How many Heavens are there?

There\'s only one heaven... the Playboy Mansion baby! :nut:

jedi master, please have patience with me, because I just don\'t know why my church can\'t interperet those verse as of different glories of kingdoms, but YOU (yes, one single solitary kid) can interperet it as being angels, humans and God.

but of course you are correct, after all, you are you.


open your mind my friend.


Eric Jacob

AlteredBeast, just as you asked JediMaster to open his mind, I ask you to open yours:

Originally posted by Troglodyte *note:edited
The KJV may not be the most intact.  The KJV was constructed from the translations of the SAME documents as the other versions. I\'ve posted a comparason of a couple verses before, they say the EXACT SAME THING.  The differences are there because there are no exact English words as the words of the more ancient tongues.  The translations are basically synonyms of each other.  The newer the version, the more acurate translation of the Bible.  Because we learn more about the languages and what the English equivalents should be the more we study it.

Trog, just because I don\'t reply to a certain message or reply doesn\'t mean I\'m not soaking in another view.

I don\'t take it that the KJV is all correct and that the NIV is wrong or the LBV fro that matter. But just from glancing at the KJV in comparison to other versions I can see that the KJV uses the old English and does not try to simplify the teachings of prophets, before and after Christ. It is also the standard which my church uses, which I can see the reasons of, therefore, I choose not to use the NIV or LBV. I believe the KJV was translated through inspiration of God. It\'s just not the same thing, especially when the three say vastly different things and sometimes contain entirely different topics than eachother, I will just use the one my church deems most correct.


Eric Jacob

That\'s funny.  \'Cause my church\'s official translation is NIV.  I, on the other hands use the Living translation, whilst my Study teacher brings the KJV.  When we study scripture we study all three versions.  How\'s that for being open minded?  Oh, and the church has standard beliefs set by the denomination, but it seems that our church has tons of different beliefs depending on our own personal understandings of the scripture.

Hardly ever do we find contradictions within the translations.  Some time will have to use specific examples, but I\'ll save that for much later.

is anyone here roman catholic? i have a couple of questions if anyone is....

Wow, this thread exploded while I was gone.  I believe that the KJV of the Bible is completely correct.  The reason the other versions of it that other religions use are not correct is because of the translation problems that they had.

This debate is pointless.  I believe that Joseph Smith translated the golden plates using the Urumenthumum, and translated them perfectly through the power of God.  He also corrected the translation problems that happened while the true church was off the face of the planet.  But of course, that is not what the non-LDS believe.

I have been taught not to convert people by "bible bashing."  Other people know their bible way more than I do, and I will never win against people who keep on saying, "What about this, and what about this."  I have learned that the only way to convert someone into the LDS church is through the Holy Ghost.  Without him, a missionary is useless.  The missionary does the teaching, while the Holy Ghost does the converting.  This bible bashing is not helping anything.  Because of all the bible bashing going on, I\'m not going to post anymore in this thread.

I know that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is the one and only true church on this planet.  I know that Joseph Smith translated the golden plates and gave us completely true versions of the Bible and Book of Mormon.  I know that we all are chosen ones, and have been saved for this time period because God knows that this is the hardest time.  I know that in the pre existance (another thing that no other religion believes in), we must have been really good people in order to be saved for this time.  I know that Christ was a perfect man, and he died and was resurrected for our sins.  I know God\'s plan, and I know that he wants all of us to become Gods like him.

And don\'t bother telling me to open my mind to other religions.  If you knew what it was like being a LDS, you wouldn\'t want to convert either.  There are no questions that cannot be answered through this church that are important to our salvation.  Having no questions about what life was before I was born, what life is right now, and what life will be like after I die is great, and makes me very happy to be part of this religion.

I can\'t say I agree with everything that IronFist has said.  But I\'m sure that\'s expected.

But IronFist, have you researched other religions?  Or are you following in your parent\'s footsteps?

I\'m Christian, just like my parents, but before I was baptized I reasearched a little bit of most major religions.

I did not know that Joseph Smith translated the Bible too. you learn something new everyday

I too know and believe the fullness of the gospel lies within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. I also know that anyone who reads the Book of Mormon with good intentions and prays on it after reading will find comfort from the Holy Ghost who will show you it is true.

Troglodyte, if you\'re church uses the NIV as it\'s STANDARD, why would you use any other version, knowing that there could be some inaccuracies to it that you\'re church does not condone. It is the same way with my church. It says that the KJV is the one true correct version, and I use it because of this.

I am not directing this at anybody, but this is a question all you non-mormons out there.

Do you follow what you\'re church tells you? I have many catholic friends and they hardly participate or act on what the church instructs of them.

Recently there was a Bill out that would outlaw gay marriage in Nebraska. The Catholic church of Nebraska supported it and suggested it\'s members vote for it. But when I asked many of my catholic friends about it, they said they would vote against it. That shocked me. totally shocked me. Isn\'t the pope the leader of the church, if he supports it, shouldn\'t you? You may not like it, but supporting what you\'re church says just comes naturally to me.

But of course, not many catholics have been oppressed in the last 2000 some odd years. If you are LDS, you learn to stand by your convictions in what you believe when you are a member.


Eric Jacob

I have researched heavily into other religions Trog. This church is the only one in which when I enter intot he chapel, I feel something in my heart. When I go into a temp0le of my church, I am nearly overwhelmed of the feeling of warmth and love. In other churches, I feel nothing other than the appreciation for great architecture.

I have also never come across another christian religion whose members and doctrine are questioned more than any other.

How can you be so happy Eric and live under such strict rules? that is a question I get often. By living without drugs, alcohol, sex (until marriage), etc. I live without things that I live waste my time and mind on getting while I should be worshiping God and obeying His commandments. many of my friends strive to get their next sack of weed or get to that next aprty so they can get drunk. But since I have never done those things, I have no desire to do them. the object of my weekend is never to get drunk, therefore I am happier, truly happy. addictions of any nature are bad to spiritual and physical health.


Also, at the Temple open house in Omaha, many people would stand outside and pass out anti-mormon literature, but all the stuff was wrong in it. I pity any non-members who\'s minds were changed about the church by reading this stuff. We never pass out literature against other religions. We simply say that all christian churches have truth, but we have the fullness of the truth, and the only way to return to live with God.

Eric Jacob

Not following your churches doctrine is a sin, called hypocrisy.  You are unfit as an example of Christ, and sometimes elude others from coming to know Christ.

I explained that I prefer the Living translation.  By standard I mean that all of the Bibles in the Pews are NIV.  Sometimes the Minister even quotes from other versions.

You also must realize that we believe that the NIV does not has inaccuracies.  Neither does the Living, neither does the KJV.  It seems your church is the only one that belives that the KJV is superior.  We believe they are all equal.

UPDATE:  I just read your "second post in a row."  That\'s funny, \'cause I felt really creepy in a Mormon church, and even more creepy in a JW church.  I\'ve felt at peace, loved , and accepted in Christian churches.  It\'s like I can feel my soul "uplifted" there.  But then again, I feel my soul being uplifted whenever I\'m with any group of Christians in fellowship.

the LDS and the JW churches are Christian.

The JW ust believe things extremely different from every other christian churches.

The LDS church is stricter than other christian churches. We don\'t smoke, drink, have premarital sex, etc. but we DO believe Jesus Christ died for our sins.

read the Book of Mormon, really read it Trogolodyte. I promise if you read it with good intentions you will find the answers you are looking for.

Eric Jacob

Originally posted by AlteredBeast
the LDS and the JW churches are Christian.
The JW ust believe things extremely different from every other christian churches.
The LDS church is stricter than other christian churches. We don\'t smoke, drink, have premarital sex, etc. but we DO believe Jesus Christ died for our sins.
read the Book of Mormon, really read it Trogolodyte. I promise if you read it with good intentions you will find the answers you are looking for.

I\'m sorry I misunderstood, it\'s just that they\'re so different that I sometimes forget that they are Denominations!  Sorry!

I can state for Methodist and Baptist that we don\'t tolerate smoking, drinking, premariatal sex, either!  If you see someone that does then they are being hypocritical and are being a bad example.

I\'ll try to get my hands on a copy sometime in August.  And I\'ll let you know what I think.  I give you my word that I will read it with an open mind, and an open heart.  I give you permision to get on my case if I haven\'t started reading it by the end of August .  I really want to now, but sometimes I get sidetracked.

Originally posted by IronFist

Yeah, thanks for making that a little clearer.  But if you kill yourself or anyone else, you will not go to outer darkness.  You will go to the Telestial Kingdom with all the other sinners - even Hitler and people like that.  Like I said before, the only way to go to outer darkness is to know for a fact that God and Christ are real and then completely deny their existance.

And what religion thread?  I would have joined you if I knew about it.

wELL I BELIEVE there is one heaven and one hell. All sinners go to one hell and all saints goto one heaven. From my interpetation of the bible I don\'t see how there all new hell. I believe hell is seperated into different parts, but is all the same.

Well as for the NIV AND KJV. The NIV bible has been interpeted bye man and when man starts interepeting the bible in his own mine and not the way god has told him then things start to change. The KJV is the only bible that can stand up in the court of law. The bible says this word  where written bye the deciples as they where lead bye the spirit of god. But as for the NIV it has gone through too many hands.

I know I said I wouldn\'t post in here anymore, but I can\'t resist.  It seems like the bible bashing is over for now.

Altered, have you noticed the Joseph Smith Translation in the back of the KJV bible?  It\'s right after the Bible Dictionary.  If you read something that doesn\'t sound right, there will probably be a reference to the JST where it explains it better.  I am not sure to what degree he translated it.  Maybe he only corrected mistakes, or maybe he completely translated it, but I know that the KJV bible is the true bible and it was translated by Joseph Smith.

And remember that other religions believe in a lot of the same things we do.  They have the same morals that we do.  Not everyone in their religion follows the commandments, and that\'s the same thing with our religion.  That is what repenting is for.

Troglodyte, my parents are LDS, but I have found out on my own this church is true.  I know the basics about other religions, but I haven\'t read their bibles or anything like that.  My mom is a convert, and her side of the family is all Catholic.  She almost became a Nun before she met my dad!  I think she was only a few days away from becoming a Nun.    Like Altered said, when I enter the LDS church and temple, I feel the spirit.  When I enter other churches, I just think, "Wow, cool stained glass windows."

Is there anyone here that does not believe in religion?  It\'s always interesting to hear what they have to say about what life is and stuff like that.  And kirath, what exactly do you believe in?