounds from the goverment.
-
Crap... well you guys have forced it out of me.
First off I don\'t want to start a religious debate, but I am going to start off by saying I am a Christian. However I\'m not your typical Bible thumping Christian, I like to generalize and make exceptions for what my own divine intellect percieves as "right" and "wrong".
Homosexuality doesn\'t seem so evil to me. Love is love. I kind of bite my tongue when people at church discuss it and say things like, "so sick", "demented, "twisted".
So let them get married, why not? Is anybody losing money or being physically harmed by it? Not really.
Now the issue about children... I believe that it is vital to have a mother, as a nurturer. Can a male play this role? Highly doubtful. Aside from all the scientific nature involved, think about the child. Unquestionably he would live a life of harrassment for having gay parents. Unless you\'re in some gay Utopia society, the kid will undergo a very rough upbringing.
-
^^^
Yeah I know. But I\'m saying that if they win their rights, they shouln\'t try to force Religions to accept them.
And I agree, Separation of Church and State. That goes out for those Anti-Abortion people too.
-
Originally posted by SirMystiq
^^^
they shouln\'t try to force Religions to accept them.
Honestly, I think homosexuals couldn\'t care less about those "religions" that have ridiculed and persecuted them so much already.
-
Originally posted by SwifDi
Crap... well you guys have forced it out of me.
First off I don\'t want to start a religious debate, but I am going to start off by saying I am a Christian. However I\'m not your typical Bible thumping Christian, I like to generalize and make exceptions for what my own divine intellect percieves as "right" and "wrong".
Homosexuality doesn\'t seem so evil to me. Love is love. I kind of bite my tongue when people at church discuss it and say things like, "so sick", "demented, "twisted".
So let them get married, why not? Is anybody losing money or being physically harmed by it? Not really.
Now the issue about children... I believe that it is vital to have a mother, as a nurturer. Can a male play this role? Highly doubtful. Aside from all the scientific nature involved, think about the child. Unquestionably he would live a life of harrassment for having gay parents. Unless you\'re in some gay Utopia society, the kid will undergo a very rough upbringing.
Will you just SHUT UP? For God sake, I hate when you say something and I agree with it. Nothing annoys me more than that. :D
Seriously though, while I think two gay parents can provide a good stable home for a child, I think you also to take in account what the child would go through. Not only the questions that would come up, but the fact there are still a lot of bigots and hateful people, who would make life for the child hell. So, in that respect, I can\'t say I have a clear stance on the issue of them raising a child. It\'s not that I don\'t think they can do it, it\'s that I don\'t think it would be best for the child, due to the rest of the world\'s pressure\'s and ignorance.
-
Exactly, and whats sad is that there are a handful of gay couples that make much better parents than some of low-life parents around today.
-
Originally posted by SwifDi
Exactly, and whats sad is that there are a handful of gay couples that make much better parents than some of low-life parents around today.
Exactly, if anything I would say a lot of gay couples would be better than some of these straight couples, if nothing else, than for the fact they have to fight tooth and nail to get a child. Where as a straight couple can have them as an accident.
Sadly, that doesn\'t change the fact that when a kid goes to school and explains he has two dads / mom\'s, other kids are going to make fun of him.
-
Heres a song for ya:
If you follow the jaw line down over the heart,
the curves of your bone and muscle that make up your head to toe...
it\'s just skin and thread, stitches and ligaments,
words that we spoke only to regret.
I know they\'re going to laugh at us
when they see us out together "holding hands" like this.
They wouldn\'t understand it if we told them all the reasons,
not that I think this deserves any kind of explanation.
We can make it up so we\'ve got a smile painted on all the time,
no matter what it\'s like on the inside.
We\'ll kepp this, keep us like a secret,
because if my family and friends ever found out about the things we could never be,
haunts we\'ll all keep, so ****ing bittersweet.
Anyways, figure out what it\'s about if ya want, isn\'t too hard....
And on the subject, it is ridiculous that we need this thread. Sad sad fact about our society.....
Oh and Although I do believe in democracy, I do not believe that the majority should decide morals for the minority. It is control, it is imposing your beliefs on someone else, and it is supposdly for the security of society....
Most laws are absed on morals btw.
Edit: The song is "The Disco before the breakdown" by Against Me!
-
Originally posted by SwifDi
Aside from all the scientific nature involved, think about the child. Unquestionably he would live a life of harrassment for having gay parents. Unless you\'re in some gay Utopia society, the kid will undergo a very rough upbringing.
It\'s not as bad as you\'d think. There are a lot of understanding people out there...a lot more than non understanding people. Besides, it\'s not like a kid will go around displaying that he has gay parents. Generally it wouldn\'t even come up until the kid invites a friend or someone to his house, at which point if the kid is gonna be that much of an ass about it, they\'re not the best friend anyway.
Besides, I think that can be countered by what is almost a guarantee that the child will be brought up by parents that will preach tolerance and acceptance, which can only benefit a kid.
-
Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
Exactly, if anything I would say a lot of gay couples would be better than some of these straight couples, if nothing else, than for the fact they have to fight tooth and nail to get a child. Where as a straight couple can have them as an accident.
Sadly, that doesn\'t change the fact that when a kid goes to school and explains he has two dads / mom\'s, other kids are going to make fun of him.
That just shows how poorly we treat ourselves. I don\'t think that a gay couple would have a problem raising a child, but society might think so. Being made fun of doesn\'t mean the child is going to stop loving his parents. Whether they\'re gay or not a child grows up looking at them as "parents" and loves them. Kids make fun of kids all the time. Once the kid gets to highschool, people would be more understandable of his situation(most of the time), people develop a sense of "self defense". Like if somebody makes fun of your ...dog...eventually you would think " so what if they do, I love my dog" If the child is faced with physical abuse, then that\'s another problem that should be dealt with another way.
^^^Also, what Shockwaves said.
-
This is my opinion,if a kid grew up thinking it was normal to have two same sex parents it\'s got to have some impact on the kids lifestyle.
So I\'ll say no they shouldn\'t have kids.
Edit: Marriage is religious,so no there to.
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
This is my opinion,if a kid grew up thinking it was normal to have two same sex parents it\'s got to have some impact on the kids lifestyle.
So I\'ll say no they shouldn\'t have kids.
I have to disagree. Common sense will dictate, by nature that it is not "normal". Yes, the child will grow up more accepting of homosexuality, but I really don\'t think it will make a child gay or make a child want to be gay, but then again, I also believe homosexuality is actually somethin genetic. Why else would someone be attracted to the same sex? Why would someone want to suffer the abuse that a lot of homosexuals suffer through?
-
Last time I checked nobody can force a sexual preference on you. If anything gay parents have the understanding of being discriminated against to know not to force anything on the child.
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
This is my opinion,if a kid grew up thinking it was normal to have two same sex parents it\'s got to have some impact on the kids lifestyle.
So I\'ll say no they shouldn\'t have kids.
Edit: Marriage is religious,so no there to.
Marriage is not religious, we are talking about the matter of the state. Legal marriage, not relgious. Married people are looked at very differently under the law than single people.
And tell me, how would it affect someone\'s life style? If someone had gay parents, what might it do to them?
-
So you guys don\'t think it\'s a possability that after living with a gay couple,that it\'s not unnatural and have a good time with there same sex friend even though they aren\'t gay?
It\'s like doctors who see people cut open all the time.If me or you saw a person with there gut cut open would be like OMG, but the doctor who had seen it a hundred times would be like what can we do to fix it.
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
So you guys don\'t think it\'s a possability that after living with a gay couple,that it\'s not unnatural and have a good time with there same sex friend even though they aren\'t gay?
No, I don\'t think that at all. Tell me, if you lived with a gay couple for a while, would you suddenly want to be gay?
-
So b/c you have gay parents...You will never look at somebody of the same sex as just a "friend"? That\'s pretty...weird.
The kid will eventually know how things work, If his parents raise to knowing that they are gay b/c*bla bla bla* then the kid wouln\'t have a biased opinion or automatically be gay.
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=1&u=/ap/20040204/ap_on_re_us/gay_marriage_12
-
Originally posted by shockwaves
No, I don\'t think that at all. Tell me, if you lived with a gay couple for a while, would you suddenly want to be gay?
It\'s a bit different living with a gay couple for a while and being adopted at 6 months and not knowing any different.
-
Ever instance I\'ve seen of gay parenting the parents raise the kid to be in touch with themselves and know what they want and who they are. It is FAR more likely a gay person with straight parents will try to be straight than a straight person with gay parents trying to be gay.
-
Originally posted by SirMystiq
So b/c you have gay parents...You will never look at somebody of the same sex as just a "friend"? That\'s pretty...weird.
The kid will eventually know how things work, If his parents raise to knowing that they are gay b/c*bla bla bla* then the kid wouln\'t have a biased opinion or automatically be gay.
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=1&u=/ap/20040204/ap_on_re_us/gay_marriage_12
it\'s one thing to be told once bla bla bla but then seeing two people of the same sex kissing every other day.
I\'m not saying it definatly would happen but a possiblity.
-
Originally posted by shockwaves
Ever instance I\'ve seen of gay parenting the parents raise the kid to be in touch with themselves and know what they want and who they are. It is FAR more likely a gay person with straight parents will try to be straight than a straight person with gay parents trying to be gay.
So if you lived in an orphanage and Racer and Samwise wanted to adopt you,There would be no problem. (JK)
-
There\'s a difference between gay and just plain sick, lol
-
The only reason the kid would be more likley to be gay is because he wasn\'t taught to hate gay people....
It\'s like, there would be a lot more gay people today if society didnt look down on it so much....
And i dont see this as a negative, it doesn\'t harm anyone.
-
I had a couple of Lesbo neighbors who had kids from a test tube, nothing wrong with them in fact they had twins a boy and a girl, it\'s there life, I have a couple gay managers where I work now and they are no different than any of us mind the fact that they like the other sex no matter if it is wrong religiously, whoever said religions were always right to begin with?
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
it\'s one thing to be told once bla bla bla but then seeing two people of the same sex kissing every other day.
I\'m not saying it definatly would happen but a possiblity.
If the they raised him he\'ll be used to the situation!
-
Originally posted by SirMystiq
Separation of Church and State.
:laughing:
Man thats a joke. At least in this town. We have "FIRST CHRISTIAN ALLIANCE" meetings, that you get extra credit if you attend. They have posters everywhere. Also we have a teacher Mrs. Griffin, and this may seem rude and crude but ever so true; you shouldnt have a sign that says "Pray to God for Mrs. Griffin" posted in the school, with all the First Christian Alliance members signatures, and a big picture of Mr. Christ on it.
I think homosexuals (Politically correct term ;) ) should be allowed to have children on one key thing; it must be their egg/sperm. Adoptation seems a bit odd, because what kid would wants gay parents? If its their own flesh and blood, nature will tend to the love, and they will care for eachother. Or just be suicidal. Lets hope for the better.
-
Interestingly enough Massachusetts now allows gay marriage.
-
I expect in a year, half of the population of the forum to be living in Boston.
-
I really don\'t think having gay parents is as difficult for the child as you\'re all making it out to be.
-
Originally posted by (e)
I expect in a year, half of the population of the forum to be living in Boston.
Are you going to lead the pack?
-
I say give it to them. Frankly I\'m tired of the gay card being pulled making them feel invincible. This would level things a lot more.
-
I think \'marriage\' is for heterosexuals only, but I think a similar \'union\' with the same rights, policies etc would be ok. The whole concept of \'marriage\' is a union between a man and a women, nothing else. This isn\'t to say I disagree with them having the same rights and privelages as everyone else, i just don\'t think it should be called \'married\'.
I also dissagree with them having children. If they were born gay, then that means they were born with the inablity to procreate. It certainly shouldn\'t be against the law, but I don\'t think they should be allowed to adopt as a couple.
I agree with you LIC. A child would be more accepting of homosexuality, but if someone was really born straight, then it wouldn\'t matter. I mean, for someone like yourself who is truly heterosexual, is it that easy for you to change and become gay? It works both ways. I still think however that a child needs both a male and female parent, not just influence.
-
Originally posted by ##RaCeR##
I also dissagree with them having children. If they were born gay, then that means they were born with the inablity to procreate. It certainly shouldn\'t be against the law, but I don\'t think they should be allowed to adopt as a couple.
So you aren\'t going to adopt?
-
Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
Give me a break. Corrupt others? What the hell are you smoking? In no way does someone being homosexual corrupt others. It\'s not something that "spreads" or "infects" people.
Ahm..probably I got misunderstood again.I dont have anything against gay men.I believe they should have the same rights as heterosexuals.
And I dont believe gay men are sex maniacs or something.I said it only for the very very rare occasions where some gay men try to corrupt others.I dont have an absolute opinion about them.I know gays and I know bi men.And I have nothing against them
-
No to gay marriages. I don\'t have any links because frankly I don\'t research the ghey lifestyle, but I have heard on news reports that studies have shown that gays tend not to be monogomous - not that heterosexuals do, but homosexuals have a higher rate of multiple partners.
Also since we are on the topic, gays should not be allowed to adopt - and not for them, but rather the childs sake. It is hard enough being a child to have the stigma of having gay parents added to it.
-
Ahm....how many married gays do you know?Since they are free ofcourse they might have sex with more than gay men in their lives.Gays arent sex maniacs and jump in bed with any gay they find btw.
-
How would you know silky boy? I don\'t care either way, gays should not have the same rights IN MARRIAGE that heterosexual couples have.
-
If gays want to get married then let them, it is their right to do what they want.
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
How would you know silky boy? I don\'t care either way, gays should not have the same rights IN MARRIAGE that heterosexual couples have.
What does the "silky boy" stand for?What were you implying with that? :rolleyes:
I ll tell you how I know.I met gays.I have nothing against them.Or do you thing someone must be gay to know gay men?I bet you know gays they just havent revealed it to you.I bet YOU ADORE seeing lesbians.You wouldnt have any problem if lesbians were allowed to get married.Ofcourse that would serve your sexual fantasies?
-
Its not their right to get the benefits of being married ie. tax breaks, etc. A civil union is fine by me, but marriage is for a union between a man and woman. If gays are allowed to marry it mocks the entire institution of marriage.
-
If gay marriage is allowed but exposure of the marriage is kept to minimal it wont be a problem in society.
-
Originally posted by Unicron!
If gay marriage is allowed but exposure of the marriage is kept to minimal it wont be a problem in society.
This just shows your lack of knowledge about the US. This whole argument has to do with the institution of marriage, which many hold sacred. Allowing two people of the same sex to get "married" destroys that institution by making a mockery of it. Marriage is the union of a man and a woman not 2 men or 2 women. Like I said I don\'t care what they do - live together, have a civil union, whatever - just don\'t call it marriage.
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
Also since we are on the topic, gays should not be allowed to adopt - and not for them, but rather the childs sake. It is hard enough being a child to have the stigma of having gay parents added to it.
Thats the thing there should be no stigma for being gay, that is a very ignorant thing to say, just because you don\'t believe it is right doesn\'t make it wrong. I don\'t think being gay is natural but that doesn\'t make me right. If a kid at school makes fun of you because your parents or parent is gay he needs to be disciplined not the other way around.
-
How politically correct of you.
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
This just shows your lack of knowledge about the US. This whole argument has to do with the institution of marriage, which many hold sacred. Allowing two people of the same sex to get "married" destroys that institution by making a mockery of it. Marriage is the union of a man and a woman not 2 men or 2 women. Like I said I don\'t care what they do - live together, have a civil union, whatever - just don\'t call it marriage.
If gays make political marriages "behind closed doors" how would that matter?How can they make a mockery of it if its something not publicized?Its as if it didnt happen.
And I thought this thread was generally about gay marriages not specifically for the US.I thought it was mentioned as an example.
But then again why should gays in other countries of the world have more rights than in other countries?
-
Originally posted by Unicron!
If gays make political marriages "behind closed doors" how would that matter?How can they make a mockery of it if its something not publicized?Its as if it didnt happen.
And I thought this thread was generally about gay marriages not specifically for the US.I thought it was mentioned as an example.
But then again why should gays in other countries of the world have more rights than in other countries?
Because the government will recognize it. The gays in this country have a movement which is to make sure they get as much publicity as possible, so I don\'t think it will be hidden away.
Anyway, I can agree to disagree... my mind isn\'t going to change on the subject and I am sure the ruling in MA will be overturned by the Supreme Court or Congress. There are not many politicians who are in favor of gay marriages.
-
Gay marriages should be legal.
As long as they don\'t make a mockery of the sacred holy institution... You know, the holy, scared institution where you can elope to Vegas and have Elvis marry you to an acquaintance, only to annull 55 hours later.
Let gays get married and worry about your own life. Marriage is only special if the two people involved are committed to it, gay or otherwise.
The only mockery of the "sacred institution" is our high divorce rate.
If they\'re in love, let them commit to each other. It\'s their lives, let them live how they want.
-Eik
-
Let them have it, Im tired of hearing about it anyway.
LETS ALL BECOME GAY, its kewl to be gay right?
-
Are you married Eiksirf?
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
Its not their right to get the benefits of being married ie. tax breaks, etc. A civil union is fine by me, but marriage is for a union between a man and woman. If gays are allowed to marry it mocks the entire institution of marriage.
You can just smell the Republican...money money money.
Like E said, the mockery of "marriage" is the high divorce rate. It isn\'t a crime to "mock" marriage. Look at Britney Spears, "The Bachelor"etc...Marriage was defined by "straight" people who thought of it as the only form to be together legally and forever. What\'s wrong with two gay/lesbians wanting the world to recognize that they wish to be together forever? Maybe they\'ll last longer than most marriages in America.
What about a kid without both parents? Is he still going to grow up "normal" b/c he doesn\'t have the "affection" and "love" of both parents?
-
Mystiq are you married? No you aren\'t so how could you understand the institution of marriage? Granted some don\'t respect, but others do. What does money have to do with this topic????
Gays given the same marriage certificate and rights as heterosexual couples is an abomination.
-
Me votes and then thinks...
THX....
You didn\'t per chance hack in to Samwise\'s and/or myselfs E Mail Accounts... Look through the Drafted emails and saw the one intitled.
Proposal to European Parliament to make gay marriages legal the content over
?
-
Giga, I agree with you on the sacred marriage thing, and that is why I think it should be called something different. I think if they were called \'partners in life\' or something similar, with the same rights, tax breaks, recognition etc, then it would be ok.
I think its wrong for heterosexuals to condemn or criticise something like homosexuality because unless you\'ve been in that postition of sexual confusion, then how can you comment?
-
Haven\'t read any of the replies.
A marriage should be between a men and woman. It\'s not really a marriage if it\'s otherwise. I\'m all for gay rights and all just do your queer ceremony and and leave the sacred marriage ceremony alone. :)
Cool someone else said sacred too.
-
I agree with Giga, Racer, and now Jumpy here... It\'s not really a "marriage"... I\'m all for tradition and I believe this does threaten the sanctity of marriage. I dunno... its an argument that I like to play the fence with.
-
^^
Don\'t get me wrong, I am all for gay rights, I have a few gay friends and they don\'t deserve to be treated the disgusting way some of them get treated by uneducated pricks.
I just don\'t think it should be called marriage.
-
Ok, well maybe not marriage, but it can be the same thing as by law, but we can call it something different, I mean they do call each other there partners and such so we could throw another name in there too.
-
1.
I think \'marriage\' is for heterosexuals only, but I think a similar \'union\' with the same rights, policies etc would be ok. The whole concept of \'marriage\' is a union between a man and a women, nothing else.
Marriage between man and women is a RELIGIOUS concept.
State "Marriage" should and WILL be open to homosexuals and heterosexuals.
2. Its not their right to get the benefits of being married ie. tax breaks, etc. A civil union is fine by me, but marriage is for a union between a man and woman. If gays are allowed to marry it mocks the entire institution of marriage.
We are trying to run a government here, not trying to keep "pride" for the heterosexual population.
Marriage is not between man and women, that is once againa RELIGIOUS ideal, one that not all should be forced to accept.
3. This just shows your lack of knowledge about the US. This whole argument has to do with the institution of marriage, which many hold sacred.
This type of attitude is why democracy in the US is failing, america was created on noble ideals but the government is now controlled by groups who fight to control the population, not work FOR the population.
In closing, America is SUPPOSED to be a place of equality, where all people no matter what there sexuality, race, etc can be treated equally.
Those of you who want men and woman marriages may create PRIVATE organizations (i.e. the church, the boy scouts...)
The following words need to be removed from the government, as silly as you may think it:
"God" "Marriage" "Sacred"
Many others, but you get the point....
And yes, I do take the seperation of church and state very seriously, as it was intended.
-
Only problem with legalized gay marriage is that every joe on the street can get married to their best friend for the benefits. That is until they can find a wife and at that time they can miraculously become straight again.
-
No one in their sane mind would just get married to their best friend until they find a girl.
-
Some people will go to great lengths to save money.
-
Come on, it\'s the year 2004, there is no sanity in marriage. People average at least two marriages now\'a\'days and the whole idea of a "union" is a religious idea, thus not seperating the state from the religions.
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
Mystiq are you married? No you aren\'t so how could you understand the institution of marriage? Granted some don\'t respect, but others do. What does money have to do with this topic????
Gays given the same marriage certificate and rights as heterosexual couples is an abomination.
What does being married have to do with knowing the facts? I know that the divorce rate is as high as ever. What is it to understand? You get together, fall in love, they decide it doesn\'t work out and get divorced. Then the women gets all the goods and he men sticks with paying for the kids...(sarcasm)
I agree with Hamster and LIC.
-
whoa! i actually agree with giga! :eek: i don\'t think they should be raising kids. I mean they can get married & call it whatever but i have a serious beef with the child situation. But i think it will confuse the child when he see\'s daddy kissing daddy. i\'m not against gays by any means,..but i have kids of my own and married. y\'know it\'s hard enough trying to curb what they watch on tv (videos certain shows etc.)i mean it would have to be extremely difficult to explain the relationship to the child i would think.
I\'m sorry i just feel marriage is between man & woman period. But the marriage part i really don\'t have a problem with..it\'s the raising of the child.
-
Originally posted by SirMystiq
What does being married have to do with knowing the facts? I know that the divorce rate is as high as ever. What is it to understand?
Homosexual "unions" would have a higher divorce rate. Sir Mystiq you don\'t know $hit - you can quote me on that.
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
Homosexual "unions" would have a higher divorce rate. Sir Mystiq you don\'t know $hit - you can quote me on that.
You seem so sure of yourself...I wonder how?
I have gay cousins. They\'ve been together for 7 years now I believe AND they have triplets.
LIC and Hamster make the most sense out of this thread.
Oh and Although I do believe in democracy, I do not believe that the majority should decide morals for the minority. It is control, it is imposing your beliefs on someone else, and it is supposdly for the security of society....
Most laws are absed on morals btw.
I couldn\'t agree more and religion is no different...
-
Most of you need to go march in a parade ;) The first gay couple to have a civil union in Vermont seperated shortly there after. I remember seeing something on 48 hours or 60 minutes about a lesbian couple who had a civil union as well and they were fighting over custody of a child that one was artificially inseminated with...
Anyway, my point is marriage to me and others is an institution that is meant to be shared between a man and a woman. Gays can have their civil union, but I feel they shouldn\'t have a union as husband and husband or wife and wife. It is not right.
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
Most of you need to go march in a parade ;) The first gay couple to have a civil union in Vermont seperated shortly there after. I remember seeing something on 48 hours or 60 minutes about a lesbian couple who had a civil union as well and they were fighting over custody of a child that one was artificially inseminated with...
Anyway, my point is marriage to me and others is an institution that is meant to be shared between a man and a woman. Gays can have their civil union, but I feel they shouldn\'t have a union as husband and husband or wife and wife. It is not right.
I guess so then, one example of two individuals should be a very clear insight to millions of other people. No doubt:rolleyes:
My question is what makes you and the others right about marriage besides some text written hundreds of years ago?
-
The majority of this country is opposed to gay marriages. Yes, I believe the majority should dictate what is acceptable - that is democracy. Maybe you should answer the question - what makes you think being gay is right? It is unnatural and sick. Sorry if you disagree, but you won\'t change my mind and the minds of millions of others. Fortunately, as I said in a previous post, the whole gay marriage thing will be overruled either by the Supreme Court or Congress. I thank God that people like you are in no position to make or dictate policies.
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
The majority of this country is opposed to gay marriages. Yes, I believe the majority should dictate what is acceptable - that is democracy. Maybe you should answer the question - what makes you think being gay is right? It is unnatural and sick. Sorry if you disagree, but you won\'t change my mind and the minds of millions of others. Fortunately, as I said in a previous post, the whole gay marriage thing will be overruled either by the Supreme Court or Congress. I thank God that people like you are in no position to make or dictate policies.
I think it\'s unfortunate that any other person can dictate what\'s right or wrong for anyone else.
What\'s unnatural and sick about it? What bothers you about it? Forget about speaking for those million other people you\'re talking for...
Just so you know, I would never go in to a position of power to decide what\'s best for other people. It\'s absolutely ridiculous that there is such a thing...
what makes you think being gay is right?
First I would have to see what\'s wrong with it to decide what\'s right about it. The only truth of the matter is that it exists and it\'s not going anywhere. No point in arguing it or otherwise.
-
I agree no point in trying to change each others minds. I have said all I can say about this topic.
-
I think it\'s a problem that people like you will continue to pass on what you believe and that\'s where the problem is.
It\'s not about acceptance, it\'s about tolerance. What justifies your opposition and intolerance?
-
I don\'t agree with it, am disgusted by it, and frankly find it completely wrong yet who am I to say they can\'t get married?
-
Actually Ginko I think the problem lies in people like you who accept their lifestyle as normal.
-
Ummm... even if it is not normal, why are you willing to discriminate against them because of it??
No matter what yer opinion is, it cannot negativly impact you, so whats the problem?
-
It isn\'t normal but who are you to say they can\'t get married.
-
Actually Ginko I think the problem lies in people like you who accept their lifestyle as normal.
Or is it people like you who think they know the normal?
Define normal for me, please.
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
Actually Ginko I think the problem lies in people like you who accept their lifestyle as normal.
Would it be normal for a gay to have sex with a woman?Would it be normal for a lesbian to have sex with a man?Would it be normal for you if you had sex with a man?? :rolleyes:
You cant define what should be normal for them judging from yourself.
-
Originally posted by GigaShadow
Actually Ginko I think the problem lies in people like you who accept their lifestyle as normal.
Did you know that EVERY society has documented cases of homosexuality and it hasn\'t been until recently that homosexuality has been frowned upon. It seems to be that it is normal, but then again define normal.
-
Originally posted by Ginko
Or is it people like you who think they know the normal?
Define normal for me, please.
I\'m not against gays but surely you can\'t say it\'s normal?
Normal: ordinary;usual;conforming to type
doesn\'t sound like homosexuality to me?
-
What is normal when it comes to human behavior?
No two people are exactly alike so how do you form a standard or define a normal?
-
Well I was just reading a thread a few down about animal sex being legal in swedan and people who have sex with the animals have the same rights as a gay person because they are a sexuality of there own.Now tell me you think that\'s normal?
-
Yes for 600, Alex.
-
Since when was sexuality not one\'s own?
And honestly, who gives a shit? Seriously, it doesn\'t concern me what other people are doing.
I\'m still waiting to hear what this whole normal thing is about...
-
Originally posted by Ginko
Since when was sexuality not one\'s own?
When they start raping animals.
I have already given you the dictionary meaning.
-
While I think homosexuality is abnormal I don\'t think it is my or anyone elses place to tell them what they can or can\'t do with their bodies.
-
Originally posted by Ginko
What is normal when it comes to human behavior?
No two people are exactly alike so how do you form a standard or define a normal?
An average.
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
When they start raping animals.
I have already given you the dictionary meaning.
And I fail to see how the dictionary meaning of normal applies to the human psyche.
Explain to me why some people like cats instead of dogs, some people like rain while others hate it, why some dudes are attracted to fat chicks, why are there thrill seekers and homebodies, black and white, metal and opera...
I could keep going but hopefully you get the point. How can you define a normal for preference?
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
An average.
Average of what? And how is that fair?
-
Originally posted by Ginko
I could keep going but hopefully you get the point. How can you define a normal for preference?
Humans=normal
Normal for humans=being completely unique, unpredicatable, irrationate, unlogical, uneverything.
Imo I don\'t know what the said I\'ve talked about over the last couple of hours.
-
I agree with the Canadian.
-
Originally posted by Ginko
And I fail to see how the dictionary meaning of normal applies to the human psyche.
Explain to me why some people like cats instead of dogs, some people like rain while others hate it, why some dudes are attracted to fat chicks, why are there thrill seekers and homebodies, black and white, metal and opera...
I could keep going but hopefully you get the point. How can you define a normal for preference?
If those people started f*cking their cats and dogs would they be normal?
Taken from Dictionary.com
normal
Biology. Functioning or occurring in a natural way; lacking observable abnormalities or deficiencies.
-
Originally posted by Ginko
Average of what? And how is that fair?
The average of everyone,I\'m not saying that it would be every ones normal but the majorities normal.For the people out of the norm it\'s not fair,but lifes not fair.
-
Originally posted by Ginko
I agree with the Canadian.
About him not knowing what he\'s talking about. ;)
Nah,I agree with him to about people being unpredictable.
-
Samurai, refer to my post at the top of this page. EDIT: Oops, you did:P Anyway, if everyone started doing it then yes, it could then be defined as normal behavior.
Skyridder, you haven\'t told me what preference\'s are normal? How do you suppose you take this average? How do you force people to adhere to the preferences? Why do you bother doing it in the first place?
-
Well, technically everyone has abnormalities or deficiencies in some way or another when compared to another person. There really is no normal for our specie. Rather, what society does is tries to influence you into the way it wants you to act or defining the normal way to act.
-
i can\'t believe you cat\'s are discussing what\'s normal? stop beating around the bush on THAT topic. It\'s normal for a man to be with a woman period. there\'s no gray area..animals don\'t do it. and don\'t say something like oh but we\'re the advanced species and are intelligent enough handle this and that.
i don\'t have anything against gays & i don\'t really have a problem with themgetting married,..but how can some of you sit there and say it\'s normal? yes homosexuality have been around since man was created but it is not a normal act.
-
Originally posted by clips
i can\'t believe you cat\'s are discussing what\'s normal? stop beating around the bush on THAT topic. It\'s normal for a man to be with a woman period. there\'s no gray area..animals don\'t do it. and don\'t say something like oh but we\'re the advanced species and are intelligent enough handle this and that.
Actually there are homosexuals in the animal population. Don\'t feel like quoting it but just look around. I bet you my left testicle you\'ll find something.
i don\'t have anything against gays & i don\'t really have a problem with themgetting married,..but how can some of you sit there and say it\'s normal? yes homosexuality have been around since man was created but it is not a normal act.
I still haven\'t gotten my response of what normal is? Who decides it and why...
How are you expecting me to believe that there is such a thing as a standard when it comes to preferences?
-
You don\'t incline to desire a 4th grader\'s phycological deception of the matter...FINE.
"but how can some of you sit there and say it\'s normal? "
It happens, in plenty of places to plenty of people, therefore it\'s normal. Satisfied?
-
Originally posted by Ginko
Anyway, if everyone started doing it then yes, it could then be defined as normal behavior.
Doesn\'t that hurt your point? Since everyone is not homosexual doesn\'t that mean(according to your statement) it is not normal?
BTW, If it is not normal NOW why does it become normal when everyone does it?
-
Originally posted by Black Samurai
Doesn\'t that hurt your point? Since everyone is not homosexual doesn\'t that mean(according to your statement) it is not normal?
By your definition of normal it would. I haven\'t given a definition because I don\'t believe it exists.
BTW, If it is not normal NOW why does it become normal when everyone does it?
You tell me, you\'re the one who brought the definition up.
-
The purpose of a relationship is to reproduce(ie. produce a baby).
Male + Female = Baby (NORMAL!!!)
Male + Male = Baby (abnormal....)
Female + Female = Baby (abnormal....)
End of story.
-
Ginko, did you study at the Bossieman school of debate?
-
Male+Male=Baby would be abnormal...we all know they can\'t make babies silly!
-
Originally posted by Black Samurai
End of story.
Black Samurai\'s come to a shocking conclusion....but wait, it doesn\'t explain anything.
-
Also guys who like guys and girls who like girls have some sort of abnomality in there genetics.
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
Also guys who like guys and girls who like girls have some sort of abnomality in there genetics.
I don\'t believe that\'s been proven.
-
Originally posted by Jumpman
Male+Male=Baby would be abnormal...we all know they can\'t make babies silly!
Hey,you just said abnormal.How is there abnormal with no normal.
Who\'s side are you on. :sconf:
-
I don\'t think anyone who debate the female delivering the baby being normal part. He said man+man=nothing, which is normal, not abnormal since they obviously don\'t come out of the guy\'s bum.
Unless Racer would argue differently?
-
Originally posted by Jumpman
Male+Male=Baby would be abnormal...we all know they can\'t make babies silly!
Wait a second....you\'re right.
*clicks EDIT button*
-
homosexuality crosses all ethnic groups...this is true, but the majority of human beings are heterosexual. If you are with your child and he sees two men kissing on the street. he\'s gonna be shocked might laugh or say oooh daddy look! Now we all know kids are taught from day one in one way or another to like the opposite sex. Now i know some will say .".see that\'s what society wants you to think!" sorry but that is bulls**t.
even in nursery rhymes & story books it\'s taught to like the opposite sex. Now if my son sees it & he has, i wouldn\'t allow him to make fun of the act or whatever. i told him some men & women like to be with each-other and i left it at that. he said uh -uh not for me i like tweet! (the r&b singer). anyway only thing he needs to be focusing on at this point in his life is school & getting good grades.
this goes right back to the sex thread. men are attracted to women. Now are gays born that way? Maybe cause i don\'t think you\'re just gonna wake up one day & say damn..i feel like gettin my back broke by racer!;) j/k racer.
-
Originally posted by clips
i don\'t think you\'re just gonna wake up one day & say damn..i feel like gettin my back broke by racer!
I always assumed racer was the breakee as opposed to the breaker
-
Originally posted by Jumpman
I don\'t think anyone who debate the female delivering the baby being normal part. He said man+man=nothing, which is normal, not abnormal since they obviously don\'t come out of the guy\'s bum.
Unless Racer would argue differently?
Yah,I was just joking around cause Ginko was saying he doesn\'t think there is such a thing as normal.
but it\'s all OK.
-
Originally posted by clips
homosexuality crosses all ethnic groups...this is true, but the majority of human beings are heterosexual. If you are with your child and he sees two men kissing on the street. he\'s gonna be shocked might laugh or say oooh daddy look! Now we all know kids are taught from day one in one way or another to like the opposite sex. Now i know some will say .".see that\'s what society wants you to think!" sorry but that is bulls**t.
The kid will react to what he\'s come to know as the appropriate response. If he\'s been told it\'s wrong then he\'ll react in a negative manner. If he\'s been told that\'s just the way things are then he probably won\'t give it a second thought.
Having a kid you know how much they pick up from your behavior. When they get to school it turns over to their peers.
even in nursery rhymes & story books it\'s taught to like the opposite sex. Now if my son sees it & he has, i wouldn\'t allow him to make fun of the act or whatever. i told him some men & women like to be with each-other and i left it at that. he said uh -uh not for me i like tweet! (the r&b singer). anyway only thing he needs to be focusing on at this point in his life is school & getting good grades.
Only because it\'s seen as being socialably acceptable. You can\'t teach sexual preference.
What story books are telling you is that it\'s normal to have feelings for the opposite sex. Nowhere do you see a book condemning otherwise.
this goes right back to the sex thread. men are attracted to women. Now are gays born that way? Maybe cause i don\'t think you\'re just gonna wake up one day & say damn..i feel like gettin my back broke by racer!;) j/k racer.
Nothing has been proven.
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
Yah,I was just joking around cause Ginko was saying he doesn\'t think there is such a thing as normal.
but it\'s all OK.
Only because its\' definition is so limited, hardly a word to use among such a diverse group as humans.
-
Normal or not normal, who gives a shit?
Normal is just a word, it doesn\'t change the situation.
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
Well I was just reading a thread a few down about animal sex being legal in swedan and people who have sex with the animals have the same rights as a gay person because they are a sexuality of there own.Now tell me you think that\'s normal?
I dont think you would have liked it if you got raped by a donkey or an elephant.Or actually by any kind of animal :rolleyes:
-
Originally posted by Black Samurai
The purpose of a relationship is to reproduce(ie. produce a baby).End of story.
I am not gay.I am a man.And I dont want to have kids with my girl.
Does that make me abnormal?
Doing sex for pleasure is also abnormal then.
-
I don\'t think gays should be getting married at all, but this world is doomed anyways so let them have there fun while it last.
-
Originally posted by Unicron!
I am not gay.I am a man.And I dont want to have kids with my girl.
Does that make me abnormal?
Doing sex for pleasure is also abnormal then.
Don\'t try to catch me up on semantics because its not going to work.
Sex is a function of reproduction. Therefore having sex is a means to reproduce. Whether or not you and your girlfriend mean to have a child is beside the point. If you put a plug in a socket with no power that doesn\'t mean that the purpose is any different.
-
The purpose depends on the perspective.
Then again, I suppose you could argue the instinct that drives you to enage in sex is to reproduce. But when I jack off does that mean I want to have babies?
I would like a mini me actually...
"Sceew you Mr. Man I\'m as smart as a wabbit bish."
-
Originally posted by Unicron!
I dont think you would have liked it if you got raped by a donkey or an elephant.Or actually by any kind of animal :rolleyes:
No I wouldn\'t.So what\'s your point?
-
Originally posted by Jumpman
The purpose depends on the perspective.
Then again, I suppose you could argue the instinct that drives you to enage in sex is to reproduce. But when I jack off does that mean I want to have babies?
What possible perspective is there that would show the purpose of sex being anything other than reproduction? The fact that sex is pleasurable is clouding your minds.
-
Originally posted by Black Samurai
What possible perspective is there that would show the purpose of sex being anything other than reproduction? The fact that sex is pleasurable is clouding your minds.
exactly! the act of sex was meant for one act only..to reproduce.
-
Originally posted by Black Samurai
Don\'t try to catch me up on semantics because its not going to work.
Sex is a function of reproduction. Therefore having sex is a means to reproduce.
Well DUH
Whether or not you and your girlfriend mean to have a child is beside the point. If you put a plug in a socket with no power that doesn\'t mean that the purpose is any different.
No its not beside the point.Humans dont act only biologically like animals.There is also another perspective in humans.
You mean I do sex for pleasure because I want to reproduce?(tll that to a gay or a lesbian).We are not animals.If you choose to do it only for pleasure you do it only for pleasure.If you have a child and dont want another one you do it for pleasure and for means of communication.You wont be having 30 children from the day you met your mate till the day you die.Even if you had the money to raise all.
Humans dont do sex instinctively like animals.
If I accept what you said then I guess oral and anal sex is also for reproduction means.Oops wrong socket isnt it?
Gays and lesbians need sex as much as we do.
-
Originally posted by Unicron!
Well DUH
No its not beside the point.Humans dont act only biologically like animals.There is also another perspective in humans.
You mean I do sex for pleasure because I want to reproduce?(tll that to a gay or a lesbian).We are not animals.If you choose to do it only for pleasure you do it only for pleasure.If you have a child and dont want another one you do it for pleasure and for means of communication.You wont be having 30 children from the day you met your mate till the day you die.Even if you had the money to raise all.
Humans dont do sex instinctively like animals.
If I accept what you said then I guess oral and anal sex is also for reproduction means.Oops wrong socket isnt it?
Gays and lesbians need sex as much as we do.
:laughing: Oops wrong socket isn\'t it? hilarious! c\'mon uni, you guys are making this complicated. first & foremost sex was meant for reproduction..everything else is secondary..yes gays & lesbians need sex as much as we do, but they do it strickly for pleasure. If they do it for reproduction or wanting a child they..the lesbian at least has to go the route of artificial insemetnation (spell?) only option for the men is to adopt.
-
Originally posted by clips
:laughing: Oops wrong socket isn\'t it? hilarious! c\'mon uni, you guys are making this complicated. first & foremost sex was meant for reproduction..everything else is secondary..yes gays & lesbians need sex as much as we do, but they do it strickly for pleasure. If they do it for reproduction or wanting a child they..the lesbian at least has to go the route of artificial insemetnation (spell?) only option for the men is to adopt.
I believe all perspectives of sex are as important for human kind.Ofcourse we know gays and lesbians cant reproduce but why should they lack the right of marriage?Its emotionally and psychologically very harsh for any human being to lack that bond with a partner.
Even straight men and women many times suffer from depression and emotional instability if they dont have sexual communication and offer and take love with a partner.Imagine how hard that would be for gays or lesbians that are accepted in society as freaks.
I dont think its right for gay or lesbian couples to adopt or generally raise a kid becuase it might cause confuson to the child though.
-
Originally posted by Unicron!
I believe all perspectives of sex are as important for human kind.Ofcourse we know gays and lesbians cant reproduce but why should they lack the right of marriage?Its emotionally and psychologically very harsh for any human being to lack that bond with a partner.
Even straight men and women many times suffer from depression and emotional instability if they dont have sexual communication and offer and take love with a partner.Imagine how hard that would be for gays or lesbians that are accepted in society as freaks.
I dont think its right for gay or lesbian couples to adopt or generally raise a kid becuase it might cause confuson to the child though.
argh! :rpissed: smacks uni upside the head! If you read a couple of my posts you will see i feel the same way you do..as far as the marriage (doesn\'t really bother me) & kids (i have some issues with that) are concerned. i was just focusing on the fact that sex in general, main purpose is for reproducing. Yes it doesn\'t hurt that it feels good & all, but take away the birth control & condoms and what do you have..sex was meant for reproduction.
If god OR for the sake of not turning this into a religious thread our creator did not meant for sex to be an act of reproduction, he would have given the female & male some type of organ or a process to control it.
-
LOL :laughing: I didnt try to disagree with you.I was just adding more to my thoughts
Anyways.If there wasnt any birth control or condoms it wouldnt change the fact that even then sex would have satisfied more needs(the needs I mentioned above) than just reproduction.
If god OR for the sake of not turning this into a religious thread our creator did not meant for sex to be an act of reproduction, he would have given the female & male some type of organ or a process to control it.
hehehe well.There are some techniques in Tantric sex where a man can learn how to handle his ejaculation and have continuous orgasms :D
-
Ain\'t it funny that even though sex was made for babies, 99% of the time humans do it they don\'t want any?
Another one of the big riddles of life.
:gman:
-
Originally posted by Skyrider666
No I wouldn\'t.So what\'s your point?
They are RAPING the animal :rolleyes:
They are molesting the animal.
Dont judge gay sex as if its the same thing as having sex with an animal.
Even if a gau raped a gay it would have been an act to be punished
-
Gay sex has tunred up in the thread.
Funny how some ppl think woman on women is a beautiful thing, but cringe at the thought of male on male.
Most guys are kool with girls having sex with eachother.
I had a cousin die from aids. He was gay.
And growing up in a god fearing background it was not tough.
But nobody never judged him they left that up to god.
Having had a member of my family die from aids and being gay change my way of seeing the entire situation.
Although I feel that it is wrong I don\'t judge i just accept the person for who they are and leave it up to god. Only when gays try to mix god in what they are doing do I speak up.
-
What do you mean by mixing god with what they are doing?
-
Originally posted by QuDDus
Funny how some ppl think woman on women is a beautiful thing, but cringe at the thought of male on male.
Most guys are kool with girls having sex with eachother.
^^