PS3 specs, facts, speculations and rumours !

[BizioEE]

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25109&page=2

RSX GPU:
I think the PS3 will either contain a dual core RSX GPU die design, or have dual RSX GPUs.

Think about this:
A simple speed increase (550MHz RSX) will not outperform a dual 430MHz 7800 GTX setup. A dual 7800 GTX setup is able to utilize all the pipelines (24 + 24 = 48 total pipelines) for better performance than a single 550MHz RSX GPU. Simply put a dual 7800 GTX graphic setup has the potential to output more data. Please don’t factor in PC bottlenecks that stop dual 7800 GTX cards from outperforming the PS3 as a whole. Imagine the PC or PS3 Alpha Kit without the current bottlenecks and having dual 7800 cards. This rant of mine deals with future games needing more GPU power rather than system throughput. Hell, Nvidia or ATI can release a GPU in late 2006 or Mid 2007 with enough GPU throughput power to overcome the PC bottlenecks.

Remember E3:
It’s well known that the PS3 demos (Unreal 3.0 Engine, ECT…) were running off PS3 Alpha Kits, that didn’t contain the RSX GPU, but rather dual NVIDIA graphic boards. Many thought it was dual 6800’s graphic cards, however that wasn’t the case. Actually the overall consensus is that they were (unannounced at that time) Dual 7800 GTX graphic cards. Why dual 7800s rather than dual 6800s graphic cards? Because the PS3 demos shown, more specifically the Unreal Engine 3.0 Demo will not/could not run that smooth on dual 6800 based cards. Remember Mark Rein stated and showed the Unreal 3.0 Engine on a dual 6800 rig running at 15-20fps (the first time Unreal 3 Engine was ever shown last year). Even at E3 Mark hinted or let slip out on the Alpha Kits containing newer cards. My point is being …dual 6800s would not have ran those demos very smoothly at those hi-setting. Leading one to believe that the 7800’s GTX where involved.

Old Article Proof:

Quote:
When Sony unveiled the PlayStation 3 at their pre-Electronic Entertainment Expo press conference, the company appeared confident in its hardware, but like rumors surrounding the supposedly real-time technology demonstrations, it appears the hardware isn\'t completely set in stone yet, either.

At a J.P. Morgan technology conference, NVIDIA\'s CFO Marv Burkett said the PlayStation 3\'s RSX (the hardware\'s GPU) isn\'t finished, still remains in development, and no silicon of the chip is available yet, reports Bit-Tech. Incomplete hardware comes as no surprise, but it does raise questions about what was powering the demonstrations on-hand at Sony\'s press conference.

Burkett says the RSX demonstrations weren\'t actually running on the RSX, but an upcoming NVIDIA high-end desktop product in SLI mode. NVIDIA was not more specific about what type of hardware this entailed.




So what I’m getting at:
For the RSX to be able to handle games like Killzone 3, Unreal Engine 3 based games, and so fourth. The PS3 must have a dual RSX GPU setup or a RSX GPU design containing multiple graphic chips. Because a simple overclock G70 (RSX) can’t handle that amount data without graphic frame-rate issues. 48 pipelines (Dual 7800 GTX) beat’s a simple 120MHz overclock (RSX) in data processing.

Last Word:
I simply don’t believe the RSX GPU is just an overclock G70 based processor. Even if the PS3 doesn’t come with a dual-core RSX anything, the RSX in my opinion must contain at least 40 or more pipelines to handle the data Sony is claiming. Yes the Cell will play a big part in helping out, but that doesn’t rectify possible future game issues. In the-end the RSX GPU must be equal or better than two 7800 GTX cards rather than dual 6800\'s...IMO!

And you must remember Sony also stated that "ALL SPECIFICATION CAN CHANGE WITHOUT NOTICE”.

Seven, Fastson and anyone what do you think ?

I think the RSX will be much more than an overclock G70 based processor !

[Evi]

I\'m tired of opinions...I\'d like to see non-bullsh^t final specs.

Nintendo just sent out a press release saying it plans to never reveal Revolution specs.

How\'s that for an F. U. to pre-launch hype?

-Dan

[Titan]

I wonder what Nintendo has up their sleeves with the Revolution. I\'m sure the specs will get released after launch. Makes me wonder what they\'ve got planned.

Originally posted by EviscerationX
I\'m tired of opinions...I\'d like to see non-bullsh^t final specs.

+1

Nintendo\'s strategy seems cool, but deep down inside I know they\'re doing that because their specs can\'t compete wiith the other 2.  I still plan on getting a Revo though :thumb:

[Evi]

I still plan on getting a Revo though

Me too. That controller weirds me out though.

Hmm I don’t know what to think. Very interesting post.

I guess he has a few good points. This could explain why Sony is so quiet about the RSX.

But it sounds too expensive!

I think Sony will settle for a upgraded G70, higher MHz, plus some other features the G70 lacks. IIRC the G70 has a Video Decoder of some sort that would be useless inside a PS3 (because Video Decoding is handled by the CELL processor), so this Video Decoder has probably been replaced by something else.

On top of G70 they have a kick arse processor (CELL) which can function as a GPU of its own it seems (just have a look at that Getaway tech demo, according to Sony Chief Technology Officer Masayuki Chatani the Getaway demo was run mostly on the CELL).

CELL + RSX is one helluva system. I don’t think the 360 can compete with that.

I also think the 360 will be seriously crippled by the limited storage capacity. I read that one full core of the CPU will be wasted in some games just to decompress compressed data, seems like a badly designed system to me.

I also think the 360 will be seriously crippled by the limited storage capacity. I read that one full core of the CPU will be wasted in some games just to decompress compressed data, seems like a badly designed system to me.

You are basing this off of some thing you read, which already seems higlhy impractical. If you want real info on both PS3 and Xbox360 without any of the fluff/hype and real insight in the workings of both consoles, this is the most highly respected forum for that type of discussion on the net. Also if you into pc Graphic cards again this is the #1 place of discussion for it.

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/index.php

[Living-In-Clip]

Nintendo\'s move is both smart and dumb.

1: It\'s smart, because it will make people focus on the games and not the specs. It is also a smart move because it takes them further out of the race bewteen Sony and MS. Distancing themselves as much as possible can be a good thing.

2: The dumb part of it is a lot of people will assume that Nintendo is doin\' this because they can\'t compete at all.

Originally posted by NVIDIA256
You are basing this off of some thing you read, which already seems higlhy impractical. If you want real info on both PS3 and Xbox360 without any of the fluff/hype and real insight in the workings of both consoles, this is the most highly respected forum for that type of discussion on the net. Also if you into pc Graphic cards again this is the #1 place of discussion for it.

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/index.php

B3D has its shares of fanboys too. In recent months B3D was invaded by trolls from a site called Opa-Age (?), I hope they have it under control now because from what I understand people have been leaving the place. At least the console forums.
I have lurked B3D for years and it was a great place for information.

About one core being used for uncompressing compressed data:
From Gameinformer\'s interview with J Allard

"On the CPU architecture, we\'ve built a really high bandwidth access to memory (and decompression technology on the hardware). And a very general, all purpose computer architecture that basically allows you to write your own decompressors to decompress however you want. This is one of the reasons we went to the multi-core architecture and said, "Hey, if you\'re id or you\'re Tiburon or you\'re Rockstar, you can go to build a streaming decompression system that works for your environment, and we\'ll give you the bandwidth to do it". (Its) a very similar design to the original Xbox or to PC, where its very easy to program to and you use one of those cores and have your Rockstar I/O developer create this streaming system that\'s totally customized to your needs, because we\'ve got the bandwidth and memory, and you\'ve got the CPU horsepower. We\'ve architectured it in a way were you can go pick up one of those CPUs to do unbelievable decompression, and there\'s another CPU over there that doesn\'t affect the game loop."

To me that sounds like a waste of power. If they had gone with a larger storage capacity they could use that extra power for something else. This is a problem PS3 wont have to deal with.

Next gen games will need more space, the Epic guy (sorry, I’m suffering from temporary memory loss at the moment.) mentioned Next Gen games needing ~20GB of space. Another 360 developer making an RPG game said their currently up to 2 DVDs and might need a 3rd when the game is done. That’s maybe not a big problem for  a RPG game, but what about a free roaming style game?

And I thought this was quite interesting (Greggman= Former Sega and Naughty Dog employee)
http://greggman.com/edit/editheadlines/2005-08-17.htm

If I may speculate, I think we will see some games for PS3 that wont work as well on the 360. I think the GameCube might have missed out on a few games thanks to the small storage capacity (would San Andreas have worked on the GC? Switching discs every time you enter a new island? How fun would a "cross country" mission be then?).

Time will tell what happens.

EDIT: Mark REIN is his name. Here is the interview with him talking about storage.

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/r/?http://www.computerandvideogames.com/news/news_story.php(que)id=125925

Unreal Tournament was 6GB compressed. Next Generation games are going to be 20GB plus, and how we\'re going to fit them on DVD9\'s I don\'t know, they\'ll probably be a few of them. On the PS3, we\'re going to be using the majority of the space on those Blu-ray disks.

The 7800 GTX 512mb 550/1800 mhz card is likely to be beaten by PS3\'s RSX.

This card will be made on 110nm silicon slab, while RSX will be made on 90nm.

[GmanJoe]

The answer is.....42!

[Jumpman]

remember when the big thing was how many polygons a system could do? yea...

[videoholic]

Back when it was easier to figure out who was the best.

[Evi]

Back when numbers weren\'t so damn big...