How many Heavens are there?

well, yeah, in seminary first year we did New Testament. So we did alot with the Joseph Smith Translation. I thought you meant that JS went over and changed the whole Bible to mean what was originally meant to be said.

I know that there are people that sin in every religion, even ours, but you just don\'t see it nearly as much in our faith. People stay faithful and worthy of the temple because they truly know of the truth of the gospel, whereas in other churches, they are not guided by the priesthood.

just my take on it.

LDS members live on average 6 years longer than the rest of Americans. something to think about

Eric Jacob

I find this thread very interesting.

I don\'t believe Bible is perfect. I know that fights against my religion, but even as a pitiful weak human being, it is my nature wich wants to make own alterations to the Text, just to feel more comfortable, and to suit my personal feelings towards religion.

Remember that Bible went trough a lot in the middle-ages, when catholic Church literally commanded everything. They tried to gather as many listeners around them, as the more listeners, the greater power they held. I believe they invented the strict hell, the eternal fire and brimstone, to frighten people, to get them to their side. And everything isn\'t so black and white anyway. Bible is full of imaginary telling, and many parts of the Bible are just way too complicated and thoughtful to be invented by human, \'thus I believe in the main message of Bible. Not every detail, but the main message, that Christ has died for us, and that we are saved if we believe in God and Jesus Christ, and that we\'ll resurrect after death.

Ironfist, humans have troughout our time believed end of the world is only few years away - first true, massive belief was when the first millenium changed, on year 999. People believed the world was going to end. Now many believed it was going to end on the year 1999, before year 2000. Still, Bible doesn\'t say when the end comes - only God knows it - and for us it is worthless to predict it\'ll come within next 20 years. But, there are signs in the air - I truly believe that we\'re living the beginning of the end. I just don\'t take it as canon.

For me, it would be too cruel to separate human beings after death, without a chance to regret, to two groups, those who go to heaven and those who go to hell. Cruel.

I think some of you would find the rapture ready -message boards quite interesting - they offer a different point of view, but from same basis. I have visited it few times, and I recommend you to, even once.
Here\'s the address.
http://pub16.ezboard.com/braptureready

Darth, I understand that no one knows when the second coming will happen save God himself.  But from all of the things I have studied, and all of the things I have heard, my personal belief is it will happen within 20 years.  I am not one of those people who say they know the exact date it will happen.  Quick question:  What did all of those people who thought it was going to happen in the year 2000 do after it didn\'t happen?  It would have been fun to see their faces.

And about that website, no thanks.  Everyone there seems very confused about the whole religion thing.

Well, the stuff in here is probably too advanced for me because I have only been interested in religion for the past year when my parents moved me to a Christian school for being bad in public.

I just wanted to say that I find these threads interesting and stuff. Not to be offensive or anything, but, I remember my Bible teacher saying something like the Mormons kinda sorta twist the Bible for their own benefit or something. Also, I have two Mormon missionary neighbors and they drop by here once in a while and they said something about a living prohphet at their church.. I don\'t really want to ask them about this, because well... I just don\'t want to. .. Any response?

All in all, I just wanted to say that going to a Christian school has really changed my life and I no longer resort to doing "bad" things. It is really cool, the stuff that you can learn.. Yeah, that\'s all. Have a nice day.

That\'s a price we have to pay for being Mormons.  We are hated by a lot of people.  Some people even think that us Mormons have horns.  And yes, we do have a living prophet.  His name is Gordon B. Hinkley.  He is one of the coolest people alive.  I think he is like 90 or 91, and he still travels around the world meeting members and dedicating temples.  He is a very funny person, and is the kind of person who you just want to hang around.  Don\'t listen to what others have said about us.  Find out for yourself.  Go tell the missionaries that you want to hear the discussions.  It is probably the easiest and most rewarding way to learn the truth about the LDS religion.

Well, it was kinda weird.. A living prophet..

Maybe I will.. Someday..

serrano, you might as well do it during the summer when you are out of school, and sooner or later, cause I figure you only got another 30 some odd years.

When Christ set up His church in His day, and after He died, he had the 12 apostles. He also set up one to be the head over the church and get direct revelation from God. Peter is an example of a prophet in those days.

Our church is the restored church that Christ set up. So our organization is the same. We have a prophet and president, Gordon B. Hinckley. We have the 12 apostles and we have the quorum of the 70. These men lead the church affairs, but only Gordon B. Hinckley can truly receive direct revelation, as Peter would have, about matters of the church.


Eric Jacob

I see no one has yet commented on about the fact that Jesus said that there was a heaven and a hell, and no one belives him.

Look at something else.

Jesus says that there is a heaven and a hell.

But then you find this one verse and you can twist it into a different way. When I read the KJV, I thought that the celesstial bodies were angels. Then I looked on the next page (The 4 versions are in one Bible) And the LV, says that they ARE angels. The point that your saying is not true. Jesus says against it and it never says those bodies are kindoms, it is talking about angel\'s and human bodies. Can you guys clearly say why Jesus would lie to you in the bible? Someone answer that.

Originally posted by JediMaster
I see no one has yet commented on about the fact that Jesus said that there was a heaven and a hell, and no one belives him.

Look at something else.

Jesus says that there is a heaven and a hell.

But then you find this one verse and you can twist it into a different way. When I read the KJV, I thought that the celesstial bodies were angels. Then I looked on the next page (The 4 versions are in one Bible) And the LV, says that they ARE angels. The point that your saying is not true. Jesus says against it and it never says those bodies are kindoms, it is talking about angel\'s and human bodies. Can you guys clearly say why Jesus would lie to you in the bible? Someone answer that.

You just won\'t let this rest will you?  Obviously, nothing we say will make you change your mind, and nothing you say will make us change our mind.  Religions are not supposed to fight against each other.  The Bible was not meant to be used for Bible Bashing.  We don\'t need to prove anything to you.  We know what is real and what is not real.  There is no point wasting our time arguing with you.

jedimaster, that is the reason we don\'t use th LB, it can say something totally different then what it is supposed to be said.

BTW, we never said there was no Heaven or Hell, just that the words can be used loosely. Heaven can mean Celestial kingdom and hell would be anything lower to the unfortunate people who couldnt reach the higher kingdoms. Hell may be totally in your mind.


Eric Jacob

Hey, just found this topic.  Very cool indeed!  I myself am part of the LDS church preparing to go on a mission soon as well.  Maybe I\'ll jump in this soon.

And as for the heaven and hell thing...It\'s pretty much what AlteredBeast said above.

There still is a heaven and a hell, it is just all how you interpret what it means exactly.  So therefore, JediMaster, Christ did not lie (obviously- he\'s perfect), and how you said in the LV that it says that the Celestial bodies are Angels, it is just an example of Man\'s mis-translation of the Bible.  If you can read Hebrew go ahead and check out the Bible that is in Hebrew or even in Greek, which most Bibles were translated from originally, and you\'ll see that it has no references to Angels at all in that passage.  Just some translators own interpretation of what they think it should of meant is my guess.