PSX5Central
Playstation/Gaming Discussions => PS3 Discussion => Topic started by: Animal Mother on May 18, 2005, 09:24:48 AM
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Well, i am a person that has got every single console from the last generation. Dreamcast, Ps2, Gamecube, and Xbox. My console collection this generation will definetly reflect the last generation. I was looking at my entertainment center, and i thought "not much longer now". when i get to upgrade my consoles. I can say that i am most impressed with the PS3, Nintendo sort of got burned at E3, and i think i can hear Microsoft weeping. Even thought the 360 is coming out first, i dont think the library of games will be that amazing, and we are all fimiliar with the Playstation brand.
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There\'s a PS3 thread already.
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yeah i know
thanks for pointing that out.
but i\'m not talking about ps3/ if not the console war in general. thanks.
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We got that over at the console discussion, as well.
Whatever though.
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I\'m still a little disappointed that the PS3 can not be stacked like the PS2 (fat version). The GC is just tiny enough not be get in the way. Entertainment Centers are gonna need more cubby holes.
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I\'ll be more excited when I see some real games.
The tech demos were nice looking, exceptional even-- Killzone, Motorstorm, and Heavenly Sword especially-- and since Sony is claiming they were realtime I expect to see that level of graphics when I turn on my PS3 come next Fall. Anything less will somewhat of a disappoinment.
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about ps3 being stackable... who stacks stuff on top of their ps2? It\'s smaller than nearly all other consumer devices, so not sure why this is such a big deal.
I\'ll probably have mine vertical anyway
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With other words stack the PS3 on stackable objects :p
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Originally posted by Rikku
I\'ll be more excited when I see some real games.
The tech demos were nice looking, exceptional even-- Killzone, Motorstorm, and Heavenly Sword especially-- and since Sony is claiming they were realtime I expect to see that level of graphics when I turn on my PS3 come next Fall. Anything less will somewhat of a disappoinment.
Sony confirmed that killzone was real time??
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I was just watching the conference videos on G4, and Adam Sessler said that Sony said that your mom said they were real-time. j/k:p
Seriously though, the G4 crew that was covering the game conference said that Sony did comment they were real-time. They, like many others, are having a hard time believing it as well.
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Originally posted by JBean
about ps3 being stackable... who stacks stuff on top of their ps2? It\'s smaller than nearly all other consumer devices, so not sure why this is such a big deal.
I\'ll probably have mine vertical anyway
I stacked your momz on top of my PS2! ;) j/k
I have my computer monitor on top of my PS2. My wife\'s PS2 is underneath the smaller DVD player, both hooked up to the TV.
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If you look closely at the Killzone clip : the part where they fight under the bridge is full of hints which imho conclude that part might be realtime :
- lack of casted shadows for some characters.
- some Hellghast characters in the background who do not seem affected by any lightsources ; their shader material just looks like it\'s unlit. Any prerender would render them under influence of the dark parts too.
Anyway, time will tell and speculations either way will be nullified until then.
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Originally posted by Rikku
I was just watching the conference videos on G4, and Adam Sessler said that Sony said that your mom said they were real-time. j/k:p
Seriously though, the G4 crew that was covering the game conference said that Sony did comment they were real-time. They, like many others, are having a hard time believing it as well.
Impossible :eek:
Ok.Now all I want is confirmation that they were indeed on the same PS3 hardware we will see in stores :p
And real games too
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Originally posted by Rikku
Seriously though, the G4 crew that was covering the game conference said that Sony did comment they were real-time. They, like many others, are having a hard time believing it as well.
I actually watched that. G4 is normally horrible, but they did give us direct info. BTW, they said the only thing that was real time was the Unreal 3 engine, nothing else.
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Originally posted by Soul Reaver
I actually watched that. G4 is normally horrible, but they did give us direct info. BTW, they said the only thing that was real time was the Unreal 3 engine, nothing else.
?
I could have sworn they all said Sony commented it was real-time, but they themselves were debating it. Adam Sessler even made the comment that if he doesn\'t get that level of graphics in-game for Killzone then he\'ll be disappointed.
Guess I\'ll have to catch it again to be for sure.
BTW, I believe that Fight Night footage was real-time as well. It was the only other game I think was actually demoed using a controller.
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In addition to the Sony demos being shown by Phil Harrison, the Epic and EA presentations were the only third party portions actually running on the PS3 in real-time. But most of those movies, which I probably watched three or four during rehearsals for the event, look very achievable and some were probably rendered on the actual box but in non-real-time. When a system is year away, heck even with a system is six months away, it is reasonable to expect the power of the dev kits would still only be a fraction of the power of the final system.
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/615/615178p1.html
Now I dont know if when he sais games shown by Phill include Killzone
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Originally posted by Rikku
?
I could have sworn they all said Sony commented it was real-time, but they themselves were debating it. Adam Sessler even made the comment that if he doesn\'t get that level of graphics in-game for Killzone then he\'ll be disappointed.
Guess I\'ll have to catch it again to be for sure.
BTW, I believe that Fight Night footage was real-time as well. It was the only other game I think was actually demoed using a controller.
oh yes that too
Killzone and Fight Night.
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Originally posted by Rikku
I was just watching the conference videos on G4, and Adam Sessler said that Sony said that your mom said they were real-time. j/k:p
Seriously though, the G4 crew that was covering the game conference said that Sony did comment they were real-time. They, like many others, are having a hard time believing it as well.
adam sessler can lick my crack, can\'t stand the guy. It\'s gonna be great if it was done in realtime and all these media types and xbox fans are wrong. Love to see some crow being eaten.
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Looks like Sony and the developers who made the tech demos are the only people who know for certain.
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I don\'t understand how they can easily tell us Fight Night and the Unreal 3 Engine demo are both real time but not Killzone and the others.
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I found this on another forum...
So I got some answers...
My friend works at Axis, an animation studio in the UK ( http://www.axisanimation.com ) It is the same studio that created the first Killzone\'s rendered cinematics (they\'ve got a BAFTA award for it).
Here\'s what he can officially say:
- The trailer was made to the specification of the next-generation hardware and is representative of the look and feel of the actual game.
- Axis has provided the content, models and animation for the trailer. These have been made to fit the specification of the game and are intended to be used in the game.
That\'s all he\'s allowed to say. Interpret it as you will.
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Basically, it\'s a pre-rendered scene that\'s supposed to look like the end product using the actual dev kits.
So, not real time.
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and probably better than what we will see in the first wave of games on the PS3. Meh.
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Originally posted by JBean
I found this on another forum...
representative and this and that and blah blah.
If thats how it is supposed to be like they should show it in real time :mad:
I dont like bs like that.
Now if thats not what we will get I wll be really pissed
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Hello?
*is this thing on?*
They.......WAS.......NOT.........REALTIME.
YOU....WILL....NOT........SEE.......THOSE .......GRAPHICS......AT......LAUNCH.
How hard is that to understand? Some of you act like this is your first console launch. Can\'t read thru simple hype and phrases.
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Microsoft better have a serious trump card, tech tv feels that they blew their xbox 360 wad to soon on MTV, and sony topped them with the PS3, and stole the show at E3... Also, here is an interesting read for ya\'ll, http://news.yahoo.com/s/mc/e3xbox360vsplaystation3
"Make no mistake: the PlayStation 3 is utterly superior in graphics to the Xbox 360 from what has been shown."
I believe it from what i have seen. the xbox 360 seems like like "xbox 1.5" to me. just a minor up grade in graphics. I have chronicles of riddick on xbox, and those graphics are easily comparible to xbox360\'s... The resolution is just higher. what i know is, this console war will probably be the best, but it will also reflect the last (Sony in 1st place, MS in a distant second, and Nintendo in 3rd)
I better get a second job! i have to have them all. :fro:
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Personally, I think Sony will win this one. Sony seems to have the bigger fanbase at the moment.
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Originally posted by Titan
Personally, I think Sony will win this one. Sony seems to have the bigger fanbase at the moment.
Honestly I think that is a given. It will be Sony\'s market to lose for the forseeable future.
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here is another interesting article, where sony states that microsoft is using inferior technology. But what makes me uneasy is the impression i am getting from sony that the ps3 will not be cheap. http://www.reuters.com/audi/newsArticle.jhtml?type=technologyNews&storyID=8534442
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Originally posted by Animal Mother
Microsoft better have a serious trump card, tech tv feels that they blew their xbox 360 wad to soon on MTV, and sony topped them with the PS3, and stole the show at E3... Also, here is an interesting read for ya\'ll, http://news.yahoo.com/s/mc/e3xbox360vsplaystation3
"Make no mistake: the PlayStation 3 is utterly superior in graphics to the Xbox 360 from what has been shown."
I believe it from what i have seen. the xbox 360 seems like like "xbox 1.5" to me. just a minor up grade in graphics. I have chronicles of riddick on xbox, and those graphics are easily comparible to xbox360\'s... The resolution is just higher. what i know is, this console war will probably be the best, but it will also reflect the last (Sony in 1st place, MS in a distant second, and Nintendo in 3rd)
I better get a second job! i have to have them all. :fro:
I\'m glad he enjoyed the tech demos over early games.:rolleyes:
I\'m not going to go through and post all the Microsoft stuff I\'ve read, but MS did not blow their whole wad yet, and everything that\'s been shown is still running on alpha kits (Ballmer claims 30% of what the final product will be, and that beta kits will be available soon with final developer kits sent out in July).
Plus it\'s funny how the media seems to be comparing the worst of the Xbox showings to the best of the PS3 demos. Gears of War and Project Gotham 3 (which are claimed to be real-time) look as good as most of the stuff shown on the PS3 demos. And now there are reports from behind closed doors that Perfect Dark Zero looks as good as Gears of War (go to IGN for the update; no pics yet).
My thoughts: Way too early to call, but next-gen is already shaping up to be alot of fun.
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Originally posted by Animal Mother
here is another interesting article, where sony states that microsoft is using inferior technology. But what makes me uneasy is the impression i am getting from sony that the ps3 will not be cheap. http://www.reuters.com/audi/newsArticle.jhtml?type=technologyNews&storyID=8534442
That\'s funny because there\'s a report with MS saying that the PS3 is inferior is some aspects as well. It\'s a pissing contest.
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PS3 is inferior with Dots Per Second
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:laughing:
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But it\'s about twice the performance in most other aspects. NVIDIA did well with this GPU.
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Dots per second eh ? ..............................................................................................................:laughing:
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The speaker for NVIDIA was talking about how important they were at the Sony Conference...
That and the amount of shader operations.
I don\'t know what the hell a dot is, but it\'s probably not literally "dots".
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I would think a dot = pixel. Which would mean each pixel can be manipulated instead of multiple pixels making up a polygon.
But thats my educational guess
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Originally posted by EviscerationX
I don\'t know what the hell a dot is, but it\'s probably not literally "dots".
I feel a quoted signature comming on.
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Originally posted by ddaryl
I would think a dot = pixel. Which would mean each pixel can be manipulated instead of multiple pixels making up a polygon.
But thats my educational guess
They were talking about how each pixel can be manipulated...so that\'s probably a good assumption.
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With the Nvdia partnership,rest assured jaggies are things of the past.
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Originally posted by EviscerationX
But it\'s about twice the performance in most other aspects. NVIDIA did well with this GPU.
Read
Hardware:
Also, I think it is very interesting that Sony is playing the floating point calculation game. This has always been a very dirty game that technology companies have played over the years. It\'s very similiar with watt ratings of speaker companies. Why does Bose only claim to have 600 watts yet it sounds louder and clearer than my system that is rated at 1000? Of course you have questions such as "Is it 1000 watts RMS or peak?" The same can be said about flop ratings. Are your flop ratings theoretical or actual performance ratings? How are you measuring them? Nvidia has been known to use a flop measurments that advantage their hardware, for example. As far as Sony is telling the consumer, their RSX gpu performs at 1.8 Tflops while 360\'s GPU only runs around 750 Gflops. If you were to actually believe these numbers, you would be forced to come to the conclusion that 360\'s GPU is not even half as capable as PS3\'s. Is Nvidia\'s card really over two times as powerful as ATI\'s? Of course not. The 10 Mb of integrated DRAM has something to say about that as well as 48 pipelines and ambiguous shader processing.
Also, I will bring up Sony\'s wonderful powerpoint presentation that showed the STARK contrast between PS3\'s floating point performance and Xbox 360\'s. 360 can do 1.33 Tflops while PS3 can do over 2 Tflops. Sounds impressive, no? First, I will restate the fact that flop measurements are and have been a very dirty business that, if done the right way, can make anyone look good. According to Sony\'s flop performance of the "Emotion Engine," it actually run around three times the flops as Xbox\'s yet look at the results. Of course there were API issues as well as memory bottlenecks and dedicated GPU\'s but you get my point. Also, anyone notice that the Cell processor that was on the power point was rated at 3.8 Ghz and yet, just a few minutes later, the specs for PS3 were flashed on screen and it showed the Cell in PS3 as being 3.2 Ghz?? Pretty sneaky and I would argue, pretty much lying. If Sony would have actually shown the "genuine" floating point rating of the Cell chip that was actually being used with PS3, as well as ATI using the same boosted math as Nvidia, we would be realizing that there is not as big of a difference between the two hardware configurations as Sony would like you to believe.
As far as similiar memory goes, while they both have a total of 512 Mb\'s of RAM, it would be more accurate to say that PS3 has 256 Mb of Ram available to the CPU and GPU at any one time while 360 has 512 Mb of Ram available where needed between the CPU and GPU. Also, as stated before, 360\'s 10 Mb of EDRAM on the GPU is, while a seeminly small number, huge for being accessible with pretty much zero latency for use with AA and blurring effects without practically any hit on GPU performance. Giving the developers freedom to allocate memory where they need it is a huge bonus but it is yet to be seen whether the 256 Mb\'s of XDR running at 2.4 Ghz is going to make the difference for the lack of unified memory or the EDRAM.
Finally, as much as I would like to look at pure theoretical performance, I think it would ignorant of me to do so. We have two deliberate architectures that the companies are going for. PS3 is aiming for the highest theoretical performance as possible while 360 is shooting for the most capable setup possible. M$ is giving developers a lot of freedom to put what they want, where they want it. The ambiguous nature of M$\'s three PPE\'s and the unified memory architecture allow developers to allocate performance wherever they want. Also, less is more when it comes to taking advantage of total system performance, as far as threads go. The more threads to assign tasks to, the more difficult to program for, thus leading to more tendency to not use all the power that you can. While having two less threads than PS3 can be a theoretical downfall, it also makes the programming 1/3 more accessible.
There are many comparisons being drawn from many different sources, the one above being the easiest to read. The unanimous conclusion is that PS3 is in fact more powerful, but not by such a big margin as a straight number comparison would lead you to believe. The architectures are different, and not to mention they have yet to be finalized.
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Where\'s the part about the NVIDIA GPU having damn near twice as many transistors as the ATI GPU? ;)
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Do you even know?
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Know what?
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The implications of having more transistors.
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:stick:
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Seven can answer :D
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I\'m just saying there\'s alot more to account for than simply stacking numbers against each other.
seven\'s more than welcome to explain.
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Well, all i know is that having more transistors on a slab of sillicon means more heatproduction and more energy greedy.
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I have the impression that the biggest difference between PS3\'s and XBOX360\'s performance will be thanks to PS3\'s Cell processor.
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The more transistors you can fit on a chip, the more processing power you can have. The closer they are, the faster they can transfer signals between themselves, which will make the console run faster.
More transistors = more horsepower. But that isn\'t the only factor, but it is a damn important one. Also, the CPU and the GPU need to work well with each other, which Sony described at the Conference, so I don\'t think there\'s a problem there.
I know you can\'t just compare numbers, but things like this are just obvious.
Well, all i know is that having more transistors on a slab of sillicon means more heatproduction and more energy greedy.
That\'s probably why the thing is so huge...and all that crap they\'re putting under the hood. Plus, it\'s not the final design (hopefully...and if it isn\'t the final design, I hope they make it smaller, because DAMN!).
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please please stop with all that combobulated, technical crap,,break that s**t down to my understanding....:mad: :D...
both consoles are gonna do great this time around...and i gotta give credit to the box..cause when they first came into the game i thought they wouldn\'t stand a chance against sony or nintendo..and even tho i probably won\'t get a box, even tho i\'m highly impressed with that gear game, the box is here to stay...i\'m still rollin with sony...
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Well, it has a way smaller instruction set window and a shorter pipeline than traditional x86 cpu\'s
The 7 spe\'s are like specialists. They\'ll probably suck at any comparable pc desktop task. That\'s why the relatively simple main core is there to \'direct\' those spe\'s.
Rambus\' Xdram should deliver all the bandwidth and speed it needs.
The Nvidia RSX packs a hefty punch as well though with all the provided CG tools for PS3.
I\'m very happy with my Geforce6800GT. It just runs sm3.0 HDR very well. Yeah, after the FX farce, they sure made a comeback.
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Plus Cell was specifically designed for multimedia tasks, and gaming is obviously one of them.
Rambus\' Xdram should deliver all the bandwidth and speed it needs.
I hope so. And that 256MB of VRAM is just nuts compared to PS2\'s...what...4?
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Interesting times ahead, glad to see that Sony has the most powerful hardware for a change (first time ever? ;) ) ..
When the "good" developers get their hands on this system I think we will see some magical stuff..
Cant wait for the new Metal Gear and Gran Turismo games. Also I\'d like to see what Team ICO can cook up on this monster (they might not be the best coders in the world but they sure can design wonderful games!), then we have Namco, Capcom, the SCEA divisions -Naughty Dog which should be VERY interesting, they created one of the most amazing graphics engines of this generation!- plus SCEE.. That Getaway demo running of the Cell processor really impressed me.
Good times.. :)
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Especially considering that the FF7 demo was even better looking that the CGI intro :eek:
The draw distance and detail is breathtaking.
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Yeah FFVII was something special, I just wish Square would release a remake of that game. :)
Another game that was impressive was Heavenly Sword. SCEE recently bought the rights to that game IIRC..
It was being rendered by the in game engine, here are a few screens.
http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/700/700186/imgs_1.html
Btw, where the hell was FFXII during E3? I havent seen much about it yet?
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Yeah FFVII was something special, I just wish Square would release a remake of that game.
Some people at the GameSpot forums e-mailed Square-Enix and received this e-mail:
Subject: RE: REMAKE FFVII (#8463-25783808-3135)
Date: 5/19/2005 11:15:52 AM Eastern Standard Time
From: support@square-enix-usa.com
Reply To:
To: ****************
CC:
BCC:
Sent on:
Sent from the Internet (Details)
Thank you for contacting the Square Enix Customer Support,
We understand your concern about the remake of FFVII. It has not been completely ruled out and there is a good possibility of it being remade.
Thanks,
Square Enix Customer Support
support@square-enix-usa.com
It could mean something...it could NOT mean something...but it is still interesting, nonetheless. *crosses fingers*
Btw, where the hell was FFXII during E3? I havent seen much about it yet?
The only thing I saw was the FFXII video they showed at the Sony Conference. It was just FMV sequences, though.
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Yeah, its weird.. They had a playable demo of the game in some other show a few months back and now nothing?
Thanks for posting the email, that got my hopes up a bit. :D
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Originally posted by fastson
Yeah FFVII was something special, I just wish Square would release a remake of that game. :)
Another game that was impressive was Heavenly Sword. SCEE recently bought the rights to that game IIRC..
It was being rendered by the in game engine, here are a few screens.
Oh yes I ve seen the video. :)
Originally posted by EviscerationX
Some people at the GameSpot forums e-mailed Square-Enix and received this e-mail:
It could mean something...it could NOT mean something...but it is still interesting, nonetheless. *crosses fingers*
If that happens I ll be one of the happiest people on earth
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If that happens I ll be one of the happiest people on earth
Me too.
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Sony Executive VP Jack Trenton says Killzone is gameplay footage,
He does it in an interview with G4TV and can be seen at IGN scrolll to the 3:35 mark to hear the quote
http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/748/748475/vids_1.html
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Originally posted by ddaryl
Sony Executive VP Jack Trenton says Killzone is gameplay footage,
He does it in an interview with G4TV and can be seen at IGN scrolll to the 3:35 mark to hear the quote
http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/748/748475/vids_1.html
What\'s funny about that is the team responsible for the video said that it was only a representation of what they are going for, not actual gameplay.
Is he a liar, ignorant, or just a cog in the hype machine?
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If its true then damn :)
That would explain some "mistakes" not usually seen in CGI
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Originally posted by Rikku
What\'s funny about that is the team responsible for the video said that it was only a representation of what they are going for, not actual gameplay.
Is he liar, ignorant, or just a cog in the hype machine?
Probably the cog :p
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Originally posted by Rikku
What\'s funny about that is the team responsible for the video said that it was only a representation of what they are going for, not actual gameplay.
Is he liar, ignorant, or just a cog in the hype machine?
I choose C.) cog in the hype machine
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they had 7 months maximum to make that freaking killzone demo if its true that they got the first Dev kit in November.The presentation was made at 17th of may.The trailer was finished at 14th of may so there goes half of month.And lets say that they also took the Dev Kits in the midle of November there goes another half of a month.
What is left?6 months to do such astounding graphics in real time? :eek:
Sounds impossible.
Although I am still finding more flaws.Just noticed that there is some slight draw distance pop up.Very hard to notice
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Here\'s a strange thing:
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There are more strange things.There is a floating body and the ships vanish.
Even a character pops up.
Try the IGN video if the one you posted is the one you have.IGN\'s is direct feed.And you ll find more mistakes
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First two pics: Nothing then BOOM Character pops up.Its magic
Red cycle: Body flying.You can see his shadow under him.Thats the power of Yoga
Green: Do you see the destroyied ship? NOW YOU DONT.Its magic I tell ya
All ships, bodies, soldiers, pieces gone.David would have been jealous.
Hint about the plot: Killzone is set in the Bermuda Triangle:eek:
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But they told us, that the "Demo" was finished only 3 days before E3... so maybe they couldn\'t fix all the mistakes ?!
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Linky Link (http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/748/748475/vid_1134552.html?mu=http%3A%2F%2Fstreamingmovies.ign.com%2Fps3%2Farticle%2F617%2F617862%2Fg4_e305live_day3_jtretton_wmvlow.wmv)
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http://www.ps3grill.com/
:laughing:
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See, those screencaps strengthen my theory.
Guerrilla had the alpha kits since november. Then they got this base engine
code up and running. So, basically only the graphics, no AI or gameplay mechanics.
Getting up to that point probably took them somewhere around April or begin May. So, they knew they had to show something at E3.
They took that alpha code engine, animated the whole sequence and recorded it at visual settings (amount of particle fx, quality of textures/shaders etc) according to what they see as feasible on final PS3 specs.
So, yes it is most likely a movie clip recorded from the engine and that\'s why you see those graphics errors in it which would NOT happen in a prerendered CGi movie as we know it.
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Originally posted by THE EYE
But they told us, that the "Demo" was finished only 3 days before E3... so maybe they couldn\'t fix all the mistakes ?!
Never seen such mistakes in a CGI movie.They probably did it to reduce objects on screen and maintain framerate constant.
There is also some slight draw distance pop up.Hard to notice but if you look carefully you ll see it near the beginning of the demo when one of the ships gets shot in the air.
The clouds in the beginning of the movie are flat too.
What I find amazing though if its indeed real time are the smoke effects and explosions.I ve never seen smoke and explosion effects look like that in a real time engine ever.
Even the Unreal3 engine tech demo showed flat "sprite" looking explosions.
There are other "flaws" I wanted to capture and post but didnt manage.Near the end of the video the character\'s shoulder flickers once.
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I\'ve only worked with the 3d animation program 3dsmax but I can tell you that there can be errors in the rendering process. Collision of objects (the gun in the ground) can definitely show up if you don\'t have proper collision detection.
I believe someone mentioned clipping on one of the guy\'s shoulders; that can happen during a render. It has to do with the camera.
I\'ve never had pop-up during a render, but there can be draw-in. The camera will pick up anything you put in the distance setting. That\'s not conclusive.
It could have been a composite of pre-rendered objects and real-time objects.
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Originally posted by fastson
Yeah FFVII was something special, I just wish Square would release a remake of that game. :)
Another game that was impressive was Heavenly Sword. SCEE recently bought the rights to that game IIRC..
It was being rendered by the in game engine, here are a few screens.
http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/700/700186/imgs_1.html
Btw, where the hell was FFXII during E3? I havent seen much about it yet?
They say that the FFVII video was real time. If so then DAMN. I wish they would re make the game. They dont have to make any big changes or anything. But to just play the game looking like that with some extras would be awesome imo. I dont know if they should include voice acting though. That could make or break the game.
About FFXII: I thought that was coming out for ps2 not ps3?
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I wish Square would remake Vagrant Story, or a sequel to it.
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Originally posted by Rikku
I\'ve only worked with the 3d animation program 3dsmax but I can tell you that there can be errors in the rendering process. Collision of objects (the gun in the ground) can definitely show up if you don\'t have proper collision detection.
I believe someone mentioned clipping on one of the guy\'s shoulders; that can happen during a render. It has to do with the camera.
I\'ve never had pop-up during a render, but there can be draw-in. The camera will pick up anything you put in the distance setting. That\'s not conclusive.
It could have been a composite of pre-rendered objects and real-time objects.
It was also confirmed to be real-time. SO um...yeah.
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Originally posted by ddaryl
I wish Square would remake Vagrant Story, or a sequel to it.
Damn right
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Originally posted by Lord Nicon
They say that the FFVII video was real time. If so then DAMN. I wish they would re make the game. They dont have to make any big changes or anything. But to just play the game looking like that with some extras would be awesome imo. I dont know if they should include voice acting though. That could make or break the game.
About FFXII: I thought that was coming out for ps2 not ps3?
at first i thought naw why make a remake of ff7? complete waste of time...but after seein that vid..sheeit..yo, they need to drop the remake! :D...voice acting wouldn\'t be so bad..but the voices would absolutely have to match the characters nearly perfect...
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About FFXII: I thought that was coming out for ps2 not ps3?
It\'s for PS2 and it\'s a 2006 release.
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Originally posted by EviscerationX
It was also confirmed to be real-time. SO um...yeah.
You\'re going to have to do better than that. Link?
The people who did it couldn\'t even confirm that it was real-time, only that it was "representative of what they want to achieve" and that "it\'s done to spec."
Confirmed? Prove it.
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Link (http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/748/748475/vid_1134552.html?mu=http%3A%2F%2Fstreamingmovies.ign.com%2Fps3%2Farticle%2F617%2F617862%2Fg4_e305live_day3_jtretton_wmvlow.wmv)
Either he\'s flat out lying, or there may be some truth to it.
You should watch the Killzone video again. The freakin\' clouds in the beggining are flat. That\'s some good pre-rendered action right there.
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Originally posted by EviscerationX
Link (http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/748/748475/vid_1134552.html?mu=http%3A%2F%2Fstreamingmovies.ign.com%2Fps3%2Farticle%2F617%2F617862%2Fg4_e305live_day3_jtretton_wmvlow.wmv)
Either he\'s flat out lying, or there may be some truth to it.
You should watch the Killzone video again. The freakin\' clouds in the beggining are flat. That\'s some good pre-rendered action right there.
We already went over Jack Trenton. He\'s lying. He said it was actual gameplay, and you should know that\'s bullshit. If it was actual gameplay then the developers would come right out and say it, not resort to "it\'s representative blah, blah, blah" and Harrison\'s "it\'s done to spec" and "some things were rendered."
I\'ve seen that Killzone video enough, and the truth is there\'s not enough evidence to condemn it or crown it a shining achievement. It could be a mix of pre-rendered sequences and real-time, but one thing is for sure and that is it\'s not gameplay.
Jack Trenton = Liar
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I\'m just going to wait for actual games to start being shown, like I said before. It\'s too early to tell if anything is as it seems.
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Originally posted by Rikku
You\'re going to have to do better than that. Link?
The people who did it couldn\'t even confirm that it was real-time, only that it was "representative of what they want to achieve" and that "it\'s done to spec."
Confirmed? Prove it.
Thats somewhat ambiguous.Even if its real time they would have said the same thing since its just a Tech Demo.Not a game.
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I don\'t even care anymore. This whole thing is a joke.
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Yes it is.But I know that you care :p
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I really don\'t. I just want to play some games. :(
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But with those graphics and atmosphere :p
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Originally posted by Rikku
I\'ve only worked with the 3d animation program 3dsmax but I can tell you that there can be errors in the rendering process.
Lol. In prerendered CGi form, this footage would still have been pretty costy. Any 3D animator who would have allowed for such mistakes in a costy production would have been fired. Dynamics in modern day 3D apps are btw too good to have such fuckups happen.
No, this footage is recorded alpha code and the mistakes include fuckups from the realtime collision detection system.
And the other evidence is just too strong : alot of background scenery and some shaders, oddly seem to be unaffected by lighting/shadowing.
Yeah, I can very much imagine Pixar to make their next cgi movie with random objects/characters/shaders which have tags to them which tell the renderfile to to stay unaffected by Global Illumination or to simply NOT render these :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by Knotter8
Lol. In prerendered CGi form, this footage would still have been pretty costy. Any 3D animator who would have allowed for such mistakes in a costy production would have been fired. Dynamics in modern day 3D apps are btw too good to have such fuckups happen.
No, this footage is recorded alpha code and the mistakes include fuckups from the realtime collision detection system.
And the other evidence is just too strong : alot of background scenery and some shaders, oddly seem to be unaffected by lighting/shadowing.
Yeah, I can very much imagine Pixar to make their next cgi movie with random objects/characters/shaders which have tags to them which tell the renderfile to to stay unaffected by Global Illumination or to simply NOT render these :rolleyes:
Any you\'re still not sure, are you?
Guerilla != Pixar
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Originally posted by Unicron!
Never seen such mistakes in a CGI movie.They probably did it to reduce objects on screen and maintain framerate constant.
There is also some slight draw distance pop up.Hard to notice but if you look carefully you ll see it near the beginning of the demo when one of the ships gets shot in the air.
The clouds in the beginning of the movie are flat too.
What I find amazing though if its indeed real time are the smoke effects and explosions.I ve never seen smoke and explosion effects look like that in a real time engine ever.
Even the Unreal3 engine tech demo showed flat "sprite" looking explosions.
There are other "flaws" I wanted to capture and post but didnt manage.Near the end of the video the character\'s shoulder flickers once.
That could be my words Unicron... in a more "complex" way ! :D
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I like simplicity :D
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Showing the true face of PS3 games, King Kong:
(https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimage.com.com%2Fgamespot%2Fimages%2F2005%2F137%2F924960_20050518_screen001.jpg&hash=989ec90f4212e687aa7424836a798d842ea1beac)
Wow.
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That\'s an Xbox 360 game retard. And everyone is talking about how crappy that game looks. That\'s not a comparison for anything. PS2 has better graphics than that, and the developers of King Kong need to be shot.
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Or PS2 game, I think the same pics are uploaded there too.
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Any way you look at it...the developers need to be shot.
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after checkin\' out this god of war pic...i agree with evi...
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Who cares about graphics. Another good Turok game would be fun. ;]
-Dan
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Originally posted by Eiksirf
Who cares about graphics. Another good Turok game would be fun. ;]
-Dan
The company that made Turok went out of business.
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Originally posted by Eiksirf
Who cares about graphics. Another good Turok game would be fun. ;]
-Dan
obviously we all do...if we didn\'t we\'d still be playin\' atari...
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Originally posted by Hawke
Showing the true face of PS3 games, King Kong:
Wow.
That pic looks terrible, and can be done on the PS2 IMO. Plus the PS3 dev kits do not feature the final RSX GPU. King kong is a multi platform game so I\'ll bet this pic hasn\'t even seen a next gen dev kit yet.
Originally posted by clips
after checkin\' out this god of war pic...i agree with evi...
I just finished God of War and it is a very very nice game graphically. What\'s really cool is the gameplay and story matches the visuals. It\'s a triple threat !!
Fixed camera angles are drag in any action adventure game IMO, but overall I would recommend it to everyone who enjoys a excellent hack and slash
Heck the Graphics in God of War look better then the King Kong posted by hawke
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Originally posted by ddaryl
Heck the Graphics in God of War look better then the King Kong posted by hawke [/B]
that\'s the comparison i was tryin to make when i posted that god of war pic! :p..and i agree with you about god of war...i purchased it awhile back...great game!...
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Originally posted by Hawke
Showing the true face of PS3 games, King Kong:
(https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimage.com.com%2Fgamespot%2Fimages%2F2005%2F137%2F924960_20050518_screen001.jpg&hash=989ec90f4212e687aa7424836a798d842ea1beac)
Wow.
That looks like PSX1 game with better resolution
Disgusting
Even Dino Crisis looked better than that. [mm mode]*vomits*[/mm mode]
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Acclaim made Juiced too. That\'ll be coming out from THQ soon. And I was referring to that King Kong thing as a Turok game because.... ya know, nevermind.
-Dan
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Okay, so the King Kong game turned out to be running on XBox hardware at E³ after all. Which is a real relief. As soon as next gen screenies surface, you\'ll be able to do a side-by-side comparison. Sorry about that :)
I studied some more into it, and King Kong\'s actually backed up by people who were behind Beyond Good & Evil, which sounds either great or frightening, depending on how you look at it.
Beyond Good & Evil had more heart than all the next generation games shown at this year\'s E³ put together. Graphics, yay, how about some original content and memorable experiences.
HAWKY WANT KATAMARI!!!!!
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Originally posted by Rikku
Any you\'re still not sure, are you?
Guerilla != Pixar
you\'re still not getting the point eh ?
The matter is not about that specific piece of Killzone footage anyway. Ppl are circumventing the real issue.
The question is and should be : will the actual game code look anywhere near that footage ( wether it was realtime, prerendered or a mix ) ?
The only public answer which matters is from Jan Bart van Beek from Guerilla and he went on record that final code will look very much like that.
and a \'yes it will look like that\' would certainly induce some fear in the little hearts of those Xbox360 fanboys and girls
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Originally posted by Knotter8
The only public answer which matters is from Jan Bart van Beek from Guerilla and he went on record that final code will look very much like that.
and a \'yes it will look like that\' would certainly induce some fear in the little hearts of those Xbox360 fanboys and girls
No, what matters is that Sony passed it off as real-time footage. That\'s under debate and so far there is no clear answer except that it was not actual gameplay, as Sony VP Jack Trenton tried to say it was.
I don\'t doubt the game will look good, and probably very close to what we\'ve seen.
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Originally posted by Hawke
Beyond Good & Evil had more heart than all the next generation games shown at this year\'s E³ put together. [/B]
no doubt, i think i spoke to you in another thread about beyond good and evil...it\'s a shame that we didn\'t the sequel for it..it baffles me that the game had such poor sales...s**t they should\'ve made the sequel anyway...that s**t couldn\'t have been as bad as army men right? i\'ve seen so many versions of army men, it\'s not even funny...and that game is wack as hell...