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Author Topic: My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....  (Read 2855 times)

Offline tHe GaMe
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FROM THE IGN BOARDS @ PS2


Alright, enough of Bill\'s crap, check out our hardware comparison PS2 VS Xbox

Okay, I think all of us have heard enough of the crap Mr Bill has to say, now let\'s compare the PS2 and the Xbox ourselves.
First of all let\'s take a look at the Xbox. Don\'t you realize the system was made thinking on how it could look better than the PS2 rather than on making a good system???, oh well it certainly seems like it, take a look:

-Main processor:
Xbox 750 mhz , PS2 292 mhz
-Main Memory: Xbox 64 MB of RAM , PS2 32 MB of DRAM
-Memory bandwidth: Xbox 6.4 GB , PS2 3.2 GB
-Graphics Chip: Xbox 300 mhz , PS2 150 mhz

see what I mean... but now let\'s look beyond those specs, what microsoft doesn\'t want you to realize:

Main processor:
The P III in the Xbox is a 32-bit processor while the PS2\'s "Emotion Engine" is a 128-bit one, it\'s that simple.
Now let me explain the bit-mhz relationship.
The bits determine the number of characters the chip can handle simultaneously, one character equals 8 bits. So if we have a 32-bit chip for example we would divide this number by 8 to get the number of characters, and that would be...4 and for a 128-bit processor it would be 16.
Each of these characters is processed at the number of mhz the chip runs.
If we want to compare the "Emotion Engine" with the P III in the Xbox we have to find the total number of mhz in both by multiplying the mhz, by the number of characters which we already found out.
Too hard to understand? let me make it simpler...
For the Xbox: 750x4= 3000 mhz
and the PS2: 294.912x16= 4718.592 mhz
Alright, so the "Emotion Engine" beats the P III in mhz, which still doesn\'t take us anywhere because mhz is NOT actual performance.
Gigaflops are performance. These affect the AI and loading times of a game.
Gigaflops:
For the "Emotion Engine": 6.5 Gflops
for the P III: 1.6 Gflops
Now this IS performance and the PS2 beats the Xbox
But we still have to find out the performance affecting the graphics and the framerate.
To measure this type of performance POVbench marks are used. A POVmark is a value obtained by a chipset, representing the time it takes rendering a standard image. The lower the time it takes, the higher the POVmark, and the higher the POVmark the better.
The P III of the Xbox took 00:00:35 seconds to render the image used, obtaining a POVmark of 422.86
The "Emotion Engine" did it in just 00:00:05 seconds to get one hell of a POVmark...2960
Alright so its clear, the PS2 GPU beats the one in the Xbox. The P III processor may be good in other tasks that do not involve graphics, so the use of a processor like this in a console wastes it\'s power. The lesson companies like microsoft have to learn: Do not try to make a computer processor (CISC), beat a RISC one like the PS2\'s in handling graphics because that is what RISC processors are made for.
-Coprocessors:
The PS2 has 3 coprocessors, 2 vector units and 1 floating point unit. The PSX and PS2 developer Naughty Dog claims that not using the Vu\'s it\'s like using only a little more than half of the PS2\'s power. The Xbox on the other hand has no coprocessors.
These are the PS2 coprocessor specs:

-Main Memory:
The main memory in the Playstation 2 is 32 MB of DRAM. It means Dynamic RAM, it\'s structure allows it to send and recieve data simultaneusly making it twice as fast...as fast as 64 MB or RAM, however storage is always 32 MB. This memory is used only by the "Emotion Engine", because the "Graphics Synthesiser" (the PS2\'s graphics chip) uses it\'s own 4 MB of VRAM.
In the Xbox the, graphics chip and GPU share 64 MB of RAM, this structure lets developers choose how much memory each one will use, while in the PS2 it is already determined. Now here comes the bad part for the Xbox: Sharing RAM means that the graphics chip and GPU also have to share it\'s 6.4 GB of bandwidth which is extreeeeeeeeeeemely slow for the Xbox graphics chip when compared to the 48 GB of bandwidth the "Graphics Synthesiser" in the PS2 uses and DOES NOT SHARE . The "Emotion Engine" uses it\'s own 3.2 GB of bandwidth.
The slow main memory bandwidth in the Xbox slows down significantly the best thing inside it: it\'s NVidia graphics chip

Conclusion: Look beyond the numbers when comparing hardware. Now you see why sony spent almost 5 years creating the PS2, they made their own GPU, graphics chip and other parts so that the PS2 performed well handling graphics and if you don\'t bother to do that... you know what kind of crappy console you\'ll end up creating.
Proud Owner of the Playstation 2, futrue Owner of Nintendo\'s Gamecube.

Sony vs. Nintendo Round 2

Microosft were do you wanna crash today?

Offline EThugg
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #1 on: May 23, 2001, 02:08:16 PM »
I never go by specs... I go by \'the buzz\'. The mags, sites, and most developers have said XB is more powerful, I trust them for now...
\'The venom of my hate, and the blood of my enemies will flow freely.\'

Offline tHe GaMe
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #2 on: May 23, 2001, 02:26:22 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by EThugg
I never go by specs... I go by \'the buzz\'. The mags, sites, and most developers have said XB is more powerful, I trust them for now...


That\'s your problem not mines.
Proud Owner of the Playstation 2, futrue Owner of Nintendo\'s Gamecube.

Sony vs. Nintendo Round 2

Microosft were do you wanna crash today?

Offline TheOgodlyThing
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #3 on: May 23, 2001, 02:32:06 PM »
GO GAME GO..........the little engine that could

Offline Animal Mother
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #4 on: May 23, 2001, 02:40:02 PM »
I don\'t care about specs. I\'ll just enjoy all Next gen consoles regardless of specs. Ogodly, your Xbox should be taken from you and smashed (or stolen by me so I can play it!)
\"You know back before the war broke out I was a saucier in San Antone. I bet I could collar up some of them greens, yeah, some crawfish out the paddy, yo\'! Ha! I\'m makin\' some crabapples for dessert now, Ya hear! Hell yeah, ha!

Offline TheOgodlyThing
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2001, 02:45:36 PM »
Quote
your Xbox should be taken from you and smashed (or stolen by me so I can play it!)






I\'ll take that as a compliment

Offline ho3j
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2001, 04:07:17 PM »
I cannot believe people are still making posts like that. (just for the record; the GPU is the center of the Xbox, not the CPU as is the case with the PS2 but you\'ll notice he skips over the whole GPU part, Xbox uses 200mhzDDR, he puts too much wieght on bits)  I would think that by now everyone would have accepted that the Xbox is a very powerfull graphics machine and moved on to what the games are going to be.

Edit:  No offence The Game, I was talking about the guy who actually took the time to type this out.

Offline nO-One

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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2001, 04:13:49 PM »
Everybody knows that both the PS.2 and X-Box are very powerful machines.And they are also very different,it\'s just silly to compare the two because they operate so differently.
I recently discovered that my ass is the key to the universe.....now I must fight to protect my ass from those who might abuse it!!!

Offline Bozco
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #8 on: May 23, 2001, 06:31:33 PM »
I\'ll get whatever has the best games

Offline Sublimesjg
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #9 on: May 23, 2001, 06:37:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by nO-One
Everybody knows that both the PS.2 and X-Box are very powerful machines.And they are also very different,it\'s just silly to compare the two because they operate so differently.


exactly thats like comapring games of two different genres - things won\'t add up right that way

but games will look good on both systems so do we really have to fight over which will look better - just enjoy the good graphics
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Offline EmperorRob
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #10 on: May 23, 2001, 07:55:04 PM »
I\'m not sure I believe what they said about DRAM.  I think they confusing it with DDR RAM, which transmits data on the rising and falling of the current, doubling the frequency.
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Offline EThugg
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #11 on: May 23, 2001, 10:01:30 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by tHe GaMe


That\'s your problem not mines.


You have a problem? I didn\'t until now, *****.
\'The venom of my hate, and the blood of my enemies will flow freely.\'

Offline Docwiz
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2001, 11:25:11 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by tHe GaMe
FROM THE IGN BOARDS @ PS2


Alright, enough of Bill\'s crap, check out our hardware comparison PS2 VS Xbox

Okay, I think all of us have heard enough of the crap Mr Bill has to say, now let\'s compare the PS2 and the Xbox ourselves.
First of all let\'s take a look at the Xbox. Don\'t you realize the system was made thinking on how it could look better than the PS2 rather than on making a good system???, oh well it certainly seems like it, take a look:

-Main processor:
Xbox 750 mhz , PS2 292 mhz
-Main Memory: Xbox 64 MB of RAM , PS2 32 MB of DRAM
-Memory bandwidth: Xbox 6.4 GB , PS2 3.2 GB
-Graphics Chip: Xbox 300 mhz , PS2 150 mhz

see what I mean... but now let\'s look beyond those specs, what microsoft doesn\'t want you to realize:

Main processor:
The P III in the Xbox is a 32-bit processor while the PS2\'s "Emotion Engine" is a 128-bit one, it\'s that simple.
Now let me explain the bit-mhz relationship.
The bits determine the number of characters the chip can handle simultaneously, one character equals 8 bits. So if we have a 32-bit chip for example we would divide this number by 8 to get the number of characters, and that would be...4 and for a 128-bit processor it would be 16.
Each of these characters is processed at the number of mhz the chip runs.
If we want to compare the "Emotion Engine" with the P III in the Xbox we have to find the total number of mhz in both by multiplying the mhz, by the number of characters which we already found out.
Too hard to understand? let me make it simpler...
For the Xbox: 750x4= 3000 mhz
and the PS2: 294.912x16= 4718.592 mhz
Alright, so the "Emotion Engine" beats the P III in mhz, which still doesn\'t take us anywhere because mhz is NOT actual performance.
Gigaflops are performance. These affect the AI and loading times of a game.
Gigaflops:
For the "Emotion Engine": 6.5 Gflops
for the P III: 1.6 Gflops
Now this IS performance and the PS2 beats the Xbox
But we still have to find out the performance affecting the graphics and the framerate.
To measure this type of performance POVbench marks are used. A POVmark is a value obtained by a chipset, representing the time it takes rendering a standard image. The lower the time it takes, the higher the POVmark, and the higher the POVmark the better.
The P III of the Xbox took 00:00:35 seconds to render the image used, obtaining a POVmark of 422.86
The "Emotion Engine" did it in just 00:00:05 seconds to get one hell of a POVmark...2960
Alright so its clear, the PS2 GPU beats the one in the Xbox. The P III processor may be good in other tasks that do not involve graphics, so the use of a processor like this in a console wastes it\'s power. The lesson companies like microsoft have to learn: Do not try to make a computer processor (CISC), beat a RISC one like the PS2\'s in handling graphics because that is what RISC processors are made for.
-Coprocessors:
The PS2 has 3 coprocessors, 2 vector units and 1 floating point unit. The PSX and PS2 developer Naughty Dog claims that not using the Vu\'s it\'s like using only a little more than half of the PS2\'s power. The Xbox on the other hand has no coprocessors.
These are the PS2 coprocessor specs:

-Main Memory:
The main memory in the Playstation 2 is 32 MB of DRAM. It means Dynamic RAM, it\'s structure allows it to send and recieve data simultaneusly making it twice as fast...as fast as 64 MB or RAM, however storage is always 32 MB. This memory is used only by the "Emotion Engine", because the "Graphics Synthesiser" (the PS2\'s graphics chip) uses it\'s own 4 MB of VRAM.
In the Xbox the, graphics chip and GPU share 64 MB of RAM, this structure lets developers choose how much memory each one will use, while in the PS2 it is already determined. Now here comes the bad part for the Xbox: Sharing RAM means that the graphics chip and GPU also have to share it\'s 6.4 GB of bandwidth which is extreeeeeeeeeeemely slow for the Xbox graphics chip when compared to the 48 GB of bandwidth the "Graphics Synthesiser" in the PS2 uses and DOES NOT SHARE . The "Emotion Engine" uses it\'s own 3.2 GB of bandwidth.
The slow main memory bandwidth in the Xbox slows down significantly the best thing inside it: it\'s NVidia graphics chip

Conclusion: Look beyond the numbers when comparing hardware. Now you see why sony spent almost 5 years creating the PS2, they made their own GPU, graphics chip and other parts so that the PS2 performed well handling graphics and if you don\'t bother to do that... you know what kind of crappy console you\'ll end up creating.


I didn\'t mean to skip over your post, since 99.9 percent of it is fanboy raving, but there are many things that you are missing.  Like being up to date with the 21st century.

128 bits according to graphics like the wording being used in console mean nothing today.  

In the past 8-bit or 16-bit was used, but its meaningless today.  Kind of like using Baud to describe the speed of the modem. :)

Since the Emotion Engine is such a technology leader,then why does the PC parts driven xbox kill it in every performance  point possible.

Don\'t take my word for it.  Ask Tecmo programmers. :)  

oh I guess you didn\'t read that....

Your bad :)

http://msxbox.mygamewear.com/showthread.php?threadid=14912&pagenumber=1

Life sure does suck for you, doesn\'t it?

muhahahahahaha dumbasses.  Don\'t feed the dumbasses kids...
Shweeet!

Offline TheOgodlyThing
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2001, 11:38:27 PM »
I tell ya DOCWIZ you always make my day. Good to see your still around friend!!!!

Offline Sublimesjg
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My GOD, the truth finally comes out about Billy\'s X-BOX....
« Reply #14 on: May 24, 2001, 12:38:44 AM »
yea i liked some of that article as well

Quote

it was easy for us to develop on the PS2.


and also

Quote

I\'m thinking about showing it at TGS Fall, but since I don\'t know what platform I will be releasing this game on, it remains to be seen if it\'ll be shown at TGS Fall 2001. Of course, I\'m developing on one current system for now [Xbox] but that\'s not final.


wells there is another developer that states all systems in this generation are easy to deveop for and also that DOA3 isn\'t exclusive for sure
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