Newsweek and Bad Reporting . . .

[CHIZZY]

Originally posted by clips
this is what i\'m sayin in a nutshell...but ghettoass wanna call me out on some bulls**t..yo, ghetto some advice.. stop playin\' yourself bro...play your position and sit that ass in the corner when grown folk speak...you try to come off as some type of college scholar, when your s**t is purely elementary...shut the f**k up...

Chizz, you understand what i\'m sayin\' as well...:fro:

Trufin\' boots.

As I posted earlier, Newsweek was right.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=578&e=1&u=/nm/20050525/ts_nm/security_guantanamo_koran_dc

FBI memo reports Guantanamo guards flushing Koran

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - An     FBI agent wrote in a 2002 document made public on Wednesday that a detainee held at the U.S. naval base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, had accused American jailers there of flushing the Koran down a toilet.

The Pentagon said the allegation was not credible.

The declassified document\'s release came the week after the Bush administration denounced as wrong a May 9 Newsweek article that stated U.S. interrogators at Guantanamo had flushed a Koran down a toilet to try to make detainees talk. The magazine retracted the article, which had triggered protests in     Afghanistan in which 16 people died.

The newly released document, dated Aug. 1, 2002, contained a summary of statements made days earlier by a detainee, whose name was redacted, in two interviews with an FBI special agent, whose name also was withheld, at the Guantanamo prison for foreign terrorism suspects.

...

Originally posted by Coredweller
As I posted earlier, Newsweek was right.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=578&e=1&u=/nm/20050525/ts_nm/security_guantanamo_koran_dc

I don\'t see any confirmation anywhere that Newsweek was right.  These prisoners have been trained to say such things as the Pentagon has stated.  The only confirmations they have are these terrorists who are being held or have been held in Gitmo have made the claim that the Koran has been "disrespected".  

IMO they shouldn\'t even be allowed to have the book in the first place.

I also find it amusing that the ACLU was the one to get the classified document released and that they are defending the desicration of this "holy book" - in their words.  Yet, they are all for the degrading of the Bible.  

The hypocracy of the left never ceases to amaze me.

Why couldn\'t you post the whole article Core?  Maybe because it would further weaken your claim:

In other documents, FBI agents stated that Guantanamo detainees also accused U.S. personnel of kicking the Koran and throwing it to the floor, and described beatings by guards. But one document cited a detainee who accused a guard of dropping a Koran, prompting an "uprising" by prisoners, when it was the prisoner himself who dropped it.

"Unfortunately, one thing we\'ve learned over the last couple of years is that detainee statements about their treatment at Guantanamo and other detention centers sometimes have turned out to be more credible than U.S. government statements," said ACLU lawyer Jameel Jaffer.

Yeah I believe a bunch of Islamic terrorists who are taught to lie about almost everything over the US Government.

More information is provided by William Muir\'s "Life of Mahomet", Volume I, footnote 88:


The common Moslem belief is that it is allowable to tell a falsehood on four occasions:
1st, to save one\'s life;
2nd, to effect a peace or reconciliation;
3rd, to persuade a woman;
4th, on the occasion of a journey or expedition.

http://www.answeringislam.net/Index/L/lying.html

Don\'t get started about the ACLU "degrading the Bible."  I know you aren\'t a religious freak.  It\'s also crazy to say the prisoners shouldn\'t be allowed to have a copy of the Koran.  Even the worst, most wretched evil multiple murderers are allowed to have a Bible in US prisons.  This is no different.

I do find it strange that you are pursuing this argument that the Koran was never thrown in the toilet, and the Newsweek story is completely false.  Your only evidence for that position is your claim that the prisoners are unreliable witnesses.  We have a couple FBI agents who repeated the accounts of Koran desecration and other infractions in their reports.  They interviewed the prisoners in person and they believed them, yet you do not.  Oh well, I guess you know better from all your law enforcement experience and being thousands of miles away and all.  :rolleyes:

The fact is, even if we accept your "Life of Mahomet" rules about lying and all that stuff, the best you can claim is "The story may very well be false."  On the other hand, it may very well be true also.  Barring the disclosure of a videotape showing a prison guard flushing a Koran down a toilet, I guess nothing will ever convince you that the US Government might do something wrong.  But then you probably don’t think it\'s wrong to flush a Koran anyway, so I wonder why I bother discussing this with you.

Originally posted by Coredweller
Don\'t get started about the ACLU "degrading the Bible."  I know you aren\'t a religious freak.  It\'s also crazy to say the prisoners shouldn\'t be allowed to have a copy of the Koran.  Even the worst, most wretched evil multiple murderers are allowed to have a Bible in US prisons.  This is no different.

I do find it strange that you are pursuing this argument that the Koran was never thrown in the toilet, and the Newsweek story is completely false.  Your only evidence for that position is your claim that the prisoners are unreliable witnesses.  We have a couple FBI agents who repeated the accounts of Koran desecration and other infractions in their reports.  They interviewed the prisoners in person and they believed them, yet you do not.  Oh well, I guess you know better from all your law enforcement experience and being thousands of miles away and all.  :rolleyes:

The fact is, even if we accept your "Life of Mahomet" rules about lying and all that stuff, the best you can claim is "The story may very well be false."  On the other hand, it may very well be true also.  Barring the disclosure of a videotape showing a prison guard flushing a Koran down a toilet, I guess nothing will ever convince you that the US Government might do something wrong.  But then you probably don’t think it\'s wrong to flush a Koran anyway, so I wonder why I bother discussing this with you.

Do you believe it is wrong for someone to wipe their ass with the Bible such as the Pals did in Bethlehem when they were holed up in church thats sits on top of where Jesus was born?  Where is the condemnation over that?  Didn\'t hear about it?  Not surprising given the bias in the media.  Where were the Christian riots over this?  There weren\'t any because we are civilized and realize it is only a book.

Our government can do no wrong with the people at Gitmo.  They are trash and should be treated as such.  These people have no rights or liberties - they are enemies of this country who have taken up arms against it who aren\'t US citizens.  That is the major difference between a murderer on death row and these clowns.

I am disturbed that you think the government should be accountable for whatever claim they make, yet you don\'t give a damn about what these asshats have done.  You would rather undermine the security of this country for the sake of having the moral high ground.

All the people that work for the ACLU should be put in Gitmo with their beloved freedom fighters.  Do you even know the history of the ACLU and what their founders believed?  What their goal was and still is?  They hide under the guise of liberty and freedom when in truth they want to turn this country into a socialist state free from all religion.  The only reason they are whining about the fundamentalists in Gitmo is to advance their own agenda against the Capitalist/Christian Judeo foundation of this country.  

Do you not find it ironic that they want any mention of God or Christianity removed from every aspect of public life (schools, money, government property), yet they are crying about the hate filled book called the Koran?

As stated earlier, Muslims have a different respect for the physical book of the Koran than Christians do for the Bible.  It doesn\'t make one religion any more or less "civilized" because they have a different belief about the importance of their book.

Once again I\'m shocked by your ability to assume that all prisoners in Guantanamo must be terrorists guilty of the most heinous crimes simply because they\'re in there.  Once again, according to you, the US military and law enforcement can never make a mistake in rounding up the wrong person.  The very fact that there is no accountability or oversight, and no due process for these prisoners virtually guarantees that we have detained innocent people.  If the officer in charge believes as you do that ANY price should be paid to ensure the security of the United States, and he knew that no one was going to be looking over his shoulder, then of course he would cast his net as wide as possible.  Apprehend not only those people who are guilty, but also those who MIGHT be guilty.  Why take the chance, right?

We\'ve spent hundreds of years trying to perfect a criminal justice system that grants the accused the right to due process, knowledge of the allegations against him, and the right to defend himself on those charges, yet we throw all that away the instant we are threatened by a tiny group of pathetic third world scumbags?  I don\'t think they are so dangerous that they are worth the price we\'re paying.  

And you say we\'re more civilized than them?  What\'s the point of bragging about our civilized institutions if we abandon them on a whim?

Core you still don\'t get it.  These people are not in our criminal justice system.  Why do you think they were taken to Gitmo and not to the US mainland?  

Also there have been accounts of released prisoners from Gitmo who go right back to what they were doing - terrorist related activities.  So much for their oathes and trustworthyness...

http://washingtontimes.com/national/20041018-124854-2279r.htm

At least seven former prisoners of the United States at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, have returned to terrorism, despite gaining their freedom by signing pledges to renounce violence.

    At least two are believed to have died in fighting in Afghanistan, and a third was recaptured during a raid on a suspected training camp in Afghanistan, said Lt. Cmdr. Flex Plexico, a Pentagon spokesman. Others are at large.
 
    Additional former detainees have expressed a desire to rejoin the fight, be it against U.N. peacekeepers in Afghanistan, Americans in Iraq or Russians in Chechnya.

Due process... :rolleyes:

You are standing on a technicality.  They were taken to Gitmo expressly so we could avoid US law and do whatever we want with them.  The only reason it\'s legal is because King George said so.  I guess our standards of justice only apply to us, and the other unclean hoards of foreigners don\'t deserve the same consideration?  Our laws are meant to protect both the accused from injustice, and the accuser from an abuse of power.  According to you, neither of these is worth bothering about.

Here are a couple portions of the story you didn\'t bother to cut and paste:

Maj. Gen. Eric Olson, the No. 2 commander of U.S. troops in Afghanistan, told The Associated Press this month there was no alternative to releasing prisoners from Guantanamo.

"It\'s not going to be perfect, so it (the Ghaffar case) has not led to any soul-searching about the release program," Olson said.

Before you go citing stories from the right wing-slanted Washington Times, you might want to be aware that they edit their wire service stories to make them more appealing to the ideological message they\'re trying to convey.  If you compare the text on their website to the full AP story published by CBS News, you will find many individual words omitted to soften the impact of certain statements.  They also simply cut the following paragraphs:

From http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/09/24/terror/main645493.shtml

Those in the small group that has gone back to fighting come mainly from the upper echelons of suspected militant or terror groups, some allegedly linked to al Qaeda, several counterterrorism officials in the Middle East said. They gave no details, but one noted a trend that lower-echelon members tend to get on with their lives after they are released.

…

After being questioned by Danish intelligence agents, he said he would stay in Denmark, hand over his passport and honor his pledge. Danish intelligence officials are keeping tabs on Abderrahmane.

In Sweden, Mehdi-Muhammed Ghezali, who was released in July after more than two years at the base, is being monitored by Swedish intelligence agents. While Sweden\'s security police, SAPO, has no official comment, its agents have said Ghezali is not a threat.

Other former Guantanamo prisoners, including Yaser Esam Hamdi of Saudi Arabia, had their releases held up amid fears they would rejoin their comrades.

Hamdi, who was born in Louisiana, spent three years in solitary confinement, first at Guantanamo and then at a Navy brig in South Carolina after he was captured in Afghanistan in 2001. He was returned to Saudi Arabia on Oct. 11 after agreeing to forfeit his U.S. citizenship.

He also is required to stay in Saudi Arabia for five years, renounce terror and cannot travel to Afghanistan, Iraq, Israel, Pakistan or Syria. Additionally, Hamdi must notify Saudi officials if he becomes aware of "any planned or executed acts of terrorism."

It is likely that Hamdi will be monitored by government officials there, as much as Ghezali and Abderrahmane have been in northern Europe.

New article conscerning it

So they actually didn\'t flush it in the first place.  Though some other mishandlings occured.  So when is a news source going to actually gather facts and put together a story that stays intact.

God, who gives a shit? Next thing they will be asking for cable television and daytime spas. I honestly am not bothered by our troops \'mishandling\' the Koran.

That is because you are not muslim.

[SirMystiq]

Originally posted by Black Samurai
That is because you are not muslim.

Exactly.


Geez. I\'ve been gone for some a bit an I missed Giga\'s rant on the entire liberal world and how they are attacking our God chosen president!?

Giga, you are hungry for anti-Bush stories. It\'s quite sad actually, you would probably blame liberals if your testicles one day fell off.

I don\'t know about you all, but these deaths over the Newsweek article are NOT a direct result from it. Please, you have GOT TO BE KIDDING if you are blind to the fact that EVERYBODY ACROSS THE GLOBE hates America and Americans(like Giga) right now. The Newsweek story just topped off the garbage and soon somebody is going to have to take it out. And let\'s guess who shall we Giga?

THE US OF A!!

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=819635


Giga you are a moron. You know damn well that the Koran was probably tried to be flushed down a damn toilet. We all know damn well that we don\'t exactly know what the hell is going on in there and if our soldiers had the balls to make prisoners pile up nude and then take pictures then desecrating the Koran is a "minor" incident. It\'s scary though that Bush and his Goons are trying to completely deteriorate the media that does not agree with them.

Of course, people like you Giga would rather slit your throat than to disagree with whatever BS this BS Administration is feeding you. You say that I hate this country. Nah. I hate Americans? Just the ones like you Giga. Do I blindly hate the president? Nah, I don\'t hate the man, just his ways.

Newsweek is not to blame for the deaths. It\'s our government policies in general. And since when do we care when non-Americans die? You are worried about 15 deaths when soldiers die, EACH DAY, from people in Iraq that hate us even if the media published articles about how we want Bush to become a dictator.

Please Giga, you are an old fool. I don\'t know if you have or are going through menopause but just cool down will you?

And I\'m with Cored on the Gitmo issue.

That might be ANOTHER reason why people are dying don\'t you think Giga, unless you find some other "liberal" media that causes death and should take all blame.

PS:

Asshats? WTF?

Originally posted by SirMystiq


Geez. I\'ve been gone for some a bit an I missed Giga\'s rant on the entire liberal world and how they are attacking our God chosen president!?

What a great post filled with idiotic statements, once again showing you have no clue about what really goes on in the world.  Since you laced your post with insults, you won\'t mind if I return the favor will you?  This isn\'t about the President it is about bad and unresponsible reporting.  Stay on topic... oh thats right you can\'t - your post is idiotic rant about me and how much the world hates us!  In case you hadn\'t noticed the story had been retracted - meaning they couldn\'t prove it, yet you know better then they do right Misstiq?  

Originally posted by SirMystiq
Giga, you are hungry for anti-Bush stories. It\'s quite sad actually, you would probably blame liberals if your testicles one day fell off.

Once again you can\'t stay on topic.

Originally posted by SirMystiq
I don\'t know about you all, but these deaths over the Newsweek article are NOT a direct result from it. Please, you have GOT TO BE KIDDING if you are blind to the fact that EVERYBODY ACROSS THE GLOBE hates America and Americans(like Giga) right now. The Newsweek story just topped off the garbage and soon somebody is going to have to take it out. And let\'s guess who shall we Giga?

This has to be one of the dumbest posts I have ever read and this quote is its crowning achievement.  Not only do make dumbass generalizations, but it also proves your tin foil hat is on too tight.  The Newsweek article didn\'t cause the riots that resulted in people\'s deaths?

http://www.indiadaily.com/editorial/2713.asp
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/asiapcf/05/16/newsweek.quran/
http://news.yahoo.com/s/usatoday/20050519/cm_usatoday/koranblundertranscendsmediavswhitehouse
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/05/20/AR2005052001856.html

I could list more.  No that story didn\'t give them a reason to riot did it?  "EVERYBODY ACROSS THE GLOBE hates America and Americans (like Giga)" <------ that quote proves you spawned at the shallow end of the gene pool.

Originally posted by SirMystiq
Giga you are a moron. You know damn well that the Koran was probably tried to be flushed down a damn toilet. We all know damn well that we don\'t exactly know what the hell is going on in there and if our soldiers had the balls to make prisoners pile up nude and then take pictures then desecrating the Koran is a "minor" incident. It\'s scary though that Bush and his Goons are trying to completely deteriorate the media that does not agree with them.

I didn\'t give a flying fuck if it was flushed down the toilet - personally I wish they would wipe their asses with it and make the inmates eat it - then when they shit it out make you eat it.  I don\'t care.  You really need to take this post and go over to DU because you would fit right in with those asshats and their fucked up view of America.  Bush and his Goons?  This has nothing to do with Bush.  You can\'t seperate anything in here from Bush can you?    

Originally posted by SirMystiq
Of course, people like you Giga would rather slit your throat than to disagree with whatever BS this BS Administration is feeding you. You say that I hate this country. Nah. I hate Americans? Just the ones like you Giga. Do I blindly hate the president? Nah, I don\'t hate the man, just his ways.

Blah blah blah... do you ever get tired of hearing yourself talk?  I don\'t even consider you American and never will.  You don\'t blindly hate the President?  "BS Administration" "Bush and his Goons" "Everybody hates America" - that is just this post alone.  Stop contradicting yourself and trying to cover it up.  You are a known liar on this board.  Take some lessons from Core instead of spouting your nonsense and intermixed with your hatred for me.  I could get really personal here regarding what I think of you and your views, but I digress...

Originally posted by SirMystiq
Newsweek is not to blame for the deaths. It\'s our government policies in general. And since when do we care when non-Americans die? You are worried about 15 deaths when soldiers die, EACH DAY, from people in Iraq that hate us even if the media published articles about how we want Bush to become a dictator.

Newsweek not at fault.  You already said this and again you are wrong.

Originally posted by SirMystiq
Please Giga, you are an old fool. I don\'t know if you have or are going through menopause but just cool down will you?

So lets recap...  

I would blame liberals if one of my nuts fell off.
The entire world hates me and America.
This administration is BS.
Bush has Goons that are trying to "frame" the media.
According to you I am a moron and an old fool...

Well Misstiq - you have topped some of your previous dumbass remarks with this jumbled and rambling post - I hope you are proud.  Instead of blaming the story, which did not have sources and WAS RETRACTED - you blame Bush.  How typical.  :rolleyes:

 

Originally posted by SirMystiq


PS:

Asshats? WTF?

Asshat - ie. you.

Originally posted by Black Samurai
That is because you are not muslim.

Not exactly. If the shoe was on the other foot, I wouldn\'t be shooting up a shit storm just because some Muslims pissed, shit, and vomited on the Bible. I understand that they\'re stupid pricks, and that would be that. You wouldn\'t see a riot over it.

shit > ryan seacrest > radical muslims

Originally posted by GigaShadow
I didn\'t give a flying fuck if it was flushed down the toilet - personally I wish they would wipe their asses with it and make the inmates eat it - then when they shit it out make you eat it.  

!