PSX5Central
Non Gaming Discussions => Off-Topic => Topic started by: THX on April 11, 2006, 07:41:44 PM
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Guess this is being passed around:
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More than 36,000 students from throughout Los Angeles County, California skipped classes and marched through streets and on various freeways Monday, March 27, 2006, to protest an immigration bill being debated in Congress. "We may be illegal immigrants, but we are human," Metropolitan High School senior Melania Preciado said as she waved a Mexican flag. "We deserve the same rights as everyone else, not be treated like criminals." What an ironic statement.
If we all went to Mexico...would we be treated as humans?? (Think of all your friends who have driven down to Mexico for a weekend trip and were either thrown in jail for looking at the Mexican police the wrong way, or were pulled over for no apparent reason and FORCED to pay off the Mexican police in order NOT to be thrown in jail)...
1. Try driving around as a Gringo in Mexico with no liability insurance, and have an accident.
2. Enter MEXICO illegally - never mind immigration quotas, visas, international law, or any of that nonsense.
3. Once there, demand that the local government provide free medical care for you and your entire family.
4. Demand bilingual nurses and doctors.
5. Demand free bilingual local government forms, bulletins, etc.
6. Speak only English at home and in public and insist that your children do likewise.
7. Demand classes on American culture in the Mexican school system.
8. Demand a local Mexican drivers license. This will afford other legal rights and will go far to legitimize your unauthorized, illegal, presence in Mexico.
9. Insist that local Mexican law enforcement teach English to all its officers.
Good luck!
It will not happen in Mexico nor any other country in the world...except right here in the United States... Land of those who want to take care of everyone, except American Citizens!
These "student" protesters, haven\'t the slightest clue as to what the hell is really going on. They just want an excuse to leave school. What a disgrace to AMERICA, our country!
If you\'re going to wave a Mexican flag to support your heritage, fine... Just make sure there is an American one next to it...the land that gives to all of its immigrants, and you. IF Mexico is SOOOOO great - Why leave it and come to America? Think about it! Mexico isn\'t giving their people what they deserve, and that\'s why they want to be here in America. What is Mexico really doing for its people, other than making them desparate to leave? This is not about people coming to America...just come legally, so the legal system, education, medical, housing, etc., can operate more smoothly and fair for those who are citizens, and those who long to be.
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With the economy on the downturn, immigrants make an easy (and perhaps even justified) target for politicians to tackle. Frankly, I have no sympathy for first gen illegal immigrants* anywhere, but second generation are a different case for me. That said, it shouldn\'t be automatic~ that just because one member of the family is allowed to stay it automatically means all the others can come in too.
While I can see the human rights argument and general rights, the simple fact is deportation isn\'t a violation of human rights, at least deportation to Mexico isn\'t. Sure, life will be better in the USA, which is whey they came in the first place, but deportation is necessary, because uncontrolled immigration can quickly saturate and overload social programs and education.
Going to be an interesting time if this bill passes.
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The PC section
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*immigrants does not equal refugees, naturalized citizens, special cases.
~While technically it isn\'t automatic I think that once one member of a family gets a foothold in a developed country, they tend to want to bring their relatives over.
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If they came here illegally, send them packing. They are criminals. They are here illegally and thus should be treated as criminals.
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If they came here illegally, send them packing. They are criminals. They are here illegally and thus should be treated as criminals.
well i wouldn\'t go as far as to calling them criminals, but i do feel that they need to go thru the necessary process of becoming a citizen. And everything that THX posted in that letter is true,..not to be harsh, but those are just the facts....and another thing these people need to realize,..they are not the only one\'s tryin to strive for a better life,..sheeit, i\'ve been here all of my life, and i\'m still tryin to get to a better position at this point in my life as i\'m sure every american is constantly strivin to improve their lifestyle,...just because we\'re american citizens doesn\'t mean we\'re automatically sittin on pots of gold...all americans are struggling just to stay above water,...alot of americans are just livin\' from paycheck to paycheck,...
i really see no need for them to be marchin like that if you\'re here illegally, you\'re gonna get sent back,...i got luv for my latino peeps, but then again whenever haitians come here illegally guess what?..they make it top priority to ship them back...so again and this just doesn\'t go out to the latinos,..it goes for every immigrant that\'s here illegally, just apply for your citizenship and all is well....
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They committed a crime, but don\'t treat them as criminals?
Please. Be legit or get out and stop mooching off the system. We can\'t sustain our system as it is, let alone with people feeding off it.
"Treat us like humans, not criminals." Newsflash: criminals are humans. That\'s like saying "treat me like a human, not a man." The whole thing is retarded.
If these were people who rob convenience stores protesting their right to be treated fairly, you\'d see it was stupid. Well an illegal immigrant is a thief, on purpose or not, so it\'s actually the same scenario.
-Dan
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This thread: so far, so good.
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It\'s not like the US is the land of the free... and based on immigration... or something...
Nah, just yanking your chain, I fully support what THX said. :D
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I don\'t get it. The Europeans applied for their citizenship from the Natives when they arrived, right?
Fair is fair.
-Dan
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Depends on the case. Short answer, yes (manhattan land deal, conquering).
Simple fact is, that the global landscape of the 16th and 17th centuries during world colonization is different from the current global landscape.
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why is Mexico so poor though? Is Mexico a democratic/republican country or it\'s one of those dictactor communist country?
What is going on in Mexico that makes them illegally migrate to U.S. so bad though?
Why can\'t they just come here legally though?
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The way I look at it is like that children\'s book If you give a mouse a cookie
give them bilingual schools
give them free health care
now, give them their undeserving citizenship.... with all that other stuff too
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why is Mexico so poor though? Is Mexico a democratic/republican country or it\'s one of those dictactor communist country?
What is going on in Mexico that makes them illegally migrate to U.S. so bad though?
Why can\'t they just come here legally though?
did you grow up on a farm?
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nah, just grow up in a cave...
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Mexico basically missed the boat on the whole industrial revolution. Their population base was overly large and under educated, and they missed that magical window for massive early improvement that would have let them keep up with their neighbor to the north. Going back further, they were colonized by Spain, and when comparing the two, the British method of colonization (self sufficient colonies/companies expansion) totally decimated the Spanish/French methods of supportive colonization.
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^^^
True. That and Mexico was under the most corrupt governments ever. PRI was a death dealer to the country.
And I read the first post. Did anybody see the marches accross the nation? There were plenty of American flags.
I think we should be post-conventional when it comes to this kind of issue. Is breaking a law more important than saving your family? As long as the law broken does not injure or harm anybody, then I would say that we are morally tied to protect our families. That is why we go to war, that is why we work even when sick and that is why they broke a single law.
The whole bilingual issue...I still think that we can all benefit from learning a second language. Also, it is proved that adults have a harder time learning a new language. This country has no standarized language and it is a country filled with many languages. In any case, most of the people that do not know English are older Hispanics or those that just got to the States. Their children are learning English and they will continue their education in English. Our tax dollars are also spent learning French, German, Italian, Latin etc...I do not see a difference.
BTW...go to Mexico. Spring Break I was at Puerto Vallarta and I heard nothing but English coming from the staff. They adapted to American tourist. So, it is not as if any American is going to actually going to move to Mexico. Therefore, I do not see any relevance to the whole "why dont we go to Mexico and try it!" argument.
And as for as I can see. None of you have provided a reasonable way to deal with the problem. You can\'t kick them all out. You can\'t turn your heads. The recent marches have struck everybody. I\'m glad congress is feeling the pressure.
I have given blood, donated money, worked and have a credit card debt.
My parents have a house, car, credit card, pay their taxes but get no income tax return. My two cousins in Iraq are both daughters of illegal immigrants.
My aunts husband is a veteran...he entered illegaly.
Do not try to uphold laws such as the one you claim so much in this post to be important over somebody\'s life. If so, then we should pull over all people speeding over 55 or 65, put in jail those that litter and jaywalk and arrest everybody that does not make a complete stop at a stop sign...
Impossible.
BTW. When I get a speeding ticket. I got to court, pay a fine and take a classes on what is right and wrong. And I am free. Am I being given a pardon or did I pay my punishment for breaking the law?
How is paying 2000 dollars, taking classes and learning English giving away citizenship and how can you not consider it a punishment for their crime??
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Didn\'t you get the memo?
This was a no Mystique thread gosh.
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You didn\'t break a law Mistique. I agree with you on the military thing too, it is very hypocritical to be labeled illegal but go through the military to fight a war.
That should be stopped
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Service Guarantees Citizenship!
You know it\'s coming eventually....
(https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ghosts.org%2Fverhoeven%2Fstarship%2Fstlogo3.jpg&hash=3996967982581f8ead3419dc48d72805e982bf09)
(https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ghosts.org%2Fverhoeven%2Fstarship%2Fstlogo6.jpg&hash=f732a64025b79ab5a9fd1a16030aaa4cfaf87a5a)
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You know it\'s coming eventually....
(https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ghosts.org%2Fverhoeven%2Fstarship%2Fstlogo3.jpg&hash=3996967982581f8ead3419dc48d72805e982bf09)
(https://psx5central.com/community/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ghosts.org%2Fverhoeven%2Fstarship%2Fstlogo6.jpg&hash=f732a64025b79ab5a9fd1a16030aaa4cfaf87a5a)
:rofl: I wouldn\'t put it past the military. They are really struggling getting recruits. I wonder if they will put a policy like that through Congress.
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Personally, I\'d be all right with that.
We\'d have all the documentation on somebody, get them into the system and they would have put their neck on the line for this country which is more than I\'ve ever done.
And all I wanted was for them to fill out some forms and carry their fair share. ;]
-Dan
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2 year military enlistment should be mandatory in america for ALL citizens.
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And that is why we all want you to just keep surfing the internet mm
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scared it would change america?
perhaps we would have a lot less pussy liberals running around
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Our economy could never support a military that size. Perhaps if we converted to some sort of authoritarian dictatorship and imposed a tax rate of 70% on every business and individual, then your plan might work. :) Of course we wouldn\'t really be the United States of America anymore, but what the hell, right? Screw those ragheads and liberal pussies. Let\'s just take over the rest of the planet while we\'re at it. :rolleyes:
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one\'s duty to country doesn\'t automatically have to be armed conflict.
ask bjorn sometime.
what would be dramatically reduced if every american citizen did one year of enlisted service after graduating high school (or gaining citizenship).
besides crime, you ask?
oh course, we can just continue to be a country full of obese, lazy, ethno-centric idiots who get our morals from the television.
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Look at countries with mandatory conscription... They are, for the most part, successfull programs. An easy way to educate/give skills to a poor population in impoverished nations, and a good way to fill necessary jobs in wealthier countries. Even in countries where mandatory conscription occurs for the whole population, in reality it usually evens out to about 1/3rd of the population serving, and only some of that in a military role. It provides workers for skilled service industries (fire fighters, guards, administration), and gives those who complete their time both experience, and skills, usefull a year later when they want to get their first job in their chosen careers.
Sweden
In Sweden military service is mandatory for men only. As of 2002, Sweden\'s government asked the army to consider mandatory military service for women. Less than one third of the country\'s eligible 19-year-olds are actually drafted each year. Men may choose unarmed service, such as firefighter.
Switzerland
Switzerland has the largest militia army in the world (220,000 including reserves). Military service for Swiss men is obligatory according to the Federal Constitution, and includes seventeen weeks of basic training as well as annual 3-week-refresher courses until a number of service days which increases with rank (260 days for privates) is reached. Service for women is voluntary, but identical in all respects. Conscientious objectors can choose 390 days of community service instead of military service. Medical deferments and dismissals from basic training (often on somewhat dubious grounds) have increased significantly in the last years. Therefore, only about 33% of Swiss men actually complete basic training.
Norway
Norway has mandatory military service of eighteen months for men between the ages of eighteen (17 with parental consent) and forty four. The actual draft time is six months for the home guard, and 9-12 months for the regular army, air force and navy. The remaining months are supposed to be served in annual exercises, but very few conscripts do this due to lack of funding to the Norwegian armed forces. The decreased funding and greater reliance on high technology in the armed forces has resulted in only a third of the male population completing the service (since the late 1990\'s). The remaining two thirds have mostly formally been dismissed after medical tests or obtained deferral of the service due to studies or stays abroad. Many Norwegians consider it unfair that they are the "unlucky" 1/3 that have to complete the compulsory military duty when so many others are dismissed. Others see it as a privilege and there has been reported high competition during the past few years to be allowed to serve. Having completed the draft time is generally regarded favourably with employers.
Mexico
Currently, all males reaching eighteen years of age must register for military service (Servicio Militar Nacional, or SMN) of one year, though selection is made by a lottery system using the following color scheme: whoever draws a black ball must serve as a "disponibility reservist", that is, they must not follow any activities whatsoever and get their discharge card at the end of the year. The ones who get a white ball serve in a Batallón del Servicio Militar Nacional (National Military Service Battalion) composed entirely of one-year SMN conscripts. Those with a community service interest may participate in Literacy Campaigns as teachers, or as Phys-Ed instructors. Military service is also (voluntarily) open to women. In certain cities, such as Mexico City and Veracruz, there is a third option: a red ball (Mexico City) and a Blue ball (Veracruz), which entails serving a full year as a recruit in a Paratrooper Battalion in the case of Mexico City residents, or an Infantería de Marina unit (Navy Marines) in Veracruz. In other cities which have a Navy HQ (such as Ciudad Madero), it is the Navy which takes charge of the conscripts, instead of the Army.
Israel
Israel has mandatory military service for both Jewish men and women. All Israeli Jews are conscripted, except Haredim, who can choose to serve but mostly do not. Israeli Arabs are exempt from service, although they can volunteer and some communities such as the Druze, Bedouin, and Circassians do serve.
Young women can generally opt not to serve if they are married, pregnant, or otherwise - Israel is generally very lenient with Israeli women when it comes to the draft. However, most that can, do serve out of patriotism.
Typically, men serve for 36 months, women serve for 24 months.
Brazil
Males in Brazil are required to serve 12 months of military service upon their 18th birthday. Most often, the service is performed in military bases as close as possible to the person\'s home. The government does not require those planning to attend college or holding a permanent job to serve. There are also several other exceptions, including health reasons, for which one may not have to serve.
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the prosecution rests, your honor
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Meh. You\'re only alive for what, 80 years? People shouldn\'t have to give up 2 or 3 of them if they don\'t want to.
Volunteer military works just fine. (Doesn\'t it?)
-Dan
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obviously (in america) it doesn\'t
look at the violent crime rate, compared to countries that do mandate enlistment.
don\'t mistake "service" for "military"
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[SNIP]
You didn\'t mention Denmark. I\'ll sue.
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You didn\'t mention Denmark. I\'ll sue.
Oh god! Don\'t sue!!!!
Denmark
As described in the Constitution of Denmark, § eighty one, Denmark has mandatory service for all able men. Normal service is four months, and is normally served by men in the age of eighteen to twenty seven. Some special services will take longer. Danish men will typically receive a letter around the time of their 18th birthday, asking when their current education (if any) ends, and some time later, depending on when, they will receive a notice on when to attend to the draft office to be tested physically and psychologically. However some may be deemed unfit for service and not be required to show up.
Even if a person is deemed fit, or partially fit for service, he may avoid having to serve if he draws a high enough number randomly. Persons who are deemed partly fit for service will however be placed lower than those who are deemed fit for service, and therefore have a very low chance of being drafted. Men deemed fit can be called upon for service until their 50th birthday in case of national crisis, regardless of whether normal conscription has been served. This right is very rarely exercised by Danish authorities.
Conscientious objectors can choose to instead serve six months in a non-military position, for example in Redningsberedskabet (dealing with non-military disasters like fires, flood, pollution, etc.) or foreign aid work in a third world country.
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Men deemed fit can be called upon for service until their 50th birthday in case of national crisis
now that shit wouldnt fly in america.
"one republic, under god" seems to have changed to "not my fucking problem"
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"not my fucking problem, and also, send over some money and militairy aid for my fucking problems!"
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talking on a civilian level
most americans want nothing to do with canucks, except for someone to beat on in hockey, and cheap currency exchange.
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Pfff, they wish they could beat on us with hockey (which they should be able to with the population difference). With the economies going the way they are, it won\'t be long before we\'re at a 1:1 ratio too (damn).
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i hope so
canadian beer > american
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mandatory miltary service?..been there done that...try livin in newark new jerz, for a few months,...in the summertime...s**t is off the scale!...ahhh but you do get a sense of satisfaction after bustin\' a cap in some fool\'s ass then go to emergency and laugh your ass off when he\'s sittin there with a big - ass X bandage on his ass...:fro:
then again those cowards in tha hood can\'t compare to those suicide bombers that you\'ll likely meet overseas...meh voluntary miltary service works just fine for me,..sheeit just send a couple of those mass murderers and lifers in prison down to iraq,...let them shine in that arena...then again the convicts themselves might turn against the american troops and start shootin at them or worse join sides with the enemy....naw scratch that idea...
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Are you stoned?
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Are you stoned?
Looks like it.
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stoned?...heh heh...i haven\'t gotten lifted since 01,...i made those statements coming off of night shift, so i was kinda out of it...:p
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did anyone watch lost?
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i hope so
canadian beer > american
I don\'t know about that...if you mean miller & budweiser, then yeah, duh.
but there are plenty of great beers brewed here. Sierra nevada, lost coast, Stone, Flying Bison........ Labbat Blue & molson are made just like budweiser...
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I\'ve always liked Sam Adams and Yeungling. Good American beers :)
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Labbatt Blue and Molson are not \'good\' Canadian Beers.
Depending on your taste, try Kokanee, Moosehead, Rickard\'s Red, Sleeman Honey Brown....
The history of Canadian Beer (http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/personal/driving/autosmart-maintenance.cfm?attr=8) and a list of the 300+ beers available at the beer store, nationwide.