Casual Gamers are Better Off Being Casual

Originally posted by Ryu
Gohan
When was the last time you had something like that?  Hasn\'t just about every game from the 16-bit/8-bit days been revamped in some new way during the 32/64-bit era?  I can\'t even think of one off the top of my head right now that offers what you speak of.  I know the 32/64-bit gen did offer some all new games for us, but are those going to just be revamped in the 128-bit era?  Are we stuck in this endless cycle?  I mean, playing an all new original game nowadays is about as rare as finding the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.  I wonder if the people waiting for all new original games are just kidding themselves.

The first game that comes to mind is Shenmue. It was not the most popular game; but ,to me, it offered a gameplay experience that I had not yet had. There were games that attempted to do the same thing but no one did it so well. Another game would probably be MGS2. It has been done before on the PSX but IMO it looks like Kojima is going out of his way to give us a new experience gameplay wise.

I feel that the experiences will evolve with each generation. A company like MS comes out with a HDD enabled console that opens up a world of possibilities for developers. Will this be the catalyst that will keep the gaming enthusiasts amazed with gaming culture? I don\'t know for sure; but I do know that I will be first in line to find out.

Damn, it\'s hard to keep up with all these good thought out replies.

GenjuroKibagani

You make a lot of good points, enough to where responding to it generally is a must rather then one particular point.  It\'s true that we as adults do have to buy the games nowadays, but there is always the rentals at your local BB or HV.  That doesn\'t nullify the point at all, but are people unwilling to rent games nowadays as well?  I just rented Klonoa 2 about 3 days ago.  You know the last time I rented a game?  When I first rented a Playstation at launch from BB.  Man, that was a long time ago, but I do remember the most fun came from renting games and beating them over the course of a weekend (like I did with Klonoa 2).  I definitely know my mom loved it a lot more in those days then plopping down a good 70 dollars on Street Fighter II for the SNES.

Gohan

I feel that the experiences will evolve with each generation. A company like MS comes out with a HDD enabled console that opens up a world of possibilities for developers. Will this be the catalyst that will keep the gaming enthusiasts amazed with gaming culture? I don\'t know for sure; but I do know that I will be first in line to find out.

That\'s a perfectly valid point.  Are we entering an age where hardware changes are what makes games better rather then an innovative use of some new gameplay design?  Is hardware the key to our jaded gaming salvation?

[Living-In-Clip]

Originally posted by Ryu


That\'s a perfectly valid point.  Are we entering an age where hardware changes are what makes games better rather then an innovative use of some new gameplay design?  Is hardware the key to our jaded gaming salvation?

To a degree, yes. With the 32 / 64 bit era developers found themself being able to do 3D and push polygons around. It was a new world. They took that era and kept trying to improve on the 3D enviorment. Things like camera angles have always been a problem, but are quickly becoming less and less of an issue. I predict, by the end of this generation 3D will be almost mastered if not mastered.. Then, these new hardware innovations, such as the HD will take effect allowing us so much more. Developers won\'t have to worry about how to fix this problem in the enviroment. Instead, they can focus on making the game more original with the hardware that is presented and expanding on the gameplay elements with the hardware they have.

To sum it up; once developers master everything software wise, they can move onto taking advantage of the new hardware add-ons. Until then, using the HD for things like speeding up disc time really isn\'t going to effect us gamers.

To sum it up; once developers master everything software wise, they can move onto taking advantage of the new hardware add-ons. Until then, using the HD for things like speeding up disc time really isn\'t going to effect us gamers.

Definitely.  This generation feels a lot like a trial run for the consoles and the NEXT generation will be the one where it all comes together and the games, not the advantages hardware wise, will be what makes gaming great once again.  I can\'t wait for the 256bit era!  lol

Originally posted by Ryu
Gohan
That\'s a perfectly valid point.  Are we entering an age where hardware changes are what makes games better rather then an innovative use of some new gameplay design?  Is hardware the key to our jaded gaming salvation?

These hardware changes are the catalysts for gameplay innovation. If a developer wants to make use of the new hardware device that a company has implemented they are forced to innovate on gameplay ideas. At least I hope thats what would happen.

[Living-In-Clip]

Originally posted by Ryu


Definitely.  This generation feels a lot like a trial run for the consoles and the NEXT generation will be the one where it all comes together and the games, not the advantages hardware wise, will be what makes gaming great once again.  I can\'t wait for the 256bit era!  lol

I feel that Sony opting to not include the HD from the get-go slowed down the process for this generation.

I agree with just about everything that has been said.  Now, it\'s time for my two cents:

I can remember the times when getting "lucky turtle" or "firepower small" in Super Mario Bros 1 was an almost magical moment.  When knowing the ABACABB blood code for Mortal Kombat 1 was the "cool" thing to know.  I have always been a video game junkie, but now video games are a little dissapointing.  The last really fun game I have played is also FF7.  Tekken 3 was also great, but it was not as mystical as FF7 was.  The reason for this is because a couple years after FF7 was released is when I was introduced to the internet instead of just Gamepro magazine.  I soon knew everything I wanted to know about all video games, and more.  The internet, and places like IGN, PS2central forums, and Tekken Zaibatsu completely removes that excitement level I used to have.

But there is another side to this.  Because I was not as "hardcore" as I am now back when MGS1 and Castlevania: SOTN was released, I didn\'t know what I was missing.  I didn\'t play MGS1 until earlier this year, and I still haven\'t played Catlevania: SOTN which is arguably the PSX\'s best game.  If I would have been on these forums back then (if these forums existed back then ), I would have known how good the games were and would have bought them.  Being hardcore makes games less enjoyable because we are so jaded, but at least we know which games are the AAA titles.  I agree that ignorance is bliss, but I don\'t think I could go back to knowing so little.

Originally posted by Ryu


Definitely. This generation feels a lot like a trial run for the consoles and the NEXT generation will be the one where it all comes together and the games, not the advantages hardware wise, will be what makes gaming great once again. I can\'t wait for the 256bit era! lol

I couldn\'t agree with you more.  Next generation is when all consoles will have way better graphics than anyone could ever want, and it\'s when the developers will have to focus on gameplay to sell a game.

Lavan makes the damndest fine point about GT3. It was supposed to have crazy enemy AI, rain, more cars (when it was called GT2000), etc.

but Ryu, unfortunately, since I am hardcore, I am overly picky about what games I play. I only became so in the 32-bit age. In the 16-bit age, I would buy games such as Bart\'s Nightmare (could never figure it out, impossible), and would have no place to go to figure it out. Now, I research my games carefully. I take reviews from reviewers I trust (many times, you.) I rent the game (not very much), then finally if I still have that strong desire to keep on playing, I will buy it.

Shenmue was the last game that got me excited to play. The game was so interactive. My jaw would drop in amazement at the stuff I could pick up, take off, use, play, etc. Couple that with casual gamer delight (a VGA Box and mucho good graphics), it is one of my favorite games of all time, easily.

I think I was hardcore during the 8-bit, simply because I refused to buy NES after that crap broke on me. I got an SMS (along with about 10 othr people on the 4 blocks around my house) and enjoyed every game I got. Sure, there werent that many games compared to NES, but I had so many, played so many, and didn\'t care that I wasn\'t playing Metroid, Mario, etc. I could play those at friend\'s houses, I had Rastan, RC Grand Prix, WonderBoy, Alex Kidd, etc.

ahhhh, good times.


Eric Jacob

[Bobs_Hardware]

Originally posted by Ryu

Surrounded by Nintendo Power magazines and learning all about the next Nintendo system, the N64, I saw myself as a general fountain of information to both my peers and my wallet for making decisions on what to buy.  However, being young also means being very naive and since Nintendo Power makes Nintendo games look like God\'s gift to man, I wanted it all.  Fortunately, I stepped into the realm of the Playstation after I heard about Squaresoft and the delay of the N64 and my whole gaming "enlightenment" began and my weapon of Knowledge was none other then the powerful Electronic Gaming Monthly.[/b]

hell, im still like this at school, i know everything...they all think im a god  :  or some sort of messiah at least

Therein lies the predicament.  Knowledge has destroyed gaming.  People can argue that it has made us more conscious buyers or more adept to what\'s out there for your money or what\'s out there for your enjoyment, but those of us who delve into this situation day in and day out on the net debating the games, reading about the games, and watching movies from Betas of games are nothing but desensitized to just how great these little things are.  Have we really become fountains of knowledge or just experts in a medium that does nothing but ruin the excitement for us?

i completely agree.  That is why since FF8, i stopped looking up ANYTHING about games i intended to buy, or play...in FF9 i was disappointed that they showed the characters in the booklet...almost \'forcing\' me to look at them, id prefer mystery about who the character actually is when they talk to me and become a party member.  Finding out anything about the storyline that wouldnt be covered in the blurb on the back of the case, is something i avoid as much as possible.  I will only look at screenshots that show off the games graphics and possibly how the game will play...anything that will spoil the game, i avoid.  And i wont change, i love having the mystery when i play a game, makes the game so much better.

I remember the last game that I played where the enjoyment factor for me was just leaps and bounds above anything that I have played now.  That game was Final Fantasy VII.

my god!  its like we are the same person (except for the fact that we are obviously not eachother)  FF7 was the most amazing experience i ever played, egged on by this, i found out EVERYthing i could about FF8 (and other games)...i blame this partly for me lacking enjoyment towards the storyline.  Of course, when FF7 came out, the world of the RPG was unawares to me

 

This of course was way before I had ever heard of the magical three letters; DSL, but also before I had even delved into the action of the Internet community as a whole.  I didn\'t know anything about a transistor or a vector unit and I sure as hell didn\'t care about a GeForce or the medium a console was going to arrive on.  All I cared about was playing fun games either at my expense, or a good friend\'s expense.  I still remember the time when renting a game, or trying the game at a friend\'s house, was the deciding factor for buying a game.  Nowadays, there is so much involved in purchasing anything and\\or voicing your opinion freely.

too much debating "You should get this" "Dont get that, this will be better"...takes the fun out of gaming...makes playing a game simply a formality to say that you are among he many that have played and finished it.  I liked the days when gaming was about purely what you enjoyed, not anybody else.

So what do you all think?  Agree?  Disagree?  Please, intelligent responses only.

i think your beautiful "MMMWWWWWWA!"

I hope the "256 bit era" finally solves the "Online Gaming Problem".  The problem is obviously how to profit from it.  Eventhough the business of video games, is still a business.  Could they please figure out that paying more for online play of the game you\'ve just purchased shouldn\'t be.  PSOv.2 may be $15 for 3 months (assistance please) so for a year of that game its just $60 That\'s OK..that\'s more like it.  But it shouldn\'t be restricted to one game.

I\'m not quite sure this fits into this thread, but here goes: I\'m \'tired\' of gaming. I almost never play games anymore - I play one game these days: Day of Defeat for PC. And the only games that interests me in the near future are blockbusters such as MGS2 and SH2. The \'not-nearly-AAA-quality\' titles just aren\'t enough for me anymore, even though they used to be. I don\'t know if it has something to do with age or what, but I just don\'t enjoy gaming as I used to. Does anyone else share this growing sense of seperation from gaming? Perhaps not - but my plead to you is to enjoy it while it lasts. It\'s hard to predict the future and who knows - you might end up enjoying it less and less.

Sorry about sounding negative, but it was the truth.

Casual Gamers are Better Off Being Casual

Agreed completely.

Life was so simple for me when I was a casual gamer. I had my brother ot tell me which games were good, got my buy to buy one at my birthday and Chritmas, and then played them for months. Sometimes he would just tell my mom what games to get and I would have no clue into what I was getting into to. Life was good. I didn\'t really know what to expect for games back then. I was just like "ya! a new game, yippee!" And played and had a blast.

Then the 64/32 bit era came and quite frankly the games just wern\'t as fun as they used to be.

The last game I truely enjoyed and truely had a blast playing was Zelda:OOT. I didn\'t really know what to expect of that game since I never played LttP before but thankfully it was awesome, the best game ever IMO.

But after that, the games just sucked. There was truely a dry spout going on after that game.

Then around summer of 2000, I discovred the internet and now here I am researching the **** out of every game thus ruining my experiencesm nit-picking, ect ect. Being hardcore sucks.

Does anyone else share this growing sense of seperation from gaming? Perhaps not - but my plead to you is to enjoy it while it lasts. It\'s hard to predict the future and who knows - you might end up enjoying it less and less.

As I said before Samwise, I think it is the fact of knowing too much about the industry that makes the hobby less enjoyable.  So far, in as many forums that I have posted this thread in, the only thing that can be said by those who indulge themselves in the news of the industry more so then the games is that they have some superficial means of indulging in their hobby other then the story or the gameplay elements.  Most people argue that it is the entireity of the package that makes it enjoyable.  That knowing what hardwork went into creating this little masterpiece that sits in front of you.

Personally, I feel that knowing too much about these things has made us all incredibly jaded.  It\'s unfortunate and sad, but it has made us better consumers.  If being a better consumer means sacrificing my enjoyment of games, then that\'s a tough call to make.  I\'d say that you can\'t put a price on fun, but I guess with this industry, you can.

[Living-In-Clip]

When you are jaded, you expect everything plus fun. When you are casual, you expect nothing but fun.

[Evi]

Originally posted by Living-In-Clip
You bring up a valid point also though. Alot of it is, we as matured gamers have to pay for games now. We can\'t depend on someone to buy them for us. That of course, will effect our opinion some, because we don\'t wish to buy total crap.

Yeah, I don\'t prefer to waste my money on a crappy games anymore. I hate games nowadays. You have to go in-depth to find out more about a game...and then you buy it...and every webpage on the net gives it a 4 out of 10. That\'s BS. When I was little, playing games like Metroid and Spy Hunter on my Nintendo Entertainment System was just great. I didn\'t care about system performance (of course, I didn\'t know what that was at my age). All games were of great qualtiy, and there weren\'t any competitions, or the forming of insane kids who kill their brother over who\'s turn it was in a videogame. A VIDEOGAME!! Comparing systems, and fighting over who\'s console is the dominant one is so childish and obnoxious. I can\'t stand reading that junk. That whole "Console Debating" forum is the worst idea. It just adds to the spreading problem in this world. I\'m glad technology is progressing, and making visual-stunning, great-quallity games, but I don\'t wanna hear that another console has better graphics, so you should go out and buy it. I\'m not made of money...and my parents don\'t buy me everything I want like they used to. I have to work for long hours, and by the time I get a paycheck...something else more important comes up than my videogames...like...my life.

That was an awesome article you wrote there, Ryu...I am impressed... You really got your point across, and I read every word (even though it was a long read...it was a good read). Peace.