PS3: When to say when (IGN)

Originally posted by Unicron!
Take into consideration that my opinions arent absolute

Console\'s full specs, real games and generally information appear months before the consoles release.So its actually more than just 5 months that Sony will know much about everything about the competitor.

That time is relative.  You think Sony is just sitting around waiting to see what MS is doing? They\'re still developing whatever it is they have going on.  What do you think they would do if they were to learn the fulls specs of their competitor?  Say a memo dropped into their office tomorrow morning.  

Abandon their current plans, their investment in time and resources toward the proposed PS3 model they\'ve had on the burner for several years?  They can\'t stray from that too far or they\'ll end up in a mess.

SDK\'s have already been sent out, the hardware might undergo some minor changes but anything radical is out of the question.  

Its not just simply the graphics that Sony can observe and counter.And still Sony might make a few small alterations.I am not saying that Sony will make huge changes.But if MS comes up with something that will make Sony consider their offer then some changes will make their way.
I didnt mention huge changes.You assume too much from my post
Also dont forget.Sony will know even months before XBOX2\'s launch

If it\'s not a huge change then what does it matter?

But there is no competition.Until you know what the competitor is offering no matter what and how much you are working on something there is still the risk of uncertainty.

I am not saying that MS is bound to fail thanks to the same factors that made the DC fail.My point is that there are unknown factors.I said unknown.Unexpected.I didnt name the factors that made DC fail and neither did I say that MS will fail for the same reasons.It might not do as well thought due to other still unknown factors.

Then how could one possibly call it another DC if circumstances are entirely different?  We know what factors led to Sega exiting the console business and MS doesn\'t share ANYTHING in common.

They are facing a ghost competitor and there is no market.There is actually nothing.All these sound good and they can say that they quarantee success but how well it will do in the market when its released its a whole different story
Since so far I havent seen anything but only read text from MS representatives its normal to have this uncertainty.

Everyone\'s starting from zero next gen and everything can change.  You think Nintnedo let Sony come in and take over?  Their decisions ultimately knocked them down the ladder a few notches and now they sit in 3rd place.  

Nintendo\'s proposing their Revolution, Microsoft is proposing the "HD Era", and Sony is banking on their Cell and Blu-Ray.  Their strategies will be different but I believe their hardware will be very close in terms of performance.

Who knows where gaming is going to go?  I don\'t think we\'ll figure it out today.

Also dont forget that some gaming industry analists predicted MS decision to release the console in 2005 as a wrong move and that this might not give the expected well headstart MS is expecting.

Could these be the same analyst that predicted MS would drop out of the console race within 2 years of Xbox launching?

Originally posted by Ginko
Playstation launched in Japan on December 3rd, 1994.

>>>Link<<<
 

Much of anything?  

We know about the cell and proposed performance, we know about Nvidia helping out and have heard early estimates as to what their GPU is capable of.  We know SDK\'s have been shipped and there\'s already a buzz about it from not so tight lipped developers.

We know even more about Xbox 2.  Nintendo, as always, is the most secretive.

The news is coming, apparently you\'re not paying attention.

So we know about the cell and "proposed performance." Also about who\'s working on the project and that the sdk\'s have been shipped.

Simply Riveting

Ive been paying enough attention to know the same degree of information i knew last gen and this is definately not the degree of numbers, speculation and hype that we saw in 99/00. If thats any indicator of what this gen is going to be like then id rather them wait to see what they can stir up or improve on. Yes there is the question "what can they improve?" and im pretty damn sure theres something. We know that some companies have jumped on the wagon to dev for these consoles but we havent heard too much. On top of that we have barely seen any shots.
Dont tell me all the devs and sony are keeping tight lipped this gen. Sony is the king of hype. If there was enough material being developed for xbox2 and ps3 we would have already seen much more.

Perhaps the entry of MS stirred things up a lot but compared to last gen this is a drought. I dont think MS caused all of that alone. On top of everything, i hear no casual gamers talking about either console which is somewhat weird since casual gamers tend to spread all sorts of rumors - poly count, gflops etc. Ive heard none of that.

Maybe it is time for this gen to end but nobody seems ready. Perhaps theres something you see that i dont but im just not seeing it.

Originally posted by Lord Nicon
So we know about the cell and "proposed performance." Also about who\'s working on the project and that the sdk\'s have been shipped.

Simply Riveting

I suppose that depends who you ask.

Ive been paying enough attention to know the same degree of information i knew last gen and this is definately not the degree of numbers, speculation and hype that we saw in 99/00. If thats any indicator of what this gen is going to be like then id rather them wait to see what they can stir up or improve on. Yes there is the question "what can they improve?" and im pretty damn sure theres something. We know that some companies have jumped on the wagon to dev for these consoles but we havent heard too much. On top of that we have barely seen any shots.

In 99/00 Sony was spewing Emotion Engine left and right, and it was because of the Dreamcast.

You\'re looking for indicators that next gen is coming?  Did you miss the one about Unreal Engine 3?  How about the one about standardization of tools in the form of XNA and Collada?  What about Mistwalker saying that the performance of the Xenon is way beyond what\'s capable with the current consoles?  Sega said that the Xenon is a developers dream.  Nintendo is commenting that their next console will be a revolution.  How about the "HD era"?

You want some screenshots?  Look up Gears of War, Wardevil, and Condemened.  How about those pics EA posted not too long ago?

Would you like me to make a thread about what J Allard said concerning Project Gotham 3?

Are you just forgetting all this stuff or you simply haven\'t come across it?

Dont tell me all the devs and sony are keeping tight lipped this gen. Sony is the king of hype. If there was enough material being developed for xbox2 and ps3 we would have already seen much more.

Developers can\'t show their hand until the consoles are officially announced.  Looks like that will be E3.

We\'re already hearing support for next gen consoles from EA, Ubisoft, Sega, Tecmo, and others.  

You don\'t think Sony has started with their hype?  Have you missed all the Cell info?  It\'s like hearing about the Emotion Engine all over again.  

Perhaps the entry of MS stirred things up a lot but compared to last gen this is a drought. I dont think MS caused all of that alone. On top of everything, i hear no casual gamers talking about either console which is somewhat weird since casual gamers tend to spread all sorts of rumors - poly count, gflops etc. Ive heard none of that.

It\'s all about timing.  If Sony showed it\'s full hand right now and didn\'t launch for a year then that\'d make for a pretty dull wait.  They have to play the hype game with MS, who, in my opinion, has become just as good at it.

I personally think MS has a great strategy of keeping an almost tight lip.  Right now they are still riding on great sales of their Xbox, this past holiday was their biggest and it still has momentum.  It would be stupid to kill that.  

I\'m under the impression that when E3 rolls around you\'ll hear nothing but Xbox 2 through November.  IGN\'s said it, Gamespot\'s said, there\'s alot we don\'t know about but we will soon.

You\'re simply not visiting the right forums.  Go to Beyond3d, Gamersage, or Teamxbox.  You\'ll get far more speculation than you\'ll care to hear.

Maybe it is time for this gen to end but nobody seems ready. Perhaps theres something you see that i dont but im just not seeing it. [/B]

You\'re just not seeing it.  If you\'re using this forum as a source of information then I\'ll tell you that you\'re missing quite a bit of info. I certainly don\'t post everything here and I hardly see anyone else posting the latest.  

This place is hardly a gauge for excitement concerning next gen.

Originally posted by Ginko
That time is relative.  You think Sony is just sitting around waiting to see what MS is doing? They\'re still developing whatever it is they have going on.  What do you think they would do if they were to learn the fulls specs of their competitor?  Say a memo dropped into their office tomorrow morning.  

Abandon their current plans, their investment in time and resources toward the proposed PS3 model they\'ve had on the burner for several years?  They can\'t stray from that too far or they\'ll end up in a mess

SDK\'s have already been sent out, the hardware might undergo some minor changes but anything radical is out of the question.

 
Stop puting words I didnt say in my mouth and read my whole post before quoting, choping and replying.I didnt say that at all and I elaborated what I ment

Sony isnt delaying PS3 because they are sitting and waiting to see what MS will do.But Sony wont be sitting with their hands tight either.

If it\'s not a huge change then what does it matter?

I ment not  changes that will change drastically the hardware scheme/architecture.They will take the right countering measurments

Then how could one possibly call it another DC if circumstances are entirely different?  We know what factors led to Sega exiting the console business and MS doesn\'t share ANYTHING in common.

If it fails thanks to being released sooner yes it will be another DC.Regardless what factors playied the role of failure for XBOX2

Everyone\'s starting from zero next gen and everything can change.  You think Nintnedo let Sony come in and take over?  Their decisions ultimately knocked them down the ladder a few notches and now they sit in 3rd place.  

Nintendo\'s proposing their Revolution, Microsoft is proposing the "HD Era", and Sony is banking on their Cell and Blu-Ray.  Their strategies will be different but I believe their hardware will be very close in terms of performance.

Nintendo never tried to compete directly XBOX and PS2.Sony and MS are different from Nintendo.Your example doesnt work.XBOX offered DVD, online, HDD support, and targeted the same consumers Sony was targeting, while Nintendo mostly targeted the younger audience, and Nintendo fans

Who knows where gaming is going to go?  I don\'t think we\'ll figure it out today.

I estimate.Just as you do.

Could these be the same analyst that predicted MS would drop out of the console race within 2 years of Xbox launching?

Ahm....if thats what you want to believe.

Originally posted by Ginko
You\'re just not seeing it.  If you\'re using this forum as a source of information then I\'ll tell you that you\'re missing quite a bit of info. I certainly don\'t post everything here and I hardly see anyone else posting the latest.  

This place is hardly a gauge for excitement concerning next gen.

Trust me im not. Ive seen the unreal engine. Ive seen half the shots. The cell hype isnt what "fear the power of emotion" was, nor are they putting up numbers similar to those of last gen\'s. Nintendo is said they are going to start/create a revolution with the new "revolution" - that tells me a lot. Standarization of tools, Mistwalker said this, Sega said this. Why? How? From the looks of things sega\'s first attempts at next gen have been poor thus far. I havent seen anything otherwise.

Im not asking sony to show all of their cards. But if a lot of you are in agreement that this gen should start at the end of 2005, i dont know why we havent seen more. Perhaps our definition of "more" varies, but half the things you listed are far from something to jump about. True, there are some very exciting points but the rest isnt there.

Perhaps theres quite a bit to be excited about when it comes to ms and all of that and i dont mean to be a Sony whore, which i wouldnt say, but for some odd reason, ms hasnt grown on me, nor have they given me much of a reason to look too far into what they are doing. Maybe its my mood but im waiting on sony and from the looks of things you\'ve set your eyes on what ms is doing. Theres nothing wrong with that, but on my "side" of the playing field, if you want to call it that, there isnt much.

Im not very motivated to go into detail but its just how i feel.

Originally posted by Unicron!
Stop puting words I didnt say in my mouth and read my whole post before quoting, choping and replying.I didnt say that at all and I elaborated what I ment

Sony isnt delaying PS3 because they are sitting and waiting to see what MS will do.But Sony wont be sitting with their hands tight either.

You didn\'t do it very well.  Both companies are moving forward with their layed plans and there is no way they can effectively adopt a new plan to full-on counter what the other has to offer.  The little shit they can change but that\'s the stuff that makes little to no difference anyway.

If either has made an error in judgement as to where games are going then the other will rise above.  That is unless they have strikingly similar plans, which I believe they do, then we\'ll just see who can market it better.

I ment not  changes that will change drastically the hardware scheme/architecture.They will take the right countering measurments

I know what you meant and I don\'t think it\'s as simple to just as you\'re making it out to be.  Then again I don\'t think the consoles will greatly differ from each other in any area.

If it fails thanks to being released sooner yes it will be another DC.Regardless what factors playied the role of failure for XBOX2

To say it is a "DC" is comparing it to the defining factors of that particular console\'s life, or in this case the end of.  If the Xbox 2 were to fail then I\'d say that the DC and Xbox 2 have that in common, however there would be significant differences as to how their demise unfolded.  

Nintendo never tried to compete directly XBOX and PS2.Sony and MS are different from Nintendo.Your example doesnt work.XBOX offered DVD, online, HDD support, and targeted the same consumers Sony was targeting, while Nintendo mostly targeted the younger audience, and Nintendo fans

Oh, so Nintendo didn\'t mind giving up that market share?  I see:rolleyes:

Nintendo didn\'t read the market right with the N64 and that\'s why Playstation took over.  The N64 came out later, it supported an unfavorable medium to developers, and Nintendo was too picky with the whole "quality over quantity" policy.  

Nintendo has never intentionally targeted a different audience, the consumer changed and Nintendo ignored that dynamic.

What do you think they keep referring to when they say "we\'ll come back" or something like that?  What was the effort to secure Resident Evil for the Gamecube?  Was that for the kiddies?  

I estimate.Just as you do.

Fair enough.

Ahm....if thats what you want to believe.

Well, I\'m convinced that you have severe misconceptions about what\'s about to do down for next generation but I don\'t doubt you think the same of me.  I think all we can do is agree to disagree, then wait and see what happens.

Originally posted by Lord Nicon
Trust me im not. Ive seen the unreal engine. Ive seen half the shots. The cell hype isnt what "fear the power of emotion" was, nor are they putting up numbers similar to those of last gen\'s. Nintendo is said they are going to start/create a revolution with the new "revolution" - that tells me a lot. Standarization of tools, Mistwalker said this, Sega said this. Why? How? From the looks of things sega\'s first attempts at next gen have been poor thus far. I havent seen anything otherwise.

Im not asking sony to show all of their cards. But if a lot of you are in agreement that this gen should start at the end of 2005, i dont know why we havent seen more. Perhaps our definition of "more" varies, but half the things you listed are far from something to jump about. True, there are some very exciting points but the rest isnt there.

Perhaps theres quite a bit to be excited about when it comes to ms and all of that and i dont mean to be a Sony whore, which i wouldnt say, but for some odd reason, ms hasnt grown on me, nor have they given me much of a reason to look too far into what they are doing. Maybe its my mood but im waiting on sony and from the looks of things you\'ve set your eyes on what ms is doing. Theres nothing wrong with that, but on my "side" of the playing field, if you want to call it that, there isnt much.

Im not very motivated to go into detail but its just how i feel.

Guess it does depend who you talk to...

The actual official specs for the PS3 will more than likely be cut down to make it more affordable to produce and for consumers. I remember the ps2 specs were somewhat cut down from the original proposals. Doesn\'t 4Ghz or so sound like wishful thinking? Considering the fact that PC\'s are still only touching 3Ghz.

We ve got a year until its produced

It\'s time for new consoles, in my opinion.  I\'m still enjoying this generation however it has been getting stagnant for the past year or so.  Too many sequels of games, though great as they are, look and play all too similar.  "Been there, done that" is becoming common.  

Knotter,
The PS3 will not do true raycasting.  We might see that with the PS4 and Xbox 3.  In the mean time we\'ll see the type of raycasting that\'s been around since the PS One days.

Originally posted by Phill
The actual official specs for the PS3 will more than likely be cut down to make it more affordable to produce and for consumers. I remember the ps2 specs were somewhat cut down from the original proposals. Doesn\'t 4Ghz or so sound like wishful thinking? Considering the fact that PC\'s are still only touching 3Ghz.

So were the Xbox specs. I wouldn\'t speculate about it at this point though, no way to tell. Let\'s just wait for the official unveiling in May, shall we?

You can\'t compare a PC CPU with the Cell. They\'re completely different architectures. The Cell is designed to run at high speeds doing specialized operations and is an in-order CPU. PC CPUs are massively out-of-order CPUs designed for general purpose applications. They\'re way more complex than the Cell in terms of logic etc. But of course they might cut the speed of it if the yields aren\'t good enough but no one but STI knows about that for sure at this point in time. So why speculate?

[BizioEE]

Hi everybody!:)

I think PS3 will be released in 2006, just my opinion, and I think it will be extremely powerful! I forecast more powerful than the successor of XBox! That\'s only my opinion, and I see PS3 later then the next XBox....


ps HI Ginko!!!!!!!!

[BizioEE]

Originally posted by Phill
The actual official specs for the PS3 will more than likely be cut down to make it more affordable to produce and for consumers. I remember the ps2 specs were somewhat cut down from the original proposals. Doesn\'t 4Ghz or so sound like wishful thinking? Considering the fact that PC\'s are still only touching 3Ghz.

The first time I heard about official words/possible specs about PS2, I heard about a CPU running at 250 MHz capable of 55 M poly/sec with no effects, and we know the final specs were a little higher...66 M poly/sec......let\'s wait and see......

BizioEE!!!

*drops dead*

[BizioEE]

Hi Samwise !!!!

I\'ve been so busy lately with my job, a nightmare, for the last two years!!!  How are you?