Tonight\'s Presidential Debate (Reactions)

It\'s too bad that most people only watch the first debate, because what I got from it was basically a draw, though Kerry did hammer Bush on a few points, which was nice. Also, that agitated frown that Bush got whenever Kerry was making a point I just found halarious -- kind of reminded me of ol\' Florida Gator Football coach Steve Spurrier.

Anyways, I guarantee you that most of the country will only watch that first debate...if I\'m proved wrong, however, I believe that Kerry could see a significant jump in the polls once they start reaching domestic issues. Should be a fun couple of weeks

See Yuz.

Originally posted by Ace
Exactly! This is the stuff that drives me nuts. I want details from Kerry on exactly how he plans on getting France or Germany into our camp on the Iraq issue. It\'s not gonna happen because we all know there are deeper issues with these two countries that go deeper than a disagreement on how this war is being waged.

Kerry really is a joke. Why the hell didn\'t Bush just dig him on his senate career? I think he mentioned it once quickly as a joke. Dammit, if I was Bush I would be firing people today.

We all know these debates are about appearances. Not too many Americans give a shit about answers to the questions at hand.

I really wish Bush would have nailed him on the United Nations stuff.  It is a corrupt organization that wanted to continue to pass resolutions in order to keep the money flowing in from Oil for Food Program.

I also wish he would have hammered Kerry on his voting record in the Senate.  Kerry is trying to trick the public into believing he is going to hold this magical summit that will make France and Germany (and lets face it folks that is who he is referring to when he talks about rebuilding alliances) send a hundred thousand troops to Iraq.  :rolleyes:

Another missed opportunity was this:

Kerry says the President always has that option to engage in a preemptive strike and then, amazingly brings up JFK\'s consultation with the French during the Cuban missile crisis. That was a softball for Bush to hit...

Shockingly, Bush passed up the opportunity. His rebuttal is, however, devastating. He says he doesn\'t know what it means to "pass a global test. . . . My attitude is you take preemptive action in order to protect the American people."

Just so were clear.  I don\'t like this whole "flip-flopping" method against Bush.

If your doing something and you see that it is wrong, why stay with it?  Are you telling me that if something is not working we should stand by it?  I\'d rather someone come out and say, I made a mistake, I\'m changing my plan of action.  Rather than, I screwed up, but were gonna keep doing it because I don\'t want to be a flip-flopper.

I\'d rather have a flip-flopper than someone stubborn as a rock.

Don\'t like Kerry, but in my eyes he won the debate.  I consider myself a swing voter, and if anything I\'m leaning more towards Kerry now.

Kerry is a flip-flopper.
Bush is stubborn as a rock.

Take your pick.

So the other debates could change your mind?

Bush clearly stated that he would adapt to situations.  The main issue he hammers about being unwaivering on is the job must be completed in Iraq.  

Bush: No draft. Fight terrorists around the world, don\'t have to do it here. Don\'t turn our security over to others; we believe in the "transformational power of liberty." Free Afghanistan and Iraq, an example for the Middle East. We\'ve climbed the mountain, the valley below is the valley of peace.

That was George Bush\'s message plain and simple.

Originally posted by GigaShadow
My question should be can you differentiate substance from style?  Kerry may have looked better, but his message was no less confusing.  He has no plan.  Secondly, do you even follow the news?  The VP debate is scheduled for Tuesday - and then on Friday we have the second Presidential debate which we be a townhall style debate that will cover both foreign and domestic issues.  And you have the nerve to ask if I watched the debate?  :rolleyes:

You are right. I meant next Friday. The final debate is the one that covers domestic issues.

As far as substance vs. style GWB had neither. Saying "Its hard work", "wrong war, wrong place, wrong time", "Its hard work", "You change positions" ad infinitum is not substance. Bush did not provide any more substance than Kerry did. It is that fact alone that makes the style more glaring.

Originally posted by GigaShadow
For liberals such as yourself BS - Polls only count when you are ahead and now it seems debates only matter when your boy comes out on top - even if it is only superficial.  The real winner will be known on November 2nd... or maybe not if the whiny DNC lawyers demand recounts in every battle ground state.

MORE spin from our resident FoxNews correspondent. When have I ever said that a poll didn\'t matter? Conservatives are coming out of the woodwork talking about how the debates don\'t really mean anything anymore. That is complete bullshit spin. Kerry was flip-flopping, debates don\'t mean anything, Kerry had no substance. It is ALL bullshit damage control spin. The GOP can NOT win this election on the issues. They would rather focus on "flip-flopping". Still as one intelligent debater said recently, "You can be certain but be wrong".

"pass a global test. . . . My attitude is you take preemptive action in order to protect the American people."

Even if that means passing false information to justify it?  There were no WMD, Saddam was not an immediate threat.

On Iraq, there\'s increasingly LESS interest from other countries to help out.  I think Kerry\'s biggest criticism is that we went into action far too early and without enough to support, thus the need for stronger alliances(his main issue).  A clear and concise plan was not thought out, Bush even said it himself last night that it\'ll be done when it\'s done.  How is that reassuring?  How is that even convincing?

I just don\'t see why you guys are giving him so much credibility?

As for the global test...what did Kerry mean by that?  I take it he meant we must focus on a global war on terror...

Originally posted by Black Samurai
The GOP can NOT win this election on the issues. They would rather focus on "flip-flopping". Still as one intelligent debater said recently, "You can be certain but be wrong".

These are issues.  Kerry\'s voting record is an issue!  His inconsistancy is an issue!  

Flip flopping?  You mean like one not so intelligent debater did recently?

KERRY CLAIMS HE\'S "NEVER, EVER" USED WORD "LYING" IN REFERENCE TO PRESIDENT BUSH ON IRAQ.  JIM LEHRER: "New question, Senator Kerry. Two minutes. You\'ve repeatedly accused President Bush, not here tonight but elsewhere before, of not telling the truth about Iraq. Essentially, of lying to the American people about Iraq. Give us some examples of what you consider to be his not telling the truth." SEN. KERRY: "Well, I\'ve never, ever used the harshest word as you just did." (Sen. John Kerry, First Presidential Debate, Miami, FL, 9/30/04)

BUT IN DECEMBER 2003, KERRY TOLD NEW HAMPSHIRE EDITORIAL BOARD BUSH "LIED" ABOUT REASON FOR GOING TO WAR IN IRAQ.  "Kerry also told a New Hampshire newspaper editorial board Friday that Bush had \'lied\' about his reasons for going to war in Iraq, a word Kerry has been reluctant to use publicly for months. Yesterday he said he did not plan to use the word again." (Patrick Healy, "Kerry Camp Lowers N.H. Expectations Behind In Polls, Senator Now Seeks Spot In \'Top Two,\'" The Boston Globe, 12/8/03)

AND IN SEPTEMBER 2003, KERRY SAID BUSH ADMINISTRATION "LIED" AND "MISLED."  "This administration has lied to us. They have misled us. And they have broken their promises to us. The president promised to the people and the Congress that he would build an international coalition, respect the United Nations\' process and only go to war as a last resort. I will tell you that from my war fighting experience, I believe there is a test for a president as to how you go to war. And that test is whether or not you can look in the eyes of parents and say to them, \'I did everything possible to avoid the loss of your son and daughter, but we had no other choice in order to protect the security of our nation,\' and I know this president fails that test in Iraq." (Sen. John Kerry, Campaign Event, Claremont, NH, 9/20/03)

Face it BS - If the Dems had any decent candidate this year the election would over - Hell I would even vote for someone electable other than those two, but I can\'t and Kerry is weaker than Bush when it comes to making decisions.

Originally posted by Ginko


As for the global test...what did Kerry mean by that?  I take it he meant we must focus on a global war on terror...

Wrong answer... try again.

Originally posted by GigaShadow
Wrong answer... try again.

I know, I know!!!! Oooh, oooh!!!!!

That\'s why I\'m asking.  Stop being such a jerk.

Originally posted by ooseven
Bush looked more like a terrified rabbit caught in a cars head lights to me.

......didn\'t see that

Alliances are not just about military involvement. World-wide political stability does not require France and Germany sending troops to Iraq.

The US, now after invading two middle eastern countries, must work with the rest of the world to make the region stable. We must set up a large number of confrences with Iran, Iraq, and all European leaders.

Bush is using Americas plan to rebuild the world, where as I think the results would be more long term if Kerry worked with other leaders like he is proposing.

Are you not going to help me out on understanding what he meant by global test?  Or is it that you don\'t know or that it doesn\'t have any relevance to your pro-bush stance?

Global Test is a buzzword phrase that means we get UN approval or something similar before we protect ourselves.