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Author Topic: "It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"  (Read 2095 times)

Offline SirMystiq

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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #30 on: December 16, 2003, 10:41:18 PM »
Christians will often use prophecy fulfillment as proof of the Bibles divine origins. The Bible will predict a vague future event then at a later point in time the Bible will give an account of this event actually happening.

In many cases, this is an obvious trick. I can write a holy book that predicts a vague future event, then later on in my book I can write another story that fulfills the prophecy of the  event.

Conversely, I can wait for an interesting event then add the prophesy of the event to my scripture so that the prophecy really matches up with a real event.

Alternatively, there are self fulfilling prophecies. Everyone, knew what the prophecies were, so any one could turn up and say "Hi, I\'m the Messiah and I\'m from Nazareth as stated in the prophecy". No one with the slightest bit of common sense is going to say "Hi, I\'m the Messiah and I\'m from Damascus". Because that is clearly not in accordance with prophecy. If the guy really does come from Nazareth, it would add credence to his claim. However, it is a self fulfilling prophecy and is wide open to the simplest fraud.

There is a much more impressive demonstration of prophesy:-
I could move into the prophecy business with a small team of fellow prophets. We start writing prophecies, hundreds of them a day. Prophecies about nations, political leaders, great events, etc. We write them all on separate sheets of paper and get them all independently witnessed. I could make 100 prophecies all on the future of the Jewish state or what will happen in Iraq. Within a couple of months my team of prophets could easily generate 10,000 prophecies.

We then sit and wait a few years.

After a few years we analyse world events and match them up to any suitable prophecies. If we make our prophecies too specific, there may be 90% of our prophecies will be totally wrong or we may not be able to find a suitable world event that matches a particular prophecy. These prophecies are rejected and burned. If we make our prophecies quite vague but with descriptions that can be re-interpreted, we will get a much higher hit rate, maybe 30%.

Of this 30% I would say that 15% would be a a reasonable match to some event with a little interpretation of the prophecy. 10% would be accurate to the point where people could, with a little thought, could recognise the event predicted by the prophecy. The top 5% would be very accurate and immediately recognisable.

So, we take the top 5% and maybe the best of the reasonably accurate prophecies and publish them in a book. The rest are discarded. We could call the book "Sinbad\'s 1000 fulfilled prophecies". Even if we only pick the top 1% predictions, we still have a book with 100 amazingly accurate prophecies.



This is very similar to how the Bible came to have prophecies that appear to have been fulfilled. The people of the day were very keen on prophecy, soothsaying, dream interpretation, horoscopes etc. There was undoubtedly a large amount of prophetic material around. When the scriptures were being scrutinised for canonisation, the editors and theologians would cherry pick all the prophecies that matched up with current dogma. Anything that didn\'t match would not get through the canonisation process. Who in there right mind would include a prophecy in their holy book that was known to be inaccurate? Of course all these failed prophecies would not make it into the Bible. Any prophecy with a good match would be automatically included.

Obviously, open ended prophecies could be included because sooner or later an event will occur that will roughly match the prophecy. If nothing turns up within a few hundred years, the prophecy is just left open on the grounds that it has yet to be fulfilled.

You can\'t use Bible time because of the simple fact that you don\'t know when these scriptures were written. The Bible tells you it was before Jesus, yet by saying that the Bible says, you are implying that it is right, therefore the prophecies are invalid until the date when the Old Testament was written in known.


"When was the Bible written?
The Bible was not written in one specific year or in a single location. The Bible is a collection of writings, and the earliest ones were set down nearly 3500 years ago. So let\'s start at the beginning of this fascinating story.

The first five books of the Bible are attributed to Moses and are commonly called the Pentateuch (literally "five scrolls").

Moses lived between 1500 and 1300 BC, though he recounts events in the first eleven chapters of the Bible that occurred long before his time (such as the creation and the flood).

These earliest accounts were handed on from generation to generation in songs, narratives, and poetry.

In those early societies there was no writing as yet and people passed on these oral accounts with great detail and accuracy.

"

http://www.gospelcom.net/ibs/bibles/about/3.php

Orally and Poetically...thats a good way to remember everything just like it happened.


Why did you "seek" God?

So I guess God is not as powerful as the thinks, I mean if he lets his creation sin. Who he seems to have set up. "Don\'t eat from this tree" ..." you ate from it you will be a sinner forever" Also the "there is no evil, its the abcense of good" is like the "is the glass half empty or half full" Evil=sins=hell. Where did hell come from? God allowed it to be created it.
Don\'t try to confuse me with what you call  facts, my mind is already made up.

Offline clips

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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #31 on: December 16, 2003, 11:02:46 PM »
damn bro. you broke it down. :beer:
knowledge, wisdom & understanding..these are the basic fundamentals of life

if you can\'t amaze them with brilliance, baffle them with bullsh*t....

Offline SwifDi
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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #32 on: December 17, 2003, 01:49:36 PM »
The prophecies are hardly vague... It directly predicts the fall of cities, the way they will fall, and even what will happen to them after they fall.

Offline GigaShadow
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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #33 on: December 17, 2003, 01:56:08 PM »
This is a sad cut and paste war... I know for one SirMystiq doesn\'t have an original thought in his tiny little head ;)
\"The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.\"  - Churchill
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Offline Phil
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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #34 on: December 17, 2003, 05:14:08 PM »
And if this isn\'t a cut and paste war, these guys have way too much free time on their hands.
Wrong. There are two other people who can.
Dark Lord Sith\'s.
Demon\'s named Phil.  -LIC

Offline SirMystiq

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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2003, 09:36:50 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by SwifDi
The prophecies are hardly vague... It directly predicts the fall of cities, the way they will fall, and even what will happen to them after they fall.


I know of these two cities, Gerroa or something that the Bible said they would "burn" or something. It came true.


Scientist discovered that they were right along a fault line...

Like I said, nobody knows when all these things were written. I could write a prophecy right now:

"A bird of metal will come from the sky, God almighty will release his wrath upon the sinners, and the sinners home, will become the sinners grave"

There...

And Giga...you\'ll be surprised.
Don\'t try to confuse me with what you call  facts, my mind is already made up.

Offline Bozco
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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #36 on: December 17, 2003, 09:51:34 PM »
Whatever helps you all get up every day.

Offline (e)
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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #37 on: December 17, 2003, 10:08:36 PM »
How about you both shut up and believe in what you want?

Okay.

Beer and cookies around the house!
Think for yourself. Question authority.

Offline SwifDi
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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #38 on: December 17, 2003, 10:52:12 PM »
Hold on the beer for me. ;)

Oh, and btw, they only cut/paste I did was the prophecies fulfilled, everything else is my own thought.

Offline Lord Nicon
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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #39 on: December 17, 2003, 11:16:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Luke
Real men don\'t dance... the end.

Yeah they just run into eachother like a bunch of fools. ;)

j/k...
Originally posted by ##RaCeR##
I don\'t have comprehension issues, you just need to learn how to communicate.
Yessir massir ima f*** you up reeeeal nice and homely like. uh huh, yessum ; ).
Debra Lafave Is My Hero ;) lol

Offline (e)
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"It\'s not dancing, its "stepping to a beat"
« Reply #40 on: December 18, 2003, 08:11:29 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by SwifDi
Hold on the beer for me. ;)


Who\'s stopping you?

g0d?
MUAHAHHAHA
Think for yourself. Question authority.

 

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