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Non Gaming Discussions => Off-Topic => Topic started by: Titan on January 19, 2005, 05:59:23 AM
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I really don\'tknow why but this article really pissed me off. There is a Christian museum pushing creationism. I was fine with it until the article talked about the warning signs and nonbelievers are "willfully ignorant". Have these religious fanatics have gone to far?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/01/02/weden02.xml&sSheet=/news/2005/01/02/ixworld.html
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It\'s shit like this that further enforces my view that man came to be through the process of evolution, and not by the means with which they try their hardest to justify.
I\'m all for each person having the free will to choose his/her own belief, but I think it\'s wrong when they try to ram their beliefs down the throats of others.
Here\'s a thought:
God is the epitome of good. and is all forgiving right?
If that is the case, and he DOES exist, surely he will be willing to forgive those that are (according to the artical) "rejecting his history – including six-day creation and Noah\'s flood", and thus being "willfully ignorant" for their sin.
And if he\'s willing to forgive those who sin, what the f\'k are they bitching about?
I\'m agnostic myself, I neither believe or disbelieve. I only believe the notion that it is impossible to know for sure that god exists until it is my time to find out.
And like I said, I take comfort from one thing the bible squad continually preach, he IS all forgiving.
If he does exist, he will forgive me for being open on the subject.
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^^^^^
:word:
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Originally posted by Cerberus
God is the epitome of good. and is all forgiving right?
If that is the case, and he DOES exist, surely he will be willing to forgive those that are (according to the artical) "rejecting his history ? including six-day creation and Noah\'s flood", and thus being "willfully ignorant" for their sin.
And if he\'s willing to forgive those who sin, what the f\'k are they bitching about?
If he does exist, he will forgive me for being open on the subject.
Thats not how it works. You are forgiven for what you ask to be forgiven for. Its not like you can murder thousands, get to the pearly gates, and all is well. If thats how things were, there\'d be no point in having a heaven and hell.
As for the article, I\'m not supporting their views in calling non-believers ignorant. I still find it hard to believe that dinosaurs and humas co-existed to be honest. Nothing to get heated over though.
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Originally posted by SwifDi
Thats not how it works. You are forgiven for what you ask to be forgiven for. Its not like you can murder thousands, get to the pearly gates, and all is well. If thats how things were, there\'d be no point in having a heaven and hell.
As for the article, I\'m not supporting their views in calling non-believers ignorant. I still find it hard to believe that dinosaurs and humas co-existed to be honest. Nothing to get heated over though.
Well, I\'ll ask to be forgiven for being open on the subject.
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I forgive you.
Now repent by sending me $50 tithe, peasant.
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*bows down to chizzy* Forgive me :(
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but I think it\'s wrong when they try to ram their beliefs down the throats of others.
How\'s that? I can\'t remember the last time any religion tried to ram its beliefs down my throat.
I\'LL SEE YOU IN HELL!!!!!*
*From heaven
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Originally posted by THX
How\'s that? I can\'t remember the last time any religion tried to ram its beliefs down my throat.
I\'LL SEE YOU IN HELL!!!!!*
*From heaven
2 words.......
Jehova\'s witness
2 more words
fanatical christians
That reminds me, I don\'t approve the way certain groups use children to try to make you feel obliged to listen.
I\'ve yet to see a jehova\'s witness member come to my door without a malnourised & dishevelled child in tow
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"More controversial exhibits deal with diseases and famine, which are portrayed not as random disasters, but as the result of mankind\'s sin. Mr Ham\'s Answers in Genesis movement blames the 1999 massacre at Columbine High School in Colorado, in which two teenagers killed 12 classmates and a teacher before killing themselves, on evolutionist teaching, claiming that the perpetrators believed in Darwin\'s survival of the fittest."
This is the most ridiculous part in my opinion.
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Originally posted by SwifDi
Thats not how it works. You are forgiven for what you ask to be forgiven for.
That\'s what catholics believe right?
Originally posted by SwifDi
I still find it hard to believe that dinosaurs and humas co-existed to be honest. Nothing to get heated over though.
They didn\'t.
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so let me get this straight.....
An Australian who believes dinosaurs were killed by the flood 6000 years ago?
Haven\'t heard much from #RaCeR# lately......:eek:
how\'s that museum working out for you? ;)
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You will not be forgiven for willfully and intentionally sinning. You can ask for forgiveness all you want, but you have to truely be repentant in your heart to recieve it. If you are choosing to continue being \'open\' to defying God\'s word, your request for forgiveness is insincere. You will burn in Hell. And God wants you to be ignorant, didn\'t you understand the deal with Adam and Eve at all? Ignorance and innocence are hand in hand. The only one who wants you to be \'smart\' is Satan, because he wants the company. He likes causing trouble. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing, a lot of knowledge can be deadly.
Umm... as for the article... I don\'t actually believe any of this shit, but how are the signs going too far? If they believe what they claim, there\'s no other way they could view evolution really. I might not agree with most peoples beliefs, but I do respect when people truely believe instead of paying lip service and having flexible faith. You should be more pissed about the millions of Xtians that get divorce, commit adultery, fornicate, abort babies, kill, etc while claiming to still be Xtians. I\'ll take some supersticious ignorant hicks over hypocrites any day.
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Its funny how religious people tell me that I\'m ignorant because I don\'t believe in God (I know from experience from fanatic friends). I can say the same thing about them that they are ignorant for keeping such a closed mind towards science and evolution and believing in a God that can\'t even be proven to exist. Show me proof that God exists and maybe I\'ll listen. BTW, I grew up religious and Catholic until like 3 years ago when I realized that I don\'t like being told what to believe and decided that I believe in the science rather than theology.
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Maybe the creation account was described using the measurement of days on God\'s "planet" or "heaven" or wherever he lives.
As we create virtual worlds like the Sims, their days are always way shorter than real days, so we can see the results happen in a reasonable time.
Maybe God created the Earth in 7 Million years? Maybe one of his days is like 1 million of our years.
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Originally posted by EThuggV3
You will not be forgiven for willfully and intentionally sinning. You can ask for forgiveness all you want, but you have to truely be repentant in your heart to recieve it. If you are choosing to continue being \'open\' to defying God\'s word, your request for forgiveness is insincere. You will burn in Hell
So its all a game. "Im going to make everyone question my existence and whoever believs in me lives in bliss for eternity..the others rot in hell." From what cerberus said, Im in the same seat as him as far as beliefs go. Being open minded, not saying he does exist while not saying he doesnt and going to hell for it? or pergatory.
And would if your a nice person and dont believe in him? isnt religion so you\'ll live a good live and be a good person? or is it to spread the word of god just for the hell of it.
edit: and how many times are catholics going to change their stories. First Adam and Eve was real, then metaphorical for a long time, now he walked with dinasoars?
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Originally posted by juslight
Maybe the creation account was described using the measurement of days on God\'s "planet" or "heaven" or wherever he lives.
As we create virtual worlds like the Sims, their days are always way shorter than real days, so we can see the results happen in a reasonable time.
Maybe God created the Earth in 7 Million years? Maybe one of his days is like 1 million of our years.
:laughing: I never htought of it like that. That really is an interesting thought. What if we are God\'s video game and he\'s controlling everything like in The Sims. I don\'t believe it though
Originally posted by Viper_Fujax
And would if your a nice person and dont believe in him? isnt religion so you\'ll live a good live and be a good person? or is it to spread the word of god just for the hell of it.
My friends say I\'m one of the nicest people. I give when I need to and things like that. But I guess in the eyes of religious people, that doesn\'t mean shit and none of my good deeds will go noticed, since I\'m athiest and that makes me a bad person.
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Its amazing how much ignorance there is in regards to understanding Christianity...
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It\'s also amazing how much ignorance there is in regard to understanding science... ;)
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Let\'s see if science saves your penis when it disentegrates from the FLAMES OF HELL.
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we\'ve already had like a million of these threads....but i love hearing everybody\'s views on this...one thing is fo sho....we came from somewhere or someone...s**t why is earth the ONLY planet in our solar system that contains life? the point i\'m tryin to make is that whoever created us, why couldn\'t there have been humanoid life of some form able to adapt to say maybe the conditions of mars or of venus?...as there are many creatures that live in the ocean depths where the pressure would crush a human body in seconds,..why can\'t also there be life on these other planets where life could have adapted to those conditions?
is there a reason why we\'re the only form of life in our solar system? s**t in all of the universe are we the only form of intelligent life? i know i\'m going off in another direction with this as ultimately i believe there is a god,..but sometimes i like to think about these other theories....
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Ill just trow this in has anybody read the Davinchi Code or if lazy watched the movie. IF no on both everyone in this thread seriuosly needs to especially cerb
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Are people being forced to go through the museum?
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I personally hate how they seperate science and religion from each other.Whether they are scientists or priests.
I believe in God but not in the direct and literal understanding of the teachings.
You just cant read the bible or whatever and understand things.Its like reading in theory mathematics for the first time in a book instead of further using them in practice, experimentation and see their meaning which goes as far as physics and beyond
You ll never get a complete understanding of the basis of mathematics just knowing what they do in theory
Religion has become nothing but a money bringer and a way to blind people these days.I personally feel like vomiting when I watch stupid religious chunnels like God Tv or Church Tv or whatever they are called or watch Bush use religion or identify with Christianity.
Anyways.About this museum.It will be interesting to see things from a different perspective
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I am a christian, and the one thing i never do, is try and ram my brliefs down someones throat,I never try ands speak to the J W\'S , seems every saturday they park thier cars on my street, and start canvasing the nieberhood, i never answer the door if i see them coming.
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Religion has become nothing but a money bringer and a way to blind people these days.I personally feel like vomiting when I watch stupid religious chunnels like God Tv or Church Tv or whatever
I wub hasty generalizations. I don\'t know anyone who gets their religion from watching TV.
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Originally posted by THX
I wub hasty generalizations. I don\'t know anyone who gets their religion from watching TV.
Did you see anywhere that I said that generally everyone gets their religion fron their TV?
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Originally posted by Cyrus
Ill just trow this in has anybody read the Davinchi Code or if lazy watched the movie. IF no on both everyone in this thread seriuosly needs to especially cerb
Does watching a special on the History Channel count? :) It was very interesting, but since the book is a \'story\', I was less interested in actually reading it.
Speaking of the book... I dunno if I\'m allowed to do this... hmm... oh well. *risks another ban*
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Originally posted by fre4d4
I am a christian, and the one thing i never do, is try and ram my brliefs down someones throat,I never try ands speak to the J W\'S , seems every saturday they park thier cars on my street, and start canvasing the nieberhood, i never answer the door if i see them coming.
I think I do this......
I BELIVE everyman should get regular blow jobs and im constantly raming it down my wife throat...
Do that count?
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Originally posted by Ace
Are people being forced to go through the museum?
No. But its kind of the principle of the thing. It seems to me that a museum is supposed to teach the people going through it fact, not myth and theology. Things in a museum are backed up by scientific facts. The things in this museum seem to me to just be attractions trying to do nothing but convert and brings nothing to the table.
The Jahova\'s witnesses are by far the worst. They came to my house one time and I was talking to one of my best friends over the phone. I couldn\'t get rid of them. I was gonna tell them I was athiest but they would have then tried to convert me. I took the pamphlets and shut the door and continued to talk to my friend.
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Originally posted by Unicron!
Did you see anywhere that I said that generally everyone gets their religion fron their TV?
Haha ok amigo, what you meant to say was less than 1% of people who believe in religion get it from their television. Gotcha.
So explain the first sentence. "Religion has become nothing but a blah blah I\'m mad at anyone who doesn\'t believe in what I believe in." Don\'t know what kind of churches you\'re familiar with but mine does tons of social work; a shower ministry for the homeless, traveling on week long trips to help a neighborhood fix their homes, and supporting international mission work. Many people (especially Europeans) are just familiar with the Catholic church that spends much of their money on fancy cathedrals and the upkeep of their royalty..err... I mean Popes/Bishops/Archbishops etc... Doesn\'t mean you should judge the whole religion based on that.
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If my memories serve me correctly,
Western European countries are pretty liberals. Meaning, even though most are protestants, they don\'t attend church regularly. Like about 10 - 20% of them go to church every sunday while the remaining just sleep in.
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Originally posted by Paul2
If my memories serve me correctly,
Western European countries are pretty liberals. Meaning, even though most are protestants, they don\'t attend church regularly. Like about 10 - 20% of them go to church every sunday while the remaining just sleep in.
Heh, more like 1-2% if that. Well, around these parts anyway.
BTW, around a year ago two JW followers rang my door bell. I opened the door and there was:
a) An ugly guy
b) A really, really hot girl
If I had had the time (was going somewhere) and she had come alone, I\'d definatly let her in the house and spew her BS for a couple of hours. ;)
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Originally posted by Cyrus
Ill just trow this in has anybody read the Davinchi Code or if lazy watched the movie. IF no on both everyone in this thread seriuosly needs to especially cerb
Is that the one where that crackpot was alleged to have spotted the demise of princess diana by randomly spaced letters in the passages of the text, strangely enough the best part of a decade after she died? and the one that predicts the end of the world in 2006?
If so, I saw a documentary on BBC2 about it a while ago, and thought it was a load of pap.
The thing with the bible, like all big books, there is a huge area in which to find these so called messages, even more so when the spaces between the letters chosen can vary immensly.
Hell, if I had the time, patience and inclination, I could probably find a message saying "let\'s all gaze in amazement at the site of Cerberus\'s huge penis"
edit//
scrap that, I did a search for it, and it\'s something different.
that just shows how much this religion shit disinterests me.
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R.E. on the "There is a Christian museum pushing creationism" topic
Even though this is as wise as running through North Korea handing out pirate DVD copys of Team America World Police.
I Still think The Evolution Theory for the most part is a Bag of W@nk too.
Sorry but if the Evolution Theory was a person... I wouldn\'t even trust him to open a can of soup for me.
The Damn thing has more holes to its theory than Uday Hussein\'s Ferrari.
Edited thanks to Cerbus the Spolling NAZI ;)
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Theroy?
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Sorry..... Theory
as in
Hypothesis
Guess
Conjecture
Speculation
Rationale
Explanation
As in .....Assumption which is always The Mother of all F^ckups
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Originally posted by Titan
There is a Christian museum pushing creationism.
This statement cracked me up when I saw it. Nobody is forcing his or her religion on you or anybody else. If you don’t want to see it then don’t go. Besides, with the public school teaching evolution and having banned creationism from being an alternative way of thinking… Who is pushing their beliefs on whom in this case?
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Originally posted by project86
This statement cracked me up when I saw it. Nobody is forcing his or her religion on you or anybody else. If you don’t want to see it then don’t go. Besides, with the public school teaching evolution and having banned creationism from being an alternative way of thinking… Who is pushing their beliefs on whom in this case?
Yeah thats what i was thinking ...
Titan ARE you turning Liberal on us ?
are you just being offended for the sake of it ?
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Originally posted by ooseven
I Still think The Evolution Theory for the most part is a Bag of W@nk too.
The Damn thing has more holes to its theory than Uday Hussein\'s Ferrari.
My thoughts exactly. I know the creationism theory has an extreme presence of “faith” but to truly believe the theory of evolution you would need the same faith as nobody can prove either one to be true. And the many deceptions found in some of the “findings” for evolution have only made it tougher for some to believe in it.
And a side note…
61% of America still believes that man’s origin is based in creationism. So having a museum of this theory is not going to falter to the whimsical ways of the evolution fanatics…
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Originally posted by project86
This statement cracked me up when I saw it. Nobody is forcing his or her religion on you or anybody else. If you don’t want to see it then don’t go. Besides, with the public school teaching evolution and having banned creationism from being an alternative way of thinking… Who is pushing their beliefs on whom in this case?
Its funny. The guy who started this museum (from the context of the article), wants evolution out of schools and to teach creationism as fact. I dont think that is right. There is seperation of church and state. I believe that science should be taught instead of religion. A lot of the religious people go to some kind of a religion school to learn this stuff about creationism, not the classroom. If they teach evolution in the classroom and a student learned about creationism in religion school, then he/she can make the choice for themselves.
Originally posted by ooseven
Yeah thats what i was thinking ...
Titan ARE you turning Liberal on us ?
are you just being offended for the sake of it ?
I\'m not as conservative as I once was. I\'m more moderate now.
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Originally posted by THX
Haha ok amigo, what you meant to say was less than 1% of people who believe in religion get it from their television. Gotcha.
So explain the first sentence. "Religion has become nothing but a blah blah I\'m mad at anyone who doesn\'t believe in what I believe in." Don\'t know what kind of churches you\'re familiar with but mine does tons of social work; a shower ministry for the homeless, traveling on week long trips to help a neighborhood fix their homes, and supporting international mission work. Many people (especially Europeans) are just familiar with the Catholic church that spends much of their money on fancy cathedrals and the upkeep of their royalty..err... I mean Popes/Bishops/Archbishops etc... Doesn\'t mean you should judge the whole religion based on that.
First of all stop twisting my words.
The refercence of those idiotic religious TV channels were just examples of how religion\'s face has changed abd people are accepting them or dont give a damn.If churches do donations or whatever doesnt prove that religion is on the right track.At the same time there are people exploiting religion and offer a misunderstood but wrong idea of religion that is accepted because it sounds right.
I can tell you Jesus is the saviour.The same thing they seem to believe as well.Do you see a difference in faith of beliefs?
And when I mentioned my disliking of Science/Religion separation you should first see what exactly is that opinion before you judge, because simply you dont know it.I agree with both views and I accpet both.I am not disagreeing with both.Those who disagree with one of them usually is in dispute with someone who supports the other idea.
So ask yourself who is mad at someone\'s beliefs?Me?A scientist who is absolute about his gnostic scientific opinions?Or the priest who sees science as something that make people not believe in the existence of God?
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Originally posted by Titan
Its funny. The guy who started this museum (from the context of the article), wants evolution out of schools and to teach creationism as fact. I dont think that is right. There is seperation of church and state. I believe that science should be taught instead of religion. A lot of the religious people go to some kind of a religion school to learn this stuff about creationism, not the classroom. If they teach evolution in the classroom and a student learned about creationism in religion school, then he/she can make the choice for themselves.
I\'m not as conservative as I once was. I\'m more moderate now.
Separation of church and state is not even constitutional. It’s a myth made up of foolish judges with more time on their hands than morals. But if religion is such a hoax then how is it that the theory of creationism has been around for thousands of years and yet it was more recent that evolution came to be? Oh, and with the theory of evolution being disowned by Darwin himself and then projected into the media by those with more public clout rather than scientific knowledge simply proposes that evolution is a propaganda scheme more than any truth at all. Please, enlighten me...
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Originally posted by project86
Separation of church and state is not even constitutional. It’s a myth made up of foolish judges with more time on their hands than morals. But if religion is such a hoax then how is it that the theory of creationism has been around for thousands of years and yet it was more recent that evolution came to be?
yea. separation of church and state is kind of bs. Our founding fathers built the country on those beliefs so to disown that isnt right whether you believe in it or not. Im actually tired of all these athiests who want "under god" and in san diego they want a cross of a mountain. What pisses me off about that cross is that its for soldiers who gave their lives in past wars. And they want it down just because it proposes christianity on them. BS. Just because you say 2 words in the pledge (i know "under god" wasnt orginially in it) and because theres a cross on a mountain it forces you to believe in god?
And religion has been around a while and we base our beliefs on the bible and word of mouth since who knows when. But now we learn first hand what is making the world tick with science. For all we know the books in the bible could be altered, made up, true, whatever. Because its been around for so long it could be true, but at the same time someone way back then couldve made it up. Sorry for the crappy wording on the last sentence. 8 in the morning, have a final in an hour, my brain is fried, and i dont know how to word it.
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Recently a school in Pennsylvania was ordered to remove the Ten Commandments from the walls of their hallway. The court ordered it to be done under the idea that… get this… “Any student that looks upon the Ten Commandments might be so compelled to act upon them”.
So lets see here, the student might “not commit murder” or perhaps he/she might “not steal” or “commit adultery”… Hmmm, what would this nation be like if everybody made the mistake of following the Ten Commandments? I can only imagine the chaos!
//end sarcasm*
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Originally posted by Titan
No. But its kind of the principle of the thing. It seems to me that a museum is supposed to teach the people going through it fact, not myth and theology. Things in a museum are backed up by scientific facts. The things in this museum seem to me to just be attractions trying to do nothing but convert and brings nothing to the table.
The Jahova\'s witnesses are by far the worst. They came to my house one time and I was talking to one of my best friends over the phone. I couldn\'t get rid of them. I was gonna tell them I was athiest but they would have then tried to convert me. I took the pamphlets and shut the door and continued to talk to my friend.
Buyer beware.
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Originally posted by Titan
I\'m not as conservative as I once was. I\'m more moderate now.
Ohhhh i am going to hold you to that quote the next time President George W Bush has another rush of blood to the head and decides to invade someone ;).
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Originally posted by project86
Separation of church and state is not even constitutional. It’s a myth made up of foolish judges with more time on their hands than morals. But if religion is such a hoax then how is it that the theory of creationism has been around for thousands of years and yet it was more recent that evolution came to be? Oh, and with the theory of evolution being disowned by Darwin himself and then projected into the media by those with more public clout rather than scientific knowledge simply proposes that evolution is a propaganda scheme more than any truth at all. Please, enlighten me...
Seeing that no one challenged the church\'s teachings, nor made the connection that certain species of animals (like finches and their beaks) had vast similarities. The reason creationism went unchallenged for a thousand or so years is because a) the majority of the population was uneducated and b) the challengers were burned at the stake for being heretics and c) the church held much power in Europe for hundreds of years and basically ran it and told people what to believe. So when did you want people to think for themselves to come up with new theories?
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Originally posted by Titan
Seeing that no one challenged the church\'s teachings, nor made the connection that certain species of animals (like finches and their beaks) had vast similarities. The reason creationism went unchallenged for a thousand or so years is because a) the majority of the population was uneducated and b) the challengers were burned at the stake for being heretics and c) the church held much power in Europe for hundreds of years and basically ran it and told people what to believe. So when did you want people to think for themselves to come up with new theories?
Poor excuse man. Sorry but considering that there have been entire nations based on the beliefs of other gods and theories I am going to say that what you just said there makes little to no sense. If what you say is true then why was Allah acceptable long before the theory of evolution? Why were the many gods based in the religions of Greece so prominent during the time Jesus walked the earth? It would seem to me that your statement bares no evidence, only emotion. Any other “facts” or tid bits of wisdom for us?
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Evolution still isn\'t even considered in the middle east. Its all theocracy so that comment has no relevence to this arguement. No one even thought up of evolution until Darwin. Your arguement makes no sense. The point of a religion is to explain the unexplainable, also known as a myth. What I\'m getting from you is that since the stories in the old testament were here first, they are "truth" and any new theories are "irrelevent" or "wrong". Come on, give me a break. You just are keeping a closed mind to anything new and anything that may just prove the Bible wrong.
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Originally posted by Titan
What I\'m getting from you is that since the stories in the old testament were here first, they are "truth" and any new theories are "irrelevent" or "wrong".
Your close…
What I am getting at is that aside from the Bible having been around long before Darwin and his load of crap, all other theories after are just that… THEORIES. But with the judiciary system backing up the minority of those that despise creationism, evolution has worked it’s way into our education system as “fact” to so many. And, if you’re not an evolutionist then you’re a Bible thumper or some fanatic for Christ. It would seem to me that evolutionists are so caught up in being threatened by creationists that they tend to slap a title or some ridiculous name for those opposed to the theory of evolution.
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SirMystiq and Titan have such a vendetta against religion...
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One who mocks gay and lesbian people is someone who might be considered a homophobic or quite possibly insecure with their own sexuality. Would that pose true for those that mock religious people? Perhaps they are insecure with their own tendencies…
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Those people are fanatical morons, but you guys are also severely misinformed and just hear things that others have said many times over. Seems like everyone gets their opinion from the bible channel [which is a complete joke].
I still find it hard to believe that dinosaurs and humas co-existed to be honest. Nothing to get heated over though
That\'s an example.
I personally hate how they seperate science and religion from each other.Whether they are scientists or priests.
I agree...that\'s quite annoying.
Religion has become nothing but a money bringer and a way to blind people these days.
The Catholic church, maybe. But most [meaning all] Christian churches I\'ve been to are non-profit organizations, with any money given being donated to charity.
I personally feel like vomiting when I watch stupid religious chunnels like God Tv or Church Tv
Most religious people I know who don\'t have their heads up their asses are deeply offended by those channels.
And to finish this all off...
Penis.
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I am not refering specifically to church.Although things arent all rosy either there.Priests with an expensive mercedes anyone?My point was that the church and believers arent doing anything to stop the use of religion of others who are exploiting it whether the interests are economical or political.
Most people say "I believe".But thats as far as most people go.Then there is another part composed of morons as you said, a part that is composed of people who are insecure and a select few that truelly understand.
Since most people dont have a complete understanding of religion and we are mostly worried about the tons of everyday problems we face continuously, we dont give much attention to any kind of corruption and religion has become only some kind of a secondary charity business or a tool for those who have power to use for interests.It happens we just dont care much
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Doesn’t bother me, my attitude towards this shit is like. You have your own beliefs, I have mine. It’s not my fault yours are wrong. ;)
I personally couldn\'t give a shit about religion. When doods come to my door and start sprouting their crap, i say no thanks. When they continue to push, i just close the door and walk off.
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Well if you are refering to my post my point is that whether you believe or not people should fight the corruption, exhaggerations or improve its role in society since has its impacts in society like it was ment to be.If its not on you it has a result on others and these others are our social enviroment.Whether someone believes or not is not the case.Its the fact that we should give some attention to it since it has its consequences indirectly or directly in society.
Even for an atheist being educated on the matter of religion sometimes helps.Its not just stories to make you act like a good person.Its knowledge.
Perosnally I never go to church, never say my sins to a priest etc etc.Someone who does often these will tell me I ll go to hell.There were even people who misunderstood me as a satanist or a heretic.But I do care if I see something thats not right about religion despite that.Because if something\'s not right, then it has its consequences.
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Originally posted by THX
How\'s that? I can\'t remember the last time any religion tried to ram its beliefs down my throat.[/i][/SIZE]
heres an example: all the bible thumpers discriminating gays because in the bible it says they will go to hell
there was a gay club at my school last year and a bunch of people walked along the sidewalks protesting. wtf?! these people believe they have the right to tell not someone, a group of people what to do basing it on an opinion. there is also a new muslim club, and I bet those assholes will come back for that too
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If we are on the subject of gays....
Le 20:13
And if a man has sex relations with a man, the two of them have done a disgusting thing: let them be put to death; their blood will be on them.
It doesnt say "go to hell" or anything...it says they will be put to death, simply...
Keep your thoughts to yourself if they aren\'t right!!!
AND, I\'m not a bible thumper, but I can tell when someone quotes my guide book wrong
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1)Does it say anything about lesbians?
2)What are we?Sinless?Who do we thing we are to "throw a stone" to others?We should mind our own business
3)Those bastards who protest against gays or people who belong to other religions are idiots.With their actions they even contradict Jesus\' teachings.
If they are such good christians why dont they choose the right Jesus way by showing them the right way!THE GOOD CHRISTIAN WAY!!!
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how old is the bible again?????
case closed.
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Originally posted by Unicron!
1)Does it say anything about lesbians?
No...but this is the old testament, where man doesn\'t mean "man-gender" but "man-human"Originally posted by Unicron!
2)What are we?Sinless?Who do we thing we are to "throw a stone" to others?We should mind our own business
i agree with you partially there...
Originally posted by Unicron!
3)Those bastards who protest against gays or people who belong to other religions are idiots.With their actions they even contradict Jesus\' teachings.
If they are such good christians why dont they choose the right Jesus way by showing them the right way!THE GOOD CHRISTIAN WAY!!!
Yes, there are a lot of people out there claiming to be great and awesome Christians...they are mostly hipocrites. I have actually stopped going to church as much b/c of all the hipocrites...
But I really don\'t care what gay people do, I just didn\'t like Hal\'s smart butt comment....
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Originally posted by §ôµÏG®ïñD
how old is the bible again?????
case closed.
I dont think its 100% a matter of how old it is.Although I agree with your statement.
There are so many things in the bible than just religion and some people take it way too seriously word by word.There are also historical facts too.Its also a history book.Not all the book has to do with religion
There are many things that contradict "teachings" before christ with the ones that were being tought after Christ
For example Solomon tought "an eye for an eye".Christ tought "if someone slaps you on the cheek show the other cheek"
The coming of Jesus Christ was a prophecy with the help of the stars (Qaballah) yet Christianity sees astrology as a satanic or heretic thing.
Also Christians used to wear pentagrams.Today its seen as a symbol of satan
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Originally posted by DeAnna
No...but this is the old testament, where man doesn\'t mean "man-gender" but "man-human"
Ok.But you realise that gay people have the need of a partner as much as you need a partner of the opposite gendre.
Can you imagine yourself without a partner to love and share for the rest of your life?
The way of thinking is wrong.Gays feel love just as we do.They share just like we do to each other.We cant just fight them because we arent like them.They just ARE
i agree with you partially there...
Whats the part you dont agree with
Yes, there are a lot of people out there claiming to be great and awesome Christians...they are mostly hipocrites. I have actually stopped going to church as much b/c of all the hipocrites...
But I really don\'t care what gay people do, I just didn\'t like Hal\'s smart butt comment....
Sometimes its not a matter of hypocricity but a lack of self-awareness."Dont judge if you dont want to be judged".Unfortunately thats a mistake we all do
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HOW COME YOU ME AND YOU ALWAYS END UP IN A FRIKIN ARGUMENT??!??!?!?!
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I personally don\'t think that the bible should be taken as literally as it is. I always had thought that it was just a guide book using exaggerated stories to help guide people in morals. I agree it has SOME good morals. But I don\'t think it should be taken literally or as fact. What I am getting at from project86 is that evolution should not be taught and that creationism is the only true way. I think evolution will be proven true one day as species or even humans evolve, they will look back and see that it is true. I think that many people don\'t even want to know the full evolution picture. It is not just humans evolved from monkeys (which isn\'t the new theory anyway. It is we evolved with monkeys. Humans and Chimps have 98% of the same DNA) and don\'t know the entire picture of evolution and the full theory. They just see that famous chart of the man from a gorilla to a modern man and say that that isn\'t what God teaches us. I\'ve kept a pretty open mind to religion (and starting to look into new religions) and science and I decided that science theories were more correct to me and I accepted them as truth. I looked at both sides of the picture before I decided, just to clear it up before anyone out there thinks I just accept science and don\'t give a rats ass about religion.
Before I decided to become athiest, I believed in a kind of creation/evolution hybrid. God invented the earth and everything in 7days (7 of his days, not earth days) and he\'s the one still working on and perfecting his creations through evolution. Just some food for thought for anyone who just throws out evolution because it is "sacreligious".
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Originally posted by DeAnna
HOW COME YOU ME AND YOU ALWAYS END UP IN A FRIKIN ARGUMENT??!??!?!?!
Because currently its not.Its a conversation :p
And I am informing you because when you read a book its a monologue.You see only one opinion.I ve informed you something about gay people.Now you ve got both sides of the coin.You are free to conclude
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Originally posted by DeAnna
It doesnt say "go to hell" or anything...it says they will be put to death, simply...
Keep your thoughts to yourself if they aren\'t right!!!
AND, I\'m not a bible thumper, but I can tell when someone quotes my guide book wrong
OK so they dont go to hell they die... whats your point? That Im wrong just because I got that part messed up? Thats not what Im arguing, Im arguing that those people are so blinded by their ignorance they feel its ok to discriminate gays just because god doesn\'t like gays :rolleyes:
Its on the same level of ignorance as a muslim killing a jew because theyre jewish.
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ummm...jesus was just a jewish preacher in jerusalem, one of hundreds.
He just pissed off the romans more than others, \'cos he was enigmatic. He was stirring up resentment against the romans, so they killed him. What better way to put an end to roman rule in the jewish world than to martyr a popular local leader, then steamroll it into a religion/revolution?
the whole immaculate conception thing is flawed, too. According to hebrew historians, Mary was a child of 13 or 14. She most likely was taken in by Joseph, in order to save her from being stoned to death for having sex out of wedlock. They then travelled to bethelehem (sp?) to have the child & raise it away from people who knew them. If I remember correctly, the early scriptures never mention mary being a virgin, that came later. It could have been a twisting of words, like "well, he\'s not Joeseph\'s child...etc". Twisted to facilitate the whole Martyr thing, and further the cause of the revolution.
These are just the opinions of an agnostic, trying to make sense of the craziness that I see around me. I do not intend to offend anyone.
Hasn\'t anyone seen "The Life of Brian" by Monty Python? It\'s a little deeper than most people think.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/6305388458/qid=1106278475/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-6843198-4238241?v=glance&s=dvd
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Originally posted by Halberto
OK so they dont go to hell they die... whats your point? That Im wrong just because I got that part messed up? Thats not what Im arguing, Im arguing that those people are so blinded by their ignorance they feel its ok to discriminate gays just because god doesn\'t like gays :rolleyes:
Its on the same level of ignorance as a muslim killing a jew because theyre jewish.
You do understand what God is to Christians, right? There\'s this whole dynamic involving... you know... their entire lives being divoted to him and all... *cough*
If we shouldn\'t judge gays for practicing an unnatural, deviant lifestyle openly, then I see no reason to condemn religious fanatics for hating anyone either. If you do, your selective intolerance is no better than the fanatic\'s.
"...those people are so blinded by their ignorance they feel its ok to discriminate gays..."
You are discriminating (by way of labelling/namecalling/judging) someone for discriminating themselves... you do see the irony? Also, how do you know discrimination is a bigger sin in the eyes of God or the universe than being gay? You obviously don\'t know, for all you know you and the gays are digging yourselves much deeper than the fanatics. It\'s all well and good to say you don\'t believe in God, or don\'t care what God thinks, but I assure you if there is a God, he (or she or it) most certainly believes in you and will not give you some magical \'athiest only\' pass to some alternate, judgment-free afterlife.
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People who call themselves Christians then submit themselves to any form of discrimination are wrong in doing so. “He who is without sin, may he throw the first stone”.
It is possible to disagree with what a person does and still love that person as commanded of us through the Bible. The Old Testament was written to construct laws that were to be used in providing a future for a sovereign nation but since that nation turned it’s back on God so many times those laws have fallen fate to the New Testament. Some of the laws written in the Old Testament for the Levite tribes of men who were to be held accountable for any detestable acts, as they were the governing people for the tribes of Israel. So to have the leaders falter to these ways would make it difficult to set them up as examples for the rest of the nation to follow. However, it was still considered a sin to practice homosexuality for two reasons. One it was a form of idolatry and two it was an act that went against all laws of nature in God’s ideal plan for procreation.
When Jesus came into the picture, the New Testament did not do away with the laws of the old, it only made them more clearly as to why they were written. The people of God are to be as a clean and spotless offering to God and by allowing sin as described in the Bible into their ranks was not acceptable. But through Jesus those who have sinned may find the way to become clean but only through their own willingness to do so. Jesus also put LOVE above all other matters of importance as written in the books by Paul to the church of Ephasis and to those written to in the book of Colossians. In understanding that LOVE should be the cornerstone by which we follow all rules of the Bible we would come to the conclusion that despite what we might not agree with we are to love all and forgive them of their transgressions. Those who have not come to understand the Bible and accept Jesus as their God and savior do not yet understand the rules that Christians live by therefore it is not up to Christians to judge them nor discriminate against them.
So in short, any “Christian” judging those that might call themselves gay is subject to a higher crime as Jesus said himself “judge not lest ye be judged… Vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord…” And please, don’t misunderstand the word LOVE here. It is simply a humanitarian love found of others simply for the fact that we are all created equal in the image and eyes of God. Some fall short of his will and he wishes all to come unto him through his son Jesus Christ but that is something to be dealt with on a personal level.
And DeAnna, when quoting the Bible, try and understand history and context of it as the verse you quoted was specifically written towards the Levites. It applies to all other later when you read about Sodom and Gomorra.
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I must admit project86, well done post. People, IMO just overanalyze everything into a too deep a meaning than what it is supposed to be. People take things in the Bible that are not meant to be taken that way. Besides, the book was written over thousands of years and translated every which way. There is the chance that there are mistranslations (and there are some) and bad transliterations. Personally (like stated before), I just believe the Bible is a moral guide in life using great leaders like Jesus to get their message across. I\'m not refuting that it does have some good morals in it, because it does, I just think it is taken too literally and I don\'t believe it is a book to be taken as fact or a history lesson.
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I must admit project86, well done post. People, IMO just overanalyze everything into a too deep a meaning than what it is supposed to be. People take things in the Bible that are not meant to be taken that way. Besides, the book was written over thousands of years and translated every which way. There is the chance that there are mistranslations (and there are some) and bad transliterations. Personally (like stated before), I just believe the Bible is a moral guide in life using great leaders like Jesus to get their message across. I\'m not refuting that it does have some good morals in it, because it does, I just think it is taken too literally and I don\'t believe it is a book to be taken as fact or a history lesson.
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I must admit project86, well done post. People, IMO just overanalyze everything into a too deep a meaning than what it is supposed to be. People take things in the Bible that are not meant to be taken that way. Besides, the book was written over thousands of years and translated every which way. There is the chance that there are mistranslations (and there are some) and bad transliterations. Personally (like stated before), I just believe the Bible is a moral guide in life using great leaders like Jesus to get their message across. I\'m not refuting that it does have some good morals in it, because it does, I just think it is taken too literally and I don\'t believe it is a book to be taken as fact or a history lesson.
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I must admit TITan, you\'re the king of triple posting.
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Originally posted by Samwise
I must admit TITan, you\'re the king of triple posting.
Well can\'t you see man!? He liked my post so well that he thought it required a tripple post.;)
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Originally posted by EThuggV3
but I assure you if there is a God, he (or she or it) most certainly believes in you and will not give you some magical \'athiest only\' pass to some alternate, judgment-free afterlife.
^because of this, that shows the bias in your opinion. albert einstein said you had to be ignorant to be sure there is a god, he also said you had to be ignorant if youre sure there is no god.
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Albert Einstein was a genius at math/science. He was not a major player in psychology. It would be wise to take his word outside of his field to be far less than gospel.
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So...project, are you atheist or Christian or what???
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Originally posted by DeAnna
So...project, are you atheist or Christian or what???
He\'s a registered sexual offender.
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Non-denominational Christian. I admit to my faults and I don\'t point fingers. Getting along with people despite their beliefs is what I try, even if it goes against what I say. It\'s not my place to force anything on anybody but I would rather understand all sides before placing a lable on somebody.
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Originally posted by Samwise
He\'s a registered sexual offender.
I said Non-Denominational man, not Catholic!;)
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I\'m sure this part of the attraction will piss a few people off:
Other exhibits in the museum will blame homosexuals for Aids. In a "Bible Authority Room" visitors are warned: "Everyone who rejects his history – including six-day creation and Noah\'s flood – is `wilfully\' ignorant.\'\'
Not that I condone poopy pushing, but thats going a little far beyond pushing beliefs
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This all sounds like something Kent Hovind from http://www.drdino.com would say.
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Sorry to change the subject, but while you are here Project....what the crap is your avatar of????
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Originally posted by DeAnna
Sorry to change the subject, but while you are here Project....what the crap is your avatar of????
He\'s trying to see into your sould... don\'t you know? :p
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Originally posted by project86
He\'s trying to see into your sould... don\'t you know? :p
OOOOOOHH.....I get it now :rolleyes:.
I really get a feeling you don\'t like me very much at all...
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Originally posted by DeAnna
OOOOOOHH.....I get it now :rolleyes:.
I really get a feeling you don\'t like me very much at all...
I think you assume too much. DeAnna, I have no problem with you. Maybe in the past we had our problems but as you have stated, you have changed and so be it. If you’re a better user here then you will soon gain my respect…
And the reply to the avatar was a joke. Sorry you didn’t take it that way.
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Originally posted by project86
I think you assume too much
Man, my friends tell me that ALL THE TIME...
Ok, so what is your avatar really???
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Originally posted by DeAnna
Man, my friends tell me that ALL THE TIME...
Perhaps it\'s because you\'re female. Woman always assume too much. :)
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Originally posted by DeAnna
Man, my friends tell me that ALL THE TIME...
Ok, so what is your avatar really???
Recap:
Thread based on the Creation Museum that pissed Titan off…
Christians are racist jerks who hate Homosexuals…
Titan is gay…
Project86 officially posts something worth reading…
Samwise grabs Project86’s butt…
DeAnna gets angry at Project…
Project apologizes to DeAnna…
DeAnna admits to taking life too seriously…
Samwise grabs DeAnna’s butt…
Or at least this is my take on the thread….
Let’s get back on topic people.
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Originally posted by project86
Well can\'t you see man!? He liked my post so well that he thought it required a tripple post.;)
The computers at my school suck so much that it came up as an error so I kept hitting the submit button until I gave up. And project86, I\'m not gay.
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Originally posted by MPTheory
I\'m sure this part of the attraction will piss a few people off:
Other exhibits in the museum will blame homosexuals for Aids. In a "Bible Authority Room" visitors are warned: "Everyone who rejects his history – including six-day creation and Noah\'s flood – is `wilfully\' ignorant.\'\'
Not that I condone poopy pushing, but thats going a little far beyond pushing beliefs
That was the part of the museum that really pissed me off and made me post it.
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Originally posted by Titan
And project86, I\'m not gay.
I meant that in the happy sense...;)
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Originally posted by project86
I meant that in the happy sense...;)
I bet ;) If that\'s the case, this board is really really gay ;)
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Originally posted by project86
Albert Einstein was a genius at math/science. He was not a major player in psychology. It would be wise to take his word outside of his field to be far less than gospel.
first off, this isnt psychology this is philosophy. second, that doesnt make his opinion any more or less credibal
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Tit for tat bud. Makes no difference to me but if you want to base your arguments on a quote from a simple man that made a name for himself through the science of mathematics then so be it.
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Originally posted by Halberto
^because of this, that shows the bias in your opinion. albert einstein said you had to be ignorant to be sure there is a god, he also said you had to be ignorant if youre sure there is no god.
My opinion has bias? That\'s odd, because I neither believe God does exisist, nor do I believe God does not exist. I\'m an open-minded athiest. Open-minded in that I do not assume either way, not in that I am open to adopting anyone elses view. So... I\'m not sure what bias I have.
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Originally posted by EThuggV3
My opinion has bias? That\'s odd, because I neither believe God does exisist, nor do I believe God does not exist. I\'m an open-minded athiest. Open-minded in that I do not assume either way, not in that I am open to adopting anyone elses view. So... I\'m not sure what bias I have.
Interesting. I used to be pretty openminded towards both but I am no doubt more biased towards athiesm. Why? I\'ve had religion pushed on me for 18 years by my mom. She\'s a really religious Catholic and even when I told her I was agnostic then athiest, I still found myself at church every sunday. It just seemed to have pushed me away more. I would listen to the scriptures and gospel and just sit there thinking of possible ways to refute it or think about the girl 2 pews infront of me. I should be more open minded than I have been though and I even should admit that. Who knows who\'s side is right. We\'ll all find out soon enough though, won\'t we?
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Originally posted by EThuggV3
My opinion has bias? That\'s odd, because I neither believe God does exisist, nor do I believe God does not exist. I\'m an open-minded athiest. Open-minded in that I do not assume either way, not in that I am open to adopting anyone elses view. So... I\'m not sure what bias I have.
my bad, I missed the if in your statement, so I read "I assure you there is a God"