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Author Topic: The MOST UNBELIEVABLE IN-GAME GRAPHICS EVER. CG- QUALITY!!! On GC!!!!!!!!!  (Read 2965 times)

Offline Watchdog
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The MOST UNBELIEVABLE IN-GAME GRAPHICS EVER. CG- QUALITY!!! On GC!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #15 on: September 24, 2001, 07:42:44 PM »
Well, judging from these screens I see nothing special.

And he is a troll.
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Offline OneGig
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« Reply #16 on: September 24, 2001, 07:54:54 PM »
Those graphics probably are CG (or at least edited in Photoshop). The Web address mentions an "art student".
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Offline PahnCrD
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The MOST UNBELIEVABLE IN-GAME GRAPHICS EVER. CG- QUALITY!!! On GC!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #17 on: September 24, 2001, 09:16:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Nu Gundam

Eh... There are other stages with real polygonal BGs. And they look quite good.


PS2(Unfortunately), no... Xbox, yes(Factor5 said so themselves).


Owning a PS2 doesn\'t give you insight as to its capabilities.  We have yet to see what can be done.  I am in no way flaming you, just pointing out the fact that we have seen very little of the PS2 being optimized.  The XBOX and GC however will be easy to program for from the get go.

Offline Nu
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« Reply #18 on: September 24, 2001, 10:20:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by PahnCrD
Owning a PS2 doesn\'t give you insight as to its capabilities.  We have yet to see what can be done.  I am in no way flaming you, just pointing out the fact that we have seen very little of the PS2 being optimized.  The XBOX and GC however will be easy to program for from the get go.

Eh, I dont just own one, I also know quite a bit about its hardware. The PS2 simply isn\'t capable of throwing that many polygons, texture layers, particle effects, and light sources all at 60fps. A powerful console, no doubt, but not in the same league as the GCN...
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Offline IronFist
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« Reply #19 on: September 24, 2001, 11:34:38 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Nu Gundam

Eh, I dont just own one, I also know quite a bit about its hardware. The PS2 simply isn\'t capable of throwing that many polygons, texture layers, particle effects, and light sources all at 60fps. A powerful console, no doubt, but not in the same league as the GCN...

I don\'t know about polygons, texture layers, and light sources, but the PS2 is a particle effects monster. :)  The PS2 ownz both the Xbox and NGC in this category.

About textures, from what I understand, the PS2 can have up to 20 MB of textures per frame.  Not as much as the NGC, but still not too shabby.
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Offline PahnCrD
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The MOST UNBELIEVABLE IN-GAME GRAPHICS EVER. CG- QUALITY!!! On GC!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #20 on: September 25, 2001, 12:50:08 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by IronFist

I don\'t know about polygons, texture layers, and light sources, but the PS2 is a particle effects monster. :)  The PS2 ownz both the Xbox and NGC in this category.

About textures, from what I understand, the PS2 can have up to 20 MB of textures per frame.  Not as much as the NGC, but still not too shabby.


more like 27... and thats for 60 fps... at 30 fps that number doubles.

Offline PahnCrD
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The MOST UNBELIEVABLE IN-GAME GRAPHICS EVER. CG- QUALITY!!! On GC!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #21 on: September 25, 2001, 12:52:56 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Nu Gundam

Eh, I dont just own one, I also know quite a bit about its hardware. The PS2 simply isn\'t capable of throwing that many polygons, texture layers, particle effects, and light sources all at 60fps. A powerful console, no doubt, but not in the same league as the GCN...




The GC apparantly has the PS2 beat in textures... but not really in polygons... not to mentaion bezier or similar effects that the PS2 may excel... too many variables to guess at this point.

Offline eNeMyTooTH
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« Reply #22 on: September 25, 2001, 03:57:44 AM »
Why does a normal screenshot post ALWAYS end up with some debate..!  BTW, Nice screenshots, I doubt they\'re cg quality, but hey.. They look sweet!

Offline seven
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« Reply #23 on: September 25, 2001, 05:26:42 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Nu Gundam

Eh, I dont just own one, I also know quite a bit about its hardware. The PS2 simply isn\'t capable of throwing that many polygons, texture layers, particle effects, and light sources all at 60fps. A powerful console, no doubt, but not in the same league as the GCN...


Hi Nu,

Don\'t know if you remember me from PS2web, but remembering some debates with you back then, I really doubt you know THAT much of the PS2 to say statements like "PS2 simply isn\'t capable of throwing that many polygons, texture layers, particle effects, and light sources all at 60fps".

Look at GT3 - you see lots of polygons with LOTS of effects, light sources all at constant 60fps - and apparently (accoarding to Yamauchi), it\'s running at aprox. 60 to 70% of the hardware. I doubt that anyone reallly knows how much the PS2 is really cabably of and what 100% will look like, but coming from the producer of GT3, means quite alot.

Not satisfied? Look at Jak & Daxter. Sources indicate it\'s running over 10 million polys a second (I heard 13) and it has a lot going on in there. No loading times, lots of effects -> all at constant framerate (I think 60).

So Nu, who are you to say that the PS2 isn\'t capable of "blah blah what ever"?

Well, anyway, still good to see you here,
greetz

Phil

(seven)

Offline PahnCrD
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The MOST UNBELIEVABLE IN-GAME GRAPHICS EVER. CG- QUALITY!!! On GC!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #24 on: September 25, 2001, 12:32:32 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by eNeMyTooTH
Why does a normal screenshot post ALWAYS end up with some debate..!  BTW, Nice screenshots, I doubt they\'re cg quality, but hey.. They look sweet!



Well... this IS "Console Debating"  ;)

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« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2001, 02:56:44 PM »
Well, I\'m not going to wade through this menagiré of posts, but I\'ll put it in a very simple context.

Star Wars: Rogue Leader Rogue Squadron II, simply cannot be done on PlayStation 2 hardware, without signifigant deductions from visual quality.

Lets take pick out one thing (out of many others) for example.

Layers per texture:
GameCube\'s hardware supports up to 8 layers of effects (SP-AA, Bump-mapping, HW-lighting, Radiosity lighting, etc...) per texture, in a single pass.

PlayStation 2 can only manage to add 1 layer of effects per texture, per pass.

You see RSII uses at the least 5 effect layers per texture. Next RSII runs at a rock-solid 60FPS in 480 progressive scan-true 60FPS.

So first off, you really don\'t get a true 60 frames per second rate with PlayStation 2 as the hardware simply does not support it.

Next RSII features extremely intricate levels features millions of items of geometry.

In fact if you take a look at the link below and read the short paragraph then view the thumbnail, you\'ll get an idea of what a cutscene is comprised of, nonetheless a full-blow trench run, on the heavily armed Death Star where you\'ll end up facing around 100+ TIE\'s on screen, add to that the thousands of laser turrets, incredible AI, and the level detail itself. The technical production values behind RSII are outright massive.

Click here

Next we\'ve got the effects themselves. PS2 utilizes the well-used but rather crude from of anti-aliasing-Full Scene Anti-Aliasing (FSAA), GameCube utilizes Sub-Pixel Anti-Aliasing, a superiror form of AA which minimizes any \'blurr\' to a minimum and offers premium aliasing reduction. Then there are the lighting effects, forms of radiosity lighting, and mip mapping, which cannot be done on PS2 without shaving a lot here and adding a little there.

You\'ll end up in a damning circle if you think you can squeeze a game like RSII, effects, polys, frame rates, and all on PlayStation 2 hardware.

Offline Nu
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« Reply #26 on: September 25, 2001, 03:37:55 PM »
Pretendo = j0 Daddy. :p
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Offline Toxical
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« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2001, 04:04:34 PM »
those pics were faked :D

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« Reply #28 on: September 25, 2001, 04:22:13 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Toxical
those pics were faked :D


A true posterchild for denial.

Offline Watchdog
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« Reply #29 on: September 25, 2001, 05:39:57 PM »
There is a flaw in a lot of people arguments.

Just because the GC and Xbox are easy to develop for, DOES NOT mean that the games will not get any better.  That is wishful thinking on the part of us PS2 owners.  Most consoles have been easy to develop for and for each of those consoles, the last generation of software was remarkably better.

The point I\'m making is that just because PS2 is tougher to develop for doesn\'t mean that one day the graphics will be on par with the other systems.

All systems will continue to improve graphically; the only difference is that the PS2 will be a pain in the neck of developers.
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