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Author Topic: Why Adventure/Platform Games Suck  (Read 1781 times)

Offline RichG
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Why Adventure/Platform Games Suck
« Reply #15 on: April 23, 2002, 01:28:30 AM »
Agreed platform games suck! Adventure games are cool though.

Offline Luke
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Why Adventure/Platform Games Suck
« Reply #16 on: April 23, 2002, 10:51:34 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Videoholic


Dude....  You need to get out of my head.


its nice to see somebody else gives respect to one of the greatest advernture games ever...

i RARELY play games a second time but ive played Grim Fandango like 5 or 6 times now.


manny calevera rules!
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Offline TomN
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Why Adventure/Platform Games Suck
« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2002, 11:21:04 AM »
You guys are being pretty strict about what fits into what genre and what a certain genre is.

I never had a good grasp on what a certain genre meant because so many games, no matter what genre they are in seem similar.

maybe you could help me.

When you say pure Adventure game, what do you mean?
What are some examples and how does that differ from a action game, or action/adventure?

I think the genre names are tossed around very loosely and Don\'t mean as much as they maybe did in the past.


I think I have a good idea of what a Platformer is, but yet I see eliments of it in all types of games.

One thing I know is I hate platforming. I hate stupid twitchy jumping rolling and climbing. I hate having to do the same thing over and over again until I get it perfect.


I would rather be stuck because I don\'t know what to do.
rather than being stuck knowing what to do and not being able to do it.
Once I figure out what my next move is, I just want to do it.

Is ICO an Advenure game or a Puzzle game?

I thought it was an Adventerous puzzle game, but what do I know.

Is tomb Raider Action, Adventure or What?

Give me some examples of what you think best describes each genre. Cause I think it\'s pretty subjective and there are so many games with elements of each.

I never got into PC games, but most of you see mto think the PC has the only or best pure Adventure games. What do you mean by this and what are some examples?

Thanks
And
Later
TomN

Offline SwifDi
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Why Adventure/Platform Games Suck
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2002, 01:49:07 PM »
They aren\'t that bad. Seem to have gone slightly downhill since they started to move into the 3D realm....

Here are some that definately don\'t suck:

Mario (All of them!)
Banjo-Kazooie
Conquer\'s Bad Fur Day
Rocket: Robot on Wheels (I liked it...)
Sonic The Hedgehog (1 and 2 in particular)

i\'m just going to stop because I have 30 other games in my head.

Offline Ghettomath
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« Reply #19 on: April 23, 2002, 03:33:29 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ghettomath
Grim Fandango for the PC was one of my all time favorites.


I didn\'t forget guys.  This game is right up there with Half-life, Goldeneye 64, and FF7.
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Offline SonyFan
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« Reply #20 on: April 23, 2002, 06:23:30 PM »
I\'m not a Genre expert TomN, but I\'m probably one of those closest to being an Adventure game expert on these boards so I\'ll try to answer you questions as well as I can.

Adventures, pure adventures, have gameplay that revolves around a few key points.

Exploration. - Walking around a described, prerendered, or fully 3D world and interacting with it.

Dialouge/Storyline - Old style adventures are starting to be called IF or Interactive Fiction. They have a heavy emphesis on storytelling and dialouge between characters. Most of the time (but not always) you are limited to one playable character who you guide through the Adventure.

Puzzle Solving. - This is the real flesh of an adventure game. This is not like Tomb Raider\'s "Find a key, Find a keyhole, Pull a lever, jump, jump, roll" kinda puzzle solving. This kinda puzzle solving includes Item Hunting where you solve a puzzle, gain an item, use that item to solve another puzzle.. ect ect.. and it usually includes a great deal of non-linear or "Non-Logical" thinking. For instance, to save you cheif engineer from the brig in Space Quest 5, you have to get a packet of SpaceMonkeys. On the back it says, do no mix with alcohol. So you have to put the space monkeys into your drink, which then fill up the spacestation with lil green critters. That draws SpaceCommand officers away from the brig, allowing you access to Cliffy\'s cell. Then you have use you pet face-hugger spike (as seen in the picture above) to take a piddle on the bars. The acid in his urine eats through them and lets Cliffy escape. It\'s actually a lot harder than it sounds when you have to figure it all out for yourself.

No or very little Action - In adventure games, there is very little action or fighting. If there is, there is usually a way around around it or a way to avoid it if you want.

There are two reason why, I feel, that adventure games have never been big on Consoles. First off, they\'re brain twisters with very little to no action. Console gamers have grown up with itchy thumbs and enjoy alot of fast paced action in they\'re games. This won\'t get you through an adventure where things are usually pretty slow paced. Another reason is that in the past, Adventure games have almost always been ported over from the PC and built with a KB & Mouse in mind and not a joystick. It makes the game engine cumbersome to scroll through item menus and options to connect actions with items or worse.. a slow moving mouse cursor controlled with the D-Pad. Now that we\'re seeing more and more adventure/adventure based games being build specifically for consoles, they\'re starting to gain in popularity.

As far as what marks a game into a certain genre. It has to do with just how heavily it relies on a certain gameplay aspect. Resident Evil is adventure in my (and many other people\'s) mind because the focus is on item-hunting/Puzzle solving first. You can run past zombies.. and there\'s very few areas where you absolutely MUST kill monsters to advance.. but just see how far you get when you decide not to pick up and use items to solve puzzles. Some games, like Zelda and QFG, defy classification. QFG being my example because I know the most about it. :D In QFG, you cannot advance without solving puzzles OR increasing your stats. Many puzzles rely on decent stats in order to complete. Like for example, to solve the healer\'s ring quest.. you have to have either a high throwing skill or a high climbing skill to get the ring from out of a birds nest. Yet, combat is almost completely optional... even for a fighter class character. You increase skills through practice.. not slaying monsters.

Anyhow, if you want to play through a few good "Pure" Adventure games.. then I suggest picking up:

Grim Fedango ;)
Sam & Max hit the Road
Monkey Island
Leather Godesses of Phobos
Adventures in Serenia
Mystery House
Mist
Frankenstein: Through the eyes of the Monster
Gabriel Knight
Kings Quest
Les Manly: Search for the King
Leisure Suit Larry
Quest for Glory (A good example of a hybrid adventure game)
Indiana Jones: Fate of Atlantis
Manic Mansion/Day of the Tentical
Willy Beamish
Legend of Kyrandia
Heart of China
Rise of the Dragon
Zork
Stupid Invaders
The Longest Journey
Riven
Lighthouse

That\'s just a few off the top of my head. http://www.MobyGames.com will be a lot more helpful. In most cases, you\'ll have to buy these games.. but there are other methods to getting what you want if the game you want to play is no longer sold or supported by it\'s parent company. PM me if you need further guidance.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2002, 06:31:11 PM by SonyFan »
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Offline Luke
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« Reply #21 on: April 23, 2002, 10:01:02 PM »
after talking about it i started playing grim fandango again today.

for dose of u\'s who aint never played said game... you should.





LOOKY HERE! you can get it for a mere ten bucks from Amazon.


THATS A STEAL OF A DEAL BUDDYS!
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Offline TomN
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Why Adventure/Platform Games Suck
« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2002, 06:17:38 AM »
Sonyfan,
Thanks for putting in that time and effort to answer my Q\'s. That helped tremendously.

The reason I asked is because I have had this feeling my favorite genre is Adventure, but yet I have been playing exclusively on consoles, so I never really knew what I was missing. And haven;t been satisfied with the games I have been playing.

My PC just isn\'t built for playing modern games, so I have always turned to consoles for my gameing and yet always been frustrated with the lack of "Thinking" games available. I thought it was just me. Then ICO game out and I was in bliss.......for 5 days. But there has been nothing like it since and there seems to be nothing like it on the horizon.

Seeing as my 2 favorite genres seem to be RTS And Adventure, I think it\'s time to put toghther a decent PC and pick up some of those games.

Thanks Again

Offline Hawke
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« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2002, 06:40:11 AM »
SonyFan.. how COULD YOU! You didn\'t list Simon the Sorcerer games there!!??!?! StS2 is certainly one of the funniest/best adveture games ever made! Okay, so it\'s just an opinion... but if you\'ve played the game you\'ll surely agree! :D
« Last Edit: April 24, 2002, 06:45:22 AM by Hawke »
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Offline SonyFan
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« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2002, 09:02:52 AM »
Ah well. I can\'t please everyone. Sorry bout that Hawke... it wasn\'t like a top 20 list or anything, just games off the top of my head. If I would have really gone all balls to the walls with it I could have a list 4x that size.. and Simon the Sorcerrer would definately be up there.

I missed Diskworld, The Dig, Martain Memorandum, and Seventh Guest/11th Hour too. :D

TomN, if you can surf the net, you can play most of those games up there. Actually, many of them (expecially the SCI scripted Sierra games) won\'t run on faster computers without a slowdown utilitiy to keep it from getting runtime errors. Basically, if it was made before 1998, you should have no problems running it on a Pentium 166 64mb Ram. Grim Fandango and The Longest Journey might be a bit higher specs wise, but not by much.

Problem is, you can\'t buy many of those older games anymore. But like I said, just because they\'re not available anymore dosen\'t mean you can\'t get ahold of em. I know how, but since it\'s technically illegal I can\'t post the method here. mm gives me a bit of leeway with this since the only reason why I do it is because these games are hard to find, and noone makes money off of them anymore. Anyhow, if you want some of these older games, just PM me and I\'ll point you in the right direction. :D Newer ones like QFG5, Grim Fandango, The Longest Journey, Stupid Invaders, ect, you\'re going to have to buy.

[edit]BTW: If you want to go ahead and buy a new PC for some good new adventure games, check out http://www.justadventure.com/. Read carefully though, since they tend to put a ton of games with even the slightest hint of Adventure qualities in with "pure" adventures. It sucks you see games like Tresspasser, Deus Ex, and Tomb Raider in with the "pure breed" adventures.. but they also have excellent coverage of both import and fan-made adventure games.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2002, 09:11:05 AM by SonyFan »
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Offline Hawke
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« Reply #25 on: April 24, 2002, 09:20:28 AM »
I don\'t have to worry about low availability of old adventure games... I own all the originals :D Well... not all, but... err.. many!

Oooo... The Dig... *listens to the soundtrack and gets lost in Cocytus once again*
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Offline Ghettomath
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« Reply #26 on: April 24, 2002, 01:39:32 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by SonyFan

There are two reason why, I feel, that adventure games have never been big on Consoles. First off, they\'re brain twisters with very little to no action. Console gamers have grown up with itchy thumbs and enjoy alot of fast paced action in they\'re games. This won\'t get you through an adventure where things are usually pretty slow paced. Another reason is that in the past, Adventure games have almost always been ported over from the PC and built with a KB & Mouse in mind and not a joystick.



Don\'t forget SonyFan (Now dubbed Master-Of-All-In-Adventure-Gaming) that consoles are preferred over computers because they have the multiplayer, at-home capability.  Adventure games were never worked at the boom of the console because people liked the action of two player.
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Offline SonyFan
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« Reply #27 on: April 24, 2002, 04:50:12 PM »
True Ghetto, that was "A" factor. One of many, but I don\'t think it was one of the main reasons why Adventure games never took off on consoles. I mean, just look at all the single player games that gained huge popularity on consoles in the past.

Funny thing is, most old skool adventure gamers know that even while one person controls the game, having two players there working together increases the fun. Not to mention that people have a way of getting stuck into one way of thinging. Ever had to just walk away from puzzle for a few hours and come back to see the answer staring you in the face? Having another person\'s point of view there to help figure out puzzles and give advice is a great way to advance in these games.

Adventures are one of the very few genre\'s that are almost everybit as entertaining and satisfying for an observer as it is for the player.
Please Bleed.. so I know that you are real.
Please Bleed.. so I know that you can feel the damage that you\'ve done.
What have I become? To myself I am numb. ~ Ben Harper
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Offline Luke
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« Reply #28 on: April 24, 2002, 09:45:06 PM »
after seeing your sig 100 times sonyfan, i just gotta ask...

did you think Gabriel Knight 3 sucked as much as I did?

god i hate that game with a passion.
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Offline SonyFan
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« Reply #29 on: April 24, 2002, 11:33:10 PM »
Actually.... I dunno. My Computer is too big a pile of steaming feces to run it reliably. :( I\'ll let you know in two months tho.
Please Bleed.. so I know that you are real.
Please Bleed.. so I know that you can feel the damage that you\'ve done.
What have I become? To myself I am numb. ~ Ben Harper
Plane Crash <-- moe. (Listen to while staring at Heat\'s Avvy.)
PSO Ep I & II~ Tesla: LvL 101 HUmar |Sinue: LvL 32 RAcaseal |Mana: LvL 52 FOnewearl |Malice: LvL 42 RAmarl

 

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