Everything you wanted to know about XNA

Originally posted by JP
No doubt will XNA make it easier for developers to port from PC to Xbox 2 and vice versa but it\'s funny that MS this time around states that it\'s about the software, when last time it was about the hardware when they knew the Xbox would be more powerful. Now that they are believed to have the inferior hardware, they try and hype up XNA so much to counteract Sony\'s hardware.

Ummm...you do know that ANY developer can use XNA, right?  I believe there was an interview about a year ago now where someone said they\'d be thrilled if Sony and/or Nintendo would buy into it.  

In other words, XNA is not Xbox exclusive.  Xbox 2 will have to sell itself.

Originally posted by Ginko
XNA is not for graphics, it is not an engine.  It is a pool of resources designed to aid the developers in creating their games.

There have been shit games since I can remember, just as there have been exceptional games that are considered classics.  You think that\'s going to change?  

.I never had the impression this was an engine.If you pay attention to my post you ll see in bold developers that are capable at making good graphics.


I am not refering to a reduction of good games.Or an increase of shity games.I am refering to an appearance of more selling mediocre games with great graphics.

As I said the wow factor of classic games that were great as a whole at both graphics and gameplay will be reduced.Because they were top as a whole.Including physics and graphics.As I said GT4 wouldnt have been the same if 100 racing games with the same looks and similar physics existed on PS2.This wouldnt have prevented GT4 from being succesful.Commercially games sell.But as a gamer it is spoiling my experience

This can change!

The magic wand theory is something I learned while taking some 3d animation classes.  No matter how amazing the tool set is it will not make someone creative, it will not make a good film, game, etc.  The tools are there to help the artist, they can’t do anymore than that.  If a developer lacks the capacity to make a good game then no amount of tools, no matter how great, is going to change that.

Developers that can do good graphics i said......in bold....

Why would you blame MS for games with good graphics/bad gameplay selling?  This trend didn’t start with MS nor did it escalate with them.  If you want to blame anyone for the rise in shit games you can probably blame Sony for creating the massive casual gamer market who buys into the less than stellar titles then the developers who take advantage.

You repeat what Black Samurai said.And I never said MS started it up.And whats this with Sony again?What?You think its an effort to bash MS?
The title sais XNA!We are discussing about XNA!And I am refering to XNA!

Again, for every gem on the PS2 there are 30 games that are less than average.  The fact that PS2 is more complex to develop for is no more discouraging to make shit games.  I have a mountain of PS2 games to name in order to back that statement up.

Its not a matter of the existence of shity games!!You still dont get my point

Also, we both know that these people are in it to make money.  Fact is that games are getting more expensive to make due to the time required to build assets, custom tools, resources, etc.  That labor doesn’t come cheap either.  Before you know it creativity is put in the back seat while profit is priority number one.  What sells?  Graphics sell!  Hence the ever growing library of garbage available on all three consoles.

Having a greater arsenal of tools will benefit everybody, and think of it as the good developers will be even better because of it.

That part I can agree with since this seems to balance things up.

I think your bias is truly showing here, that or you\'re just ignorant.  Money is always the bottom line for any business, that’s a given, but you can’t outright say MS doesn’t give a shit about gaming because you’d be wrong on several accounts.  It’s been said in several interviews with various developers who publish with MS that they are given free reign to be creative.  Second is the reason of this very thread, XNA.  Software being developed by MS to help developers.  

Read the recent partnering with Mistwalker.  MS is publishing both games but has given them complete freedom to do whatever they want.  Don’t believe me?  Read the interviews yourself, both sides say the same thing.  Look up some Rare interviews as well.

Need reason for XNA?  Go read the first 3 posts of this thread, looks like alot of developers are excited for it.

Also, don\'t forget Sony\'s jumping into the standardized toolset as well.  Look up Collada. [/B]

Again whats this about Sony and all???The only reason you debate with me is because you think I am trying to bash MS?You think all this, is about being biased againts MS?
Perhaps anyone who thinks XNA isnt only a good thing should shut up because they are doing it to bash MS.

If you want to change the discussion to "Sony are the ones to blame for shitty games" then create a new thread

Originally posted by Unicron!
Perhaps anyone who thinks XNA isnt only a good thing should shut up because they are doing it to bash MS.

Not everyone. Just you.

You wished

I\'m debating with you because I seriously don\'t understand your hangup with XNA.  Just to show you that I\'m not taking sides here I also support the idea of Sony\'s Collada.  Having tools that help the developers is a plus.  If you go back and read the first few paragraphs of this thread you\'ll see these tools are an effort to standardize the tools that every developer has to make anyway.  They pick what they want then they can make whatever else they need, their own special tools.  Allard put it very simply with his general contractors building a house...read it for yourself.

Secondly, great gameplay will always trump graphic eye candy.  The graphics lure someone in but they won\'t stay long if it\'s not worth playing.  Do those mediocre games sell?  Of course they do, there\'s a mass of people who buy them.  There\'s obviously a market for them just as there\'s a market for the great games.  They can co-exist just as they have been for the past couple decades.  If you have a problem picking out the great from the good from the crap then you have every reason to be concerned.  I have reason to believe most of everyone else will be just fine.  

Your concern with GT4...do you really think Polyphony are going to share their trump card?  All those thousands of hours they put into research and development?  The meticulous detail of measuring every track, getting the look of every car just right, their physics fine tuned...you think they\'ll just give that to the competition?  You think if someone managed to equal or better it they\'d be willing to share it?  Those who go the extra mile, like Polyphony, will stand out. This won\'t change.

And the last part...you bashed MS by saying they don\'t give a shit about gaming.  I replied.

Yes, these standardized tools are a double edged sword.  It gives the lesser developers more capability and they\'ll continue to sell.  Shame on the people who make those games and shame on the people who buy them...oh wait, I don\'t care.  Again, the great developers will benefit from this just the same, those are the games I\'ll look forward to.

As I said I agree with these points but I also have my afterthoughts