Brett Favre

Tom Brady\'s been winning Super Bowls with practically no one around him.

And while it takes two to complete a pass, Favre\'s always had good receivers, like Driver and Freeman, and a perpetually solid O-line. Jerry Rice wouldn\'t have gotten all of his numbers with Trent Dilfer throwing to him.

Facts are, Favre\'s interceptions are mostly because he\'s never been careful (which cause some to affectionately refer to him as "a gunslinger"). Gunslingers are gamblers. They can win. They also get picked off an awful lot.

And I\'m not just picking on Favre in particular. I\'ve long thought Peyton Manning was super-overrated as well, for many of the same reasons.

Wow, that kind of stupidity ranks up there with things I\'ve heard out of unicron.

I dare any of you to name five Patriots skill players from their 2001 and 2003 Super Bowl teams without looking.

Or four from their 2004 team, minus the Corey Dillion freebie I\'ll spot ya. That was also the year they had offensive guys playing defense because of injuries. And they STILL won 17 freaking games.

Point was, Tom Brady did a hell of a lot more than Favre with a hell of a lot less. Even more impressive when you consider that the Pats play in a conference that has been vastly more competitive in the last decade.

[Viper_Fujax]

do the same with the packers. five skill players? that\'s all 3 wide recievers, tight end, and running back, and all of those different years...i dont feel like explaining why exactly that is retarded. but good try on making it seem more of a no-talent team than they really were.

if i had to without looking, troy brown, deon branch, kevin faulk, that other running back i think starts with an A, dillon, that whole offensive line has been one of the most solid lines, daniel graham..that\'s all i got off the top of my head, but if i looked at the roster i guarantee i\'d get a handful of "oh yea, that guy helped win the super bowl"..not to mention that the defenses front 7 have been up there with the best in the league for a while, especially during those years

yea...

I dare any of you to name five Patriots skill players from their 2001 and 2003 Super Bowl teams without looking.

Or four from their 2004 team, minus the Corey Dillion freebie I\'ll spot ya. That was also the year they had offensive guys playing defense because of injuries. And they STILL won 17 freaking games.

Point was, Tom Brady did a hell of a lot more than Favre with a hell of a lot less. Even more impressive when you consider that the Pats play in a conference that has been vastly more competitive in the last decade.

I can name players, but that\'s besides the point.  Why don\'t you talk about something more important like the stellar offensive line he\'s always had.

[Living-In-Clip]

I guess Branch was a useless player, eh?

You do realize, someone had to catch those balls and run with them  - right? Brady had plenty of talent around him, it just wasn\'t the kind of talent that shows off. Then last year he gets Moss and everyone just magically forgets he had talent around him all those years.


And let\'s face it, the only reasons the Packers are not releasing Brett is.

(1) It is a PR nightmare. He goes somewhere else and all the idiot cheese-heads will hate Packer management.

(2) If he did come back, he would be a solid back up for if Rodgers got hurt. It would make no sense to let him come back as a starter, as after this "retirement" Green Bay realized they needed to move on and did (wisely drafting Brian Brohm). Still, it doesn\'t hurt to have a solid semi-reliable back up in the wings just in case your unproven starter gets hurt or turns out to be a complete and total failure.

Randy Moss caught one more touchdown in 2007 than Deion Branch has caught in his entire six-year career. Branch is a second-rate player who had one moment in the sun and an utterly pedestrian career before and since.

Kevin Faulk is a hanger-on. Troy Brown was rather awesome I admit. I hope you clowns spare me by not naming David Patten on here.

Anyway, behind all this tangent lies the fact that Brett was never as good as most thought he was, had a tendency to kill his own team (if anyone forgot this year\'s playoffs), and is too old to warrant a real investment.

I guess unless you\'re the Vikings. Or the Bears, who have not had a good quarterback in roughly seventy years.

[Viper_Fujax]

kevin faulk is a hanger-on? did you even watch football last season? i know his rushing yards aren\'t really anything, but he was huge for them last season, especially as a receiving RB

Let me reiterate, he\'s had a steller offensive line always.  Without that it doesn\'t matter how good your skill players are or not.

Brady also before this last year never had overwhelming stats.  People just pointed to his winning super bowls...so how you can only include skill position players in this argument makes no sense.  Defenses and O-Lines help win super bowls (often more so than the skill guys).  Brady\'s average QB rating those years was in the high 80\'s.  

Who were the skill position players around Favre that were so great?  Antonio Freeman?  Dorsey Levens?  Favre never had the talent around him on offense that Brady has.  And Brady arguably had as much talent around him on offense this year as anyone ever has, and didn\'t get it done, choking when it mattered most.

Ryan Grant didn\'t do anything until the end of the year last year.  The Packers got off to an amazing start.  You can\'t put their success on him.  It was on Favre, who WAS the Green Bay offense for most of the season.  The guy finished 2nd in MVP voting for a reason.

If Tom Brady had no one around him, how was the team that successful when Brady only put up moderately good stats during 3 super bowl years?

[clips]

Let me reiterate, he\'s had a steller offensive line always.  Without that it doesn\'t matter how good your skill players are or not.

Exactly..this sums it up,..and this is a factor for any team...For guys like Brady, Manning & other stationary qb\'s that front line protection is crucial....look at what the giants did to the patriots last year,...they keep blitzing brady all game long and kept him off balance.....i\'ve seen a couple of games where teams blitz the s**t out peyton manning and his numbers of the said game dropped dramatically.

Romo knows how to handle pressue a little bit better since he\'s quick and nimble outta the pocket and he has to be,..dallas o-line is not the greatest,..and there were times when as soon as romo hiked the ball, there was a defensive linemen that went right thru the dallas o-line and got right to romo....so yeah those guys on your o-line is a huge factor to your qb winning games and making accurate passes.

[Viper_Fujax]

stupid cowboy fans bringing up stupid cowboy players in a packers/unfortunately patriots thread...

Romo\'s a different sort of case.  He has the talent around him, and he still can\'t win when it matters.

[clips]

stupid cowboy fans bringing up stupid cowboy players in a packers/unfortunately patriots thread...

I love the hate my boys get...makes it that much more satisfyin\' when we whoop your teams\'s ass...:fro: ...Now let\'s finish talkin\' bout the pacs shall we?...my point was basically that a qb needs a strong O-line to be effective...

Romo\'s a different sort of case. He has the talent around him, and he still can\'t win when it matters.

Tru...but alot of those games..(especially that dallas/giants playoff game of last year...dallas really killed themselves with uninspired gameplay....they had so much success last year and were poised to really at the very least to surpass the playoffs and go into the superbowl...but anything can happen the nfl...i really think that last year was the year for them...i don\'t see them doing as good as they did last year...

Let me reiterate, he\'s had a steller offensive line always.  Without that it doesn\'t matter how good your skill players are or not.

i agree there is not a coach in the league that would not trade their entire o-line from the o-line of n.e. in any of the superbowl years. only individual stand outs on bad to mediocre lines make it to pro bowls i.e. olin kreutz cause thats how you get attention

[GmanJoe]

Cowboys will hire Michael Vick once he\'s released.