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Author Topic: Evolution vs. Intelligent design  (Read 2814 times)

Offline Phil
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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #45 on: November 10, 2005, 03:13:56 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by clips
big bang theory....cut and dry...one big explosion.... planets formed..we\'re here...again i ask you how could have humans been formed from molten rock and lava?....those scientists just go on to say something along the lines of "and the first man was believed to have appeared around so many years ago"..:rolleyes:...they never go on to say HOW he became to be....i respectfully have to disagree with you & others on this one...


Actually, there are studies of how life came to be from non-living material.  It\'s been a while since I read all that so I\'m not going to say things that could be misquoted but look it up.

but yeah, once you get single cell organisms there is a pretty steady study on how organisms evolved from one another. (i.e. mitochondria in multicelled organisms are thought to be once single celled organisms that were in a mutual relationship with another single celled organism and they eventually evolved into one organism.)
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Offline CHIZZY

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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #46 on: November 10, 2005, 04:05:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by clips
those scientists just go on to say something along the lines of "and the first man was believed to have appeared around so many years ago"..:rolleyes:...they never go on to say HOW he became to be....i respectfully have to disagree with you & others on this one...


well, actually, they do.

what an ignorant thing to say. Only religions say shit with nothing to back it up.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2005, 04:07:20 PM by CHIZZY »
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Offline hyper
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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #47 on: November 10, 2005, 06:13:10 PM »
My high school Bio textbook had a section on how scientists were able to develop organic compounds from inorganic materials in laboratory conditions that simulated primitive Earth. Luckily, my roommate has a copy of the same book. Here it is:

Quote

Abiotic synthesis of organic molecules in a model system

Stanley Miller and Harold Urey used an apparatus similar to this one to stimulate chemical dynamics on primitive Earth. A warmed flask of water simulated the primeval sea. The "atmosphere" consisted of H2O, H2, CH4, and NH3. Sparks were discharged in the synthetic atmosphere to mimic lightning. A condenser cooled the atmosphere, raining water and any dissolved compounds back to the miniature sea. As material circulated through the apparatus, the solution in the flask changed from clear to murky brown. After one week, Miller and Urey analyzed the contents of the solution and found a variety of organic compounds, including some of the amino acids that make up the proteins of organisms.

Laboratory analogs of primeval Earth have produced all 20 amino acids commonly found in organisms, several sugars, lipids, the purine and pyrimidine bases present in the nucleotides of DNA and RNA, even ATP (if phosphate is added to the flask). Before there was life, its chemical building blocks may have been accumulating as a natural stage in the chemical evolution of the planet.
[/b]


Cliff’s: the building blocks of life can all be produced spontaneously under natural, inorganic conditions. The book goes on to demonstrate the spontaneous formation of more complex organic polymers and “protobionts,” abiotic aggregates capable of maintaining an internal chemical environment different from their surroundings. I’ll post these too if you all want to read about it.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2005, 06:17:16 PM by hyper »

Offline FatalXception
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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #48 on: November 10, 2005, 10:45:33 PM »
*grin* ownage.

I don\'t have a theory on what came "before" - as in at the very beginning, what started the universe, the big bang, a bang cycle, or whatever.  God is the alpha on a long enough timeline of "everything" where everything is the result of previous actions/reactions.  

That said, that isn\'t what creationism is about.  Creationism is about taking the genesis section of the Bible and applying it to the universe.  Even though the church has dropped it\'s literal interpretation of the \'seven days\' as we know them know version of creation, the idea of creationism is still basically that God created the universe as it is now, right up to a few millenia ago (humans already developed, etc).  The problem is this just contradics EVERYTHING we know about our universe.
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Offline clips

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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #49 on: November 11, 2005, 08:45:56 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by CHIZZY
well, actually, they do.

what an ignorant thing to say. Only religions say shit with nothing to back it up.


it\'s not ignorant chizz...;)..what those scientists are doin is based on theory not fact..."well we think that this happened when their earth was created"..it\'s on that order...basically just about every religion reconizes jesus...it\'s not just me sayin it but a billion other people as well...and c\'mon if life was so easily created as you guys want to believe why is their only life on earth? why not the other planets? All the other planets evolved the same way yet earth is the only one that can sustain life?..intelligent life as we know it?....what i can\'t believe is that some in here just think we just appeared from micro organisms..:p

millions and millions of years we just evolved from a one celled organism to a full structured bone and marrow organism...sorry i\'m not buyin it....and yea you can say that the bible has holes in it and maybe it does but that\'s why you have to do your research and read...what do you believe is going to happen to us as a race? even with all this technology we have now s**t is still gettin\' worse not better...no jobs are to be found, each generation that passes is worse than the other..the middle class is bein squeezed beyond recognition my son and daughter will have no social security, it goes on and on...the big guy upstairs is just lettin us run rampant with this stuff and is just givin us time to make our own choices...let me stop there... just keep in mind this is what i believe...and i respect what everybody else beliveve\'s in but i just feel that we just didn\'t evolve in the way some say....
knowledge, wisdom & understanding..these are the basic fundamentals of life

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Offline hyper
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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #50 on: November 11, 2005, 10:48:09 AM »
Among the planets in the solar system, only Earth has the right size, distance from the sun, and abundance of water to allow for carbon-based life. Other planets are too far from the sun (or too close), which leads to extremely long orbital times and dramatic drops in temperature, have no atmospheric protection from UV light, lack suitable water, etc. I\'m no planetary expert, but this is all stuff I learned in high school.

If you throw aside the religious falsifications and look on the molecular level, you find a constant vindication of evolution. Life is universally based on DNA, RNA, the same 20 amino acids, ATP, mitosis, meiosis, all of which lead to the case for an ancient prototype that gave rise to everything else. Even the question of the non-spontaneity of life can be answered when you consider the Second Law of Thermodynamics. It frustrates me that proponents of intelligent design constantly raise biological questions that research has in almost all cases already answered. The reason that intelligent design has such mass appeal is because of its simplicity. One needs only to actually study biology to see that evolution is not just the random development of appendages, but a complex build-up at the molecular level. It is sad that more than half of Americans choose the easier alternative because they lack the drive to educate themselves.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2005, 10:51:28 AM by hyper »

Offline GmanJoe

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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #51 on: November 11, 2005, 10:56:35 AM »
Well...with the law of averages, there\'s bound to be at least ONE planet that is habitable to sustain life. If scientists believed in miracles, Earth would be the only one they\'d believe. The right size planet in relation to the right size of the sun, the right average distance, the right type of other planets to give Earth the "ingredients" needed for the building blocks of life....

....basically, it\'s like flipping a coin and having it land on its side 50 million straight times. Anyway....we\'re here.

Any of my fellow stardust beings willing to bet there are no other planets that have intelligent life?
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Offline THX
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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #52 on: November 11, 2005, 10:59:32 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by hyper
If you throw aside the religious falsifications and look on the molecular level, you find a constant vindication of evolution. Life is universally based on DNA, RNA, the same 20 amino acids, ATP, mitosis, meiosis, all of which lead to the case for an ancient prototype that gave rise to everything else.

Why do you keep saying that?  So what?  

"We are all based on the same amino acid building blocks"  yea sure, but it proves nothing.

If you knew a bit about the Bible it said God formed man from the earth which would also comply with the religious falsifications you speak of.

We could keep arguing back & forth but I swear to you no amount links and quotes will convert anyone here, and vice-versa. :hat:

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Offline hyper
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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #53 on: November 11, 2005, 11:07:41 AM »
But then there are infinitely more planets out there, and one of them must contain life! Dammit, I wish I could go into astrophysics (or whatever this field is called) here, but then I\'ll never be able to able to buy my mom the Lexus she\'s always wanted. :) Oh, before I forget, CONTACT is an amazing movie to watch if you are interested about this stuff (although I\'m guessing that most of the people here have already seen it).

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Offline hyper
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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #54 on: November 11, 2005, 11:14:12 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by THX
Why do you keep saying that?  So what?  

"We are all based on the same amino acid building blocks"  yea sure, but it proves nothing.

If you knew a bit about the Bible it said God formed man from the earth which would also comply with the religious falsifications you speak of.

We could keep arguing back & forth but I swear to you no amount links and quotes will convert anyone here, and vice-versa. :hat:


Like I said, that we all share the same building blocks tells me that we have a common ancestor. But you are right, I should not presume to "convert" anyone since I am no expert. And I would be a hypocrite if I blindly ignored religious arguments. End of discussion from me.

Offline Titan

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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #55 on: November 11, 2005, 02:28:10 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by hyper
Among the planets in the solar system, only Earth has the right size, distance from the sun, and abundance of water to allow for carbon-based life. Other planets are too far from the sun (or too close), which leads to extremely long orbital times and dramatic drops in temperature, have no atmospheric protection from UV light, lack suitable water, etc. I\'m no planetary expert, but this is all stuff I learned in high school.

If you throw aside the religious falsifications and look on the molecular level, you find a constant vindication of evolution. Life is universally based on DNA, RNA, the same 20 amino acids, ATP, mitosis, meiosis, all of which lead to the case for an ancient prototype that gave rise to everything else. Even the question of the non-spontaneity of life can be answered when you consider the Second Law of Thermodynamics. It frustrates me that proponents of intelligent design constantly raise biological questions that research has in almost all cases already answered. The reason that intelligent design has such mass appeal is because of its simplicity. One needs only to actually study biology to see that evolution is not just the random development of appendages, but a complex build-up at the molecular level. It is sad that more than half of Americans choose the easier alternative because they lack the drive to educate themselves.


I agree with you 100%. However, I read that the only other place that may have life on it is the moon Titan (I believe its titan). It supposedly has water and may support bacteria. Anyway, its just a theory. As well as the theory that Mars was once like Earth.
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Offline MPTheory

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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #56 on: November 16, 2005, 01:49:42 PM »
When it comes to our creation, I will always choose to believe science over religion. Keep in mind that  religion was created by man. Wonderfull little Life-teaching lessons for us humans to go by. We all need something to believe in. I think thats what makes religion so damn popular. The sad thing about all religions is the harm and hate it creates. (which is why I choose to stay away from it at all costs).

Just on a side note,

I love how there are so many different religions out there, yet all of them are "the way it is".  (Impossible BTW). Every animal in nature, with the exception of a few, fit into their enviroment, creating a balance.  To be honest. I think people are a planet-eating-fungus. Yes - God is an Omnipresent mushroom!

Offline FatalXception
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« Reply #57 on: December 21, 2005, 03:55:48 PM »
Necropost!

The Article

In the first court decision rendered on (Intelligent Design) ID and evolution, ID took a nasty blow to the head.  The Judge ruled that ID could not be taught in schools as it violates separation of school and state, that there is no scientific evidence to support ID, and that officials who wanted it taught gave inconsistent and downright perjurious (sp?) testimony.

Ka-zam!
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Offline Titan

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Evolution vs. Intelligent design
« Reply #58 on: December 21, 2005, 05:37:30 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by FatalXception
Necropost!

The Article

In the first court decision rendered on (Intelligent Design) ID and evolution, ID took a nasty blow to the head.  The Judge ruled that ID could not be taught in schools as it violates separation of school and state, that there is no scientific evidence to support ID, and that officials who wanted it taught gave inconsistent and downright perjurious (sp?) testimony.

Ka-zam!


Heh. I think this is appropriate
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13 year old boys sleep with older women cause theyd be stupid not to

 

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