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Author Topic: Separation of Church and State  (Read 8682 times)

Offline SirMystiq

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Separation of Church and State
« Reply #165 on: May 17, 2005, 10:28:35 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by GigaShadow
Can another Catholic back this up?  I don\'t believe that the Catholic Church or most of its members view Protestants as "non believers" who worship a different God.  

Also who are you to say what "God wants"?  This is not a different subject Mystiq - you claimed Muslims and Christians don\'t worship the same God, now you are claiming Protestants and Catholics don\'t worship the same God.


Well Giga. I can recall saying that the Catholic Church does not recognize other Christian religions because of the way they worship God. I think I took it too far by saying we don\'t recognize them, but let\'s put it this way.

Non-Catholic = Broke away from the TRUE CHURCH according to Catholics.

Never did I say they were different Gods. But, if it helps you, Cloud and Gman in your constant irrelevant attacks to my me instead of my post, then so be it.


http://www.catholic.com/library/Salvation_Outside_the_Church.asp
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Offline GigaShadow
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Separation of Church and State
« Reply #166 on: May 18, 2005, 04:15:34 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by SirMystiq

Never did I say they were different Gods. But, if it helps you, Cloud and Gman in your constant irrelevant attacks to my me instead of my post, then so be it.


 


You didn\'t?  I think a majority of the posters in this thread would disagree with that statement.  Stop whining about "attacks" on you - they are attacking your fucked up views and if you can\'t handle it don\'t post here.  Just admit you are wrong and this thread will die.
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Offline sCaRz*Of*PaiN
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Separation of Church and State
« Reply #167 on: May 18, 2005, 01:18:06 PM »
How long do you sit there and type for? :eek: Days? Months? ... Years?
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Offline cloud345
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Separation of Church and State
« Reply #168 on: May 18, 2005, 04:20:45 PM »
You seem to think for some random and odd reason that Jesus determines the God.

Just because he is the Messiah in christianity and a prophet in another has nothing to do with the God. You seem to think that Jesus is god ad I don\'t know who has told you this but Jesus is the son of god. If he was not God why would he ever have to pray to God? What would be the point of him praying to himself?

So to answer your first question, No Jesus is not God.

In the eyes of christians, I have not once heard someone say that Jews or Mulsims worship a different god because they dont believe Jesus is the son of God. Where you heard that, once again I do not know.

As for your next question I will tell you once again, the way a religion views Jesus, does not determine the way they view God. Also, once again, Jesus is not God. God has always been. Jesus was born and then created by God. There for he can not be god. God is one, he is the only one, there is no god besides him.

God is not three people. I have said this before.

God=God
Jesus=Son
Holy Spirit=God\'s Spirit

It\'s just like saying I am two different people, one for my body and one for my soul.

Quote
"Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on Him that sent me. And he that seeth me, seeth Him that sent me." (...) For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.


Quote
"And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent."

John 17:3


There are two quotes from the bible having Jesus say he is not god.

Also did you know that Jesus is more than a prophet in Islam? In Islam it is said that one day a man pretending to be the reincarnation of Jesus will try to gain followers. At the same time the real Jesus will be born again and he will gain followers. On Judgement day, the real Jesus will take his followers to heaven and let the false Jesus and his followers go to hell.

Now answer my Question:

Muslims, Christians and Jews all believe in one god. All three have people who have all talken to god in all three religions. Who do you think Abraham was talking to in Christianity? Who do you think he was talking in Islam? And Judaism?

Why would Muslims and Christians change the god of the religion they base their beliefs on?

Why are Christians and Jews considered people of the book?

Is Jesus not a prophet in Judaism? They worship the same god as christians do, so why cant it be the same with Islam?
« Last Edit: May 18, 2005, 05:21:54 PM by cloud345 »
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Offline Evi

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« Reply #169 on: May 18, 2005, 04:27:38 PM »
Jesus is God, and Jesus is also the son of God. Jesus is man and Jesus is God in the bible. Don\'t know what books you\'re reading.
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Offline cloud345
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« Reply #170 on: May 18, 2005, 04:54:48 PM »
Don\'t know what books your reading either.
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Offline Evi

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« Reply #171 on: May 18, 2005, 04:57:48 PM »
I\'m not arguing with you because you\'re just wrong.
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Offline cloud345
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« Reply #172 on: May 18, 2005, 05:23:43 PM »
I could say youre wrong too....but that isnt proving anything now is it.

I\'ve seen arguments about wether Jesus is god or not and it\'s really just how someone interperts the bible. There are some passages suggesting Jesus is God, but at the same time there are some that say he is not.
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Offline Evi

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« Reply #173 on: May 18, 2005, 05:46:19 PM »
Are you arguing from a non-Christian perspective based on assumptions and stereotypes of other people? Or do you just not know what you\'re talking about?
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Offline GmanJoe

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Separation of Church and State
« Reply #174 on: May 18, 2005, 07:17:59 PM »
The New Testament has conflicting positions about Jesus being God and Jesus being the Son of God.

Jesus, while on the cross, does cry out to God asking why He has forsaken Him.

I believe this is where Protestants broke up into other denominations because of this conflicting view. I\'m wondering if this is what also created the Great Schism between the Western and Eastern Universal (Catholic) Church.
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Offline Evi

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« Reply #175 on: May 18, 2005, 07:31:23 PM »
You have to look at the original language concerning the crying out on the cross thing. The word he uses for "God" means something completely different than translated versions of the text.

I guess everyone can stop calling Jesus their "Lord" huh? Because it\'s too conflicting.
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Offline GmanJoe

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Separation of Church and State
« Reply #176 on: May 18, 2005, 07:38:15 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by EviscerationX
You have to look at the original language concerning the crying out on the cross thing. The word he uses for "God" means something completely different than translated versions of the text.

I guess everyone can stop calling Jesus their "Lord" huh? Because it\'s too conflicting.


I\'ve been to several Bible studies of different Christian religions and so I\'m just telling you how they view Jesus and God. I\'m not arguing about this part. Misstique\'s cranium has less density than a helium balloon.
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Offline Evi

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Separation of Church and State
« Reply #177 on: May 18, 2005, 07:45:46 PM »
Quote
Misstique\'s cranium has less density than a helium balloon.
Agreed.

Quote
I\'ve been to several Bible studies of different Christian religions and so I\'m just telling you how they view Jesus and God. I\'m not arguing about this part.
I know. You brought up one of the big factors of this issue that a lot of people debate. So it all gets a little confusing.
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Offline cloud345
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« Reply #178 on: May 19, 2005, 02:26:16 PM »
No, I myself am christian and I do not believe Jesus is god. I looked at some passages from the bible that pointed to him as not being god. But at the same time I saw some that pointed to him being god. It\'s how you interpret the book.
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Offline clips

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« Reply #179 on: May 19, 2005, 03:07:16 PM »
jesus is not god...some say he is because of how some say god did his deeds through jesus..i think in some verses of the bible jesus states something to the effect of "please don\'t credit me with these magnificant feats,..i\'am doing thework of god" maybe this is how some "interpret" jesus is god...
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