Super Smash Bros Melee is Overhyped Garbage.

I finally got the chance to go over to my friends house and play SSBM for a few hours (and also got to try out the NGC controller for my first time -- my impressions below), and the thing that comes to my mind is, "This is the NGC\'s big game?  This is the game that\'s supposed to support the NGC for the next six months until Mario or Zelda come out?"

The graphics:
When I first saw this game, I was absolutely shocked at how "average" the graphics looked.  The game seemed to look so much better 6 months ago in the first movies.  Now, it looks like SSB for the N64 with a higher polygon count and slightly better textures.  Wasn\'t the NGC supposed to be a texturing powerhouse?  SSBM says otherwise.  The textures in this game make most PS2 games look up-to-par with textures.  The backgrounds in most levels were bland and lacked any pizzaz to set this game apart from all the other average looking games out now.  The game had the same blurry feel that most N64 games had too.  And also, there was sometimes slowdown in the heat of the battle which surprised me because of how N64-like the graphics are.

One high point about this game\'s graphics is the originality and style.  Some stages are completely 2d, some are 3d, and one even looks like one of those "Gigapets" keychain thingies with just black lines on a grey backdrop.  Very cool.

The gameplay
You would think that having 2 or 3 years to play around with ideas for a sequel, they would come up with something.  But nope, this game\'s gameplay is even more unchanged than that of DOA2 to DOA3.  Most old characters are exactly the same as they were in SSB, getting no new moves.  There are quite a few new people, but most of them are just clones of the old characters, ala Tekken 1\'s main characters and the hidden characters (having one or two different moves, but for the most part, being just the same).  One new gameplay addition (actually, the only gameplay addition that I can think of) is the ability to thow your apponent in different directions.  Wow. [/sarcasm off]  Oh, and some of the weapons have slighty different attributes (i.e. the Hammer does a lot less damage.)

The new characters that I like most are the Princess and that little black "Gigapet" guy.

Some of the levels are just lame and really not fun to play on.  One level is a 2d level with graphics like in the original Donkey Kong.  The level keeps on falling (or the camera keeps on rising depending on how you think of it), and if you get left behind at the bottom of the screen, you die.  Sometimes the camera starts moving down too, and the same rules apply if you go off the top of the screen.  Other levels are like circus rides jumping from one object to the next trying to stay on the screen and fight at the same time.  I can understand if the developers wanted to have more interativity with the environments, but this is not they way to do it IMO.

There are some levels that resemble the style of levels in the original, which I prefer.  So it\'s not all bad.

Sound/Music
The sound is good (very similar to that of SSB)

The Music, for the most part, is a big improvement over SSB.  This CD type storage really helped out.  But there are still some songs taken from really old games like Super Mario Bros 2, not recomposed or anything.

Controls:
This is where I post my impressions of the NGC controller and how well it worked for this game.  Overall, the NGC controller is nice, but it is way overhyped.  As you have probably heard, the d-pad is way too small.  Fortunately, the analog works good in this game so the d-pad isn\'t needed.  The z button is tucked away like people have said, but it isn\'t hard to hit by any means.  It does feel a little wierd, but it is a lot more accessable than some of the buttons on the Xbox controller.  The face buttons are very accessable, but for some reason, I kept on using the B button as my primary button instead of the A button.  When I first started playing, I kept on accidentally unselecting the player on the character select screen because of the B button.  Overall, the controls were a lot better than in SSB on the N64 (because the controller is so much better than the trash Nintendo likes to call the N64 controller), so I was happy with that.

So I like the controller, but I was expecting more.  The Xbox controller feels a lot more comfortible to hold, but the NGC buttons layout is better.  The PS2 controller is still number 1 due to the fact that it doesn\'t have any wierd, hard to reach buttons, has the most buttons and most analog buttons, and that it\'s the only controller with 4 shoulder buttons (a must for next gen games IMO).


So what\'s with all the hype of Super Smash Bros Melee?  Why is this game making the Gamecube sell so well in Japan, and why the heck did it get such a high score from Famitsu (it got in the high 30s, like 37 or or something like that)?  If this is a sign of what\'s to come on the NGC, I have no desire to ever buy one myself.  Hopefully Mario Sunshine will be more than just a rehash of Mario64, and zelda will be more than "more of the same gameplay" with a changed graphical style.  I don\'t know how many Nintendo fans or SSBM fans frequent these forums, so I am considering posting this at a Nintendo forum.

For those of you who have played it, what do you think about it?  Does it suck, or does it rock?

LOL!! Is it that bad?  I read in a review that it had some bad back grounds.  We just bought our kids for Christmas a GameCube with StarWars and be picking up 2 or 3 more other games for this system.  I can\'t wait to play the GameCube and see how good it is too.  

I\'m thinking of picking up Pikmin.  Looks fun!! Damn those textures look sweet.

Hello!  I\'m a little unsure of what you are attempting to accomplish here?  Is it a hands on impressions article?  A hatred rant?  Or a full blown review?  It seems to be in the style of a review, so I\'ll just assume that\'s it and respond accordingly.  I have had this game since the day it came out, and have already logged in over 30 hours into it.  It is my fourth GCN game, btw, so I\'ve definitely adjusted to the controller by now, not that I really needed to! :-D

I finally got the chance to go over to my friends house and play SSBM for a few hours (and also got to try out the NGC controller for my first time -- my impressions below), and the thing that comes to my mind is, "This is the NGC\'s big game?  This is the game that\'s supposed to support the NGC for the next six months until Mario or Zelda come out?"

I wouldn\'t say it\'s supposed to hold me out until Zelda or Mario, but it will definitely hold me out until January, when more great games start arriving, and even more to arrive in Feb, March, etc.  If this is supposed to be a review, then I can assure you that a few hours at a friends house definitely does not satisfy.  My 30+ hours are not yet enough!

When I first saw this game, I was absolutely shocked at how "average" the graphics looked.  The game seemed to look so much better 6 months ago in the first movies.  Now, it looks like SSB for the N64 with a higher polygon count and slightly better textures.  Wasn\'t the NGC supposed to be a texturing powerhouse?  SSBM says otherwise.  The textures in this game make most PS2 games look up-to-par with textures.

Hmmm. I\'ve seen the old videos, and I\'ve even played a demo version of this title awhile back at our Cube Clubs here in NY.  There is absolutely no doubt that this final version is superior.  The fact that the game can pull off 4 playable characters on screen at once, with an active camera, ridiculously animated and interactive stages, and a wealth of on screen items, summons, and special effects is a testament to the GCN\'s power.  The texture work, particularly on the character models is actually quite impressive.   Especially if you pause and zoom/pan the camera and/or access the Camera mode.  The modelling on Link\'s Master Sword and Hylian Shield, the texture work on Mario\'s overalls (OMG, they actually look like jeans now!), etc are all exquisite.  However, in actual gameplay, and especially with more than 2 characters on screen at once, the camera will zoom out greatly in order to capture all of the action on screen at once.

The backgrounds in most levels were bland and lacked any pizzaz to set this game apart from all the other average looking games out now.  The game had the same blurry feel that most N64 games had too.  And also, there was sometimes slowdown in the heat of the battle which surprised me because of how N64-like the graphics are.

With 30 stages at your disposal, I refuse to believe that you can summarily dismiss them as bland or lacking pizzaz.  Either you didn\'t play enough, or not enough levels were unlocked... or both.  The graphics in the game are absolutely crisp and clear, as is expected in a next gen console.  Now, in the options, you have the choice of toggling "Deflicker" on and off.  I keep it on, and it does give the game a softer look with its FSAA (full screen anti aliasing), but you can also set it off to get a sharper (although somewhat aliased) view.  I have unlocked the majority of the levels myself, and the only one to slow down was F Zero Grand Prix - Big Blue.  The reason being?  You are fighting in the middle of a ridiculous Grand Prix race!  Literally hopping from car to car attempting to avoid the tracks and death.  It is an extremely fast and heavily animated stage, and does in fact tax the system.  As far as stages lacking "pizzaz," those stages remixed from the original do in fact lack interactivity and features when compared to the new and exclusive GCN ones.  However, the N64 original was meant to be more "retro" and nostalgic than this one is intended, so it makes sense.  If you had experienced Kraid\'s rotating of the entire arena in Planet Zebes - Brinstar Depths and many other stages, you cannot truly gripe about interactivity.  I actually appreciate the variety, because sometimes you\'ll want to fight in a hectic and distracting stage, and others you will want a pure "skills" match and keep the arena fairly static.

One high point about this game\'s graphics is the originality and style.  Some stages are completely 2d, some are 3d, and one even looks like one of those "Gigapets" keychain thingies with just black lines on a grey backdrop.  Very cool.

You must be talking about Mr. Game & Watch Gallery and  his stage... I have yet to unlock those, but I can\'t wait! Old School rocks!

You would think that having 2 or 3 years to play around with ideas for a sequel, they would come up with something.  But nope, this game\'s gameplay is even more unchanged than that of DOA2 to DOA3.

Did you play the original or are you just assuming here?  Or again, you didn\'t play this one enough.  The throwing system (which was incredibly cheap in SSB) was replaced with a grapple system that is much more fair and much less powerful, yet no less strategic.  You can now grab, smack, and attempt a throw.  The whole time, the victim can attempt to break out.  Also, the ability to control the direction of the throw is vital in all out melee, because you can literally, knock one foe into a few others, something near impossible in the first.  Secondly, a much more defensive game is now possible, with the addition of the avoids!  By tapping L/R you bring up your shield, just like in the first game.  This time, by tilting the stick lightly, you can change the coverage area of the shield, and thereby reflect items thrown at your in various directions.  Not only that, but by tilting the stick downwards, you drop you shield and avoid (sidestep) incoming attacks and projectiles.  Your relatively vulnerability in the original while in midair has been countered with the implementation of this avoid system in midair.  Tap L/R while in midair for the standard avoid, and control your landing by tilting in one of the four cardinal directions while tapping L/R to avoid.  Not only that, but if someone throws an item at you while you are jumping or flying, a perfectly executed airborne avoid will have your character actually pluck the item from midair, allowing you to rapidly counterattack!  This is especially crucial with the more-chaotic-than-ever Pokeballs! :-D  It can change the tide of battle, no doubt!

Most old characters are exactly the same as they were in SSB, getting no new moves.  There are quite a few new people, but most of them are just clones of the old characters, ala Tekken 1\'s main characters and the hidden characters (having one or two different moves, but for the most part, being just the same).  One new gameplay addition (actually, the only gameplay addition that I can think of) is the ability to thow your apponent in different directions.  Wow. [/sarcasm off]  Oh, and some of the weapons have slighty different attributes (i.e. the Hammer does a lot less damage.)

With all due respect, this statement is completely false.  Many of the A Button attacks ("normal" moves) have been tweaked and/or changed for the 12 returning characters.  Many of the "priorities" particularly in midair have been altered, not to mention animations.  The Smash Attacks for each character now have "meteor attack" flavors, literally allowing you to hold down A to "charge" the smash attack and unleash more devastating incarnations of said attacks.  Smash Attacks were also changed, and some (like Link\'s) are double fisted and comboable.  The first game had 3 B Button attacks ("special" moves) for each character, where as SSB Melee features 4 per characters.  Obviously, each of the 12 returning combatants gained a new move, yet still some old special moves were also tweaked and "reprioritized."  Don\'t forget that with the inclusion of 13 additional characters, the balance for the game had to be completely redesigned, and this is, in fact represented in significant gameplay changes, even/especially for returning characters.

The sound is good (very similar to that of SSB)
The Music, for the most part, is a big improvement over SSB.  This CD type storage really helped out.  But there are still some songs taken from really old games like Super Mario Bros 2, not recomposed or anything.

Yeah, the orchestrated remixes are truly stunning.  Termina, Hyrule Temple, Mute City, Big Blue, Brinstar, Fountain of Dreams, these will all bring tears to the eyes of retro Nintendo gamers! :-D

And yes, there are two Mario stages (Mushroom Kingdoms I $ II) whose tunes are completely unchanged from their 8-bit incarnations.  However, considering that both stages are "bonus" stages (Mario games get 4 stages in this game, the first 2 are completely orchestrated) it is forgivable... especially since many aspects of Melee are a retro museum of sorts.  Have you heard the stunning (orchestrated, of course) Fire Emblem theme yet!?  G-d...  BTW, in general, each Nintendo franchise represented in Melee by a character gets 2 stages.  Mario games have 4, so 2 orchestrated and 2 retro is completely justifiable.

I won\'t bother commenting on your controller comments, as that is strictly a matter of opinion and personal preference.  The controls for the game are spot on, the controller is quite comfortable, imho, more so than the N64 one, no doubt.  And I am positive with more gametime, you\'d easily overcome your B-instead-of-A button tendencies!

So what\'s with all the hype of Super Smash Bros Melee?  Why is this game making the Gamecube sell so well in Japan, and why the heck did it get such a high score from Famitsu (it got in the high 30s, like 37 or or something like that)?  If this is a sign of what\'s to come on the NGC, I have no desire to ever buy one myself.  Hopefully Mario Sunshine will be more than just a rehash of Mario64, and zelda will be more than "more of the same gameplay" with a changed graphical style.  I don\'t know how many Nintendo fans or SSBM fans frequent these forums, so I am considering posting this at a Nintendo forum.
For those of you who have played it, what do you think about it?  Does it suck, or does it rock?

Hey, no need to post at a Nintendo forum, you got a Nin-fan right here!  But honestly, I don\'t feel that you have played or experienced enough of this game for your opinions and views to be found at all justified to Nintendo fan boys (if that is even possible, btw.)  But that\'s up to you, of course.  I believe that the game did get a 37 (Platinum) from Famitsu, and imho, it was more than justified.  The original was a pretty tight package for it\'s time, and this one is so complete it makes other games pale in comparison.  With over quadruple the amount of single player modes, more than triple the amount of multiplayer features and control, more than double the characters, and about quadruple the amount of stages (and awesome songs) this game is a true gem.  It will remain unrivaled on the GCN or any other system for many years to come.  Melee, like its predecessor, provide a very unique brand of gameplay that still hasn\'t been realized on any other console, and only ups the ante for this system and all others.  It will be one of those few games whose longevity and uniqueness will easily span the entire console\'s life.
 In fact, I got into SSB 64 a bit late, due to it\'s almost complete lack of a satisfying single player mode.  However, I still managed to put in a daily (or near daily) SSB session by playing team battles in multiplayer mode against 3 vicious cpu-controlled simulants.  The AI and variety in Melee have been drastically upped, and the single player modes alone here have kept me up until 8am since it came out!  Trust me, rent it if you are not convinced, but SSB fans have something to truly rejoice over!

Ugh... this forum is limiting my message size.  I forgot to counter your "clones" argument and feel a need to respond.

It is true that 6 of the 11 hidden characters are pseudo-clones of 6 others, but there are some vast differences.  To set the record straight, the two who are most similar are Mario and Dr. Mario.  Really, the only changes between them are walking speed, jump height, and their projectiles.  The trajectory for Dr. Mario\'s megavitamin pills is different than Mario\'s fireballs.

However, other characters, like Young Link (Link), Ganondorf (Captain Falcon), Pichu (Pikachu), and the two Fire Emblem Princes Roy & Marth are completely different.  Aside from the A button attack differences and attack priority differences, these characters also share drastic gameplay differences from their "original inspiration."

Perhaps the most drastic are the changes between Link/Young Link and Prince Marth/Prince Roy.  Young Link\'s Hookshot, Boomerang, and Bow ranges are all shorter, and his Kokiri Sword has less power and reach than Link\'s Master Sword.  Young Link\'s bow is of the Fire element, he runs much faster, jumps much higher, and is much more maneuverable than Link.  Likewise, his Spin Attack (midair and ground) is more damaging (it now combos repeatedly when it hits) and less powerful (sends \'em flying less far.)

Likewise there are drastic differences between Marth and Roy.  Marth is more nimble, quicker, and jumps higher, and is more elegant with his one handed sword play.  He is a great hit and run character, as all of his moves hit just once.  Roy, on the other hand, is a bit slower and jumps much lower, all of his sword attacks flame, and some of his more powerful A and B button sword attacks hit repeatedly and combo.  Also, he handles his Sword of Seals differently during the Dancing Blades attack than Marth does in his, not to mention the completely different Sword Smash...

Pichu and Pikachu are also somewhat similar.  The biggest difference is that Pichu is probably the smallest target in the game, a bit more nimble, and requires more strategy.  His Lightning Storm does combo, but since he is an unevolved (baby) Pokemon, he can\'t handle electricity as well as Pikachu.  Consequently, all of his lightning attacks cause him a tiny bit of damage as well! :o

Ganondorf and Captain Falcon are so different from each other, you\'d be hardpressed to find anyone who can play them the same.  Ganondorf is much heavier and less agile than Falcon, and probably has among the worst jumping abilities of all characters!  However, almost all of his punch attacks have a great (and evil) purple aura, and his version of the Falcon Punch (I think it\'s called the Gerudo Dragon?) is probably the slowest, yet most devastating move in the game.

I have yet to unlock Falco Lombardi, Star Fox Mcloud\'s "clone", so I can\'t really comment on that.  But all perhaps one or two of these clone characters require completely different strategies to play successfully with...

This makes my life easier.  I don\'t have to make a new thread or offer too much that has yet to be touched up on in this game either negatively or positively.  I\'m just going to offer a different perspective on it instead.  This is easier than writing a review!

First Things First

I hated Smash Bros on the N64.  Maybe it was because I loathed the controller or maybe I just hated the system, I\'m not sure, but I definitely had a big beef with its total lack of skill required in playing it.  Hell, I am a Street Fighter III fan afterall and that game is all about skill.  I utterly detested button mashers and Smash Bros was the epitome of that hatred.  Hell, just the fact that the game abused Nintendo franchises like so many other of its first party developed games gave me enough reason to yet pile on the Nintendo hatred.

Of course, after saying all this, I only sat down with the game for a good hour or two and when I walked away, I felt the same way you did, Ironfist, but that all changed tonight, the first time I got to really sit down and play a Smash Bros game in the form of Super Smash Bros Melee.

The Truth

This game is not deep.  It is quite the opposite actually in my opinions still maintaining that sense of being a button masher that I so loathed years ago when the first SB came out.  Although I admit to referring to DOA3 as being a button masher, perhaps that\'s not such a bad thing for Smash Bros.  Unlike Itagaki, Nintendo doesn\'t claim Smash Bros as being the greatest fighter ever released.  Hell, it doesn\'t even fit into the same category as any of the 2D or 3D fighters we are all accustomed to such as Soul Calibur, Tekken, DOA, or Street Fighter.  In fact, calling SSB:M a button masher is quite accurate, yet that isn\'t a knock against the game at all.  This all sounds strange, but let me explain.

Super Smash Bros Melee is nothing but mindless nonsensical fun.  There\'s a goal, an overall theme, great Nintendo franchise characters (albiet overused), with some neat weapons, backgrounds, music, and attacks.  Sure, each one of those attributes has a fault in some way, but in no way does it detract from the overall sense of fun.  In fact, I\'m almost positive this game was engineered so people who were newbies or veterans could jump right in and own like the rest after a solid hour of play time.  There is no game on the market that plays like it, but there is no fighter on the market as easy to master either as well as enjoy.

The Nitty Gritty

The backgrounds are exceptional depending on what arena you choose ranging from astounding to just plain ugly.  The Pokemon arean level is of particular interest seeing as how it morphs on the fly and the Termina field is quite amazing for that nostalgic sense.  However, the Ice Climbers stage and Yoshi\'s stage are both fairly lame and poor in design.  It fluctuates from arena to arena and I admit to not being able to playing them all, but for the most part, there are some good and some bad and some that are just amazing.

The graphics are pretty damn simple displaying lots of vibrant colors, plenty of flashy animations, and lots of activity on screen at once.  The best parts displaying the real show of the power of this console is when the backgrounds morph on the fly while 4 poke balls open up spewing out pokemon characters that wreak havoc on the unsuspecting swine traipsing straight to their doom.  The far off backgrounds other than the level itself are fairly simple yet boring at the same time.  It keeps the theme with most levels, but as a whole, the floating island concept doesn\'t really sit too well with me since that\'s what most stages look like even though being islands are integral to the gameplay.

The sounds is probably the best part for me orchestrating some of the best Nintendo tunes to date.  Termina Field and the F-zero songs are particularly amazing.  There are some tracks the game could do without, but the good definitely outweigh the bad.  I\'d definitely download a few of these mp3\'s if it ever came available in high quality CD renditions.  The voices are standard fighting screams and pain yells as any other and I\'m not too impressed by them, but it\'s nice to hear the Japanese voices of these characters, escpecially the Fire Emblem characters.

Final Thoughts

Intended simple gameplay meets good graphics with some originality.  I\'ll be playing this game for quite some time and I could see me and three random friends enjoying it for a good solid gaming session (6 hours) whenever we started.  It offers that simplicity that isn\'t found in Street Fighter while still maintaining a level of fun that is just unsurpassed by any multiplayer brawler.  I\'ll admit that I would not see this game as too much fun if it wasn\'t for the franchise characters, but they do fit in this world in more ways then one despite their different backgrounds.

I believe the developers goal when they envisioned this game was a simple fighter that anyone could get into and if that was the case, they pulled it off nicely.  It\'s always fun unwinding with a bit of non-strategic button mashing from time to time.  It\'s the flashy effects and the great characters that will keep me and my friends coming back for more.

Ok let\'s admit that it isn\'t for everybody.  It\'s just what Ryu says it.  It\'s not a fighter.  It\'s mindless fun.

http://cubemedia.ign.com/media/news/image/features/starfoxcompare1.jpg

looks just a little better.

That what I was saying its overhyped and its crap.  There real fighter out there like Tekken, VF, SC, Snk vs. Capcom, and DOA3.  Those are real fighter.:fro: :fro:

Originally posted by rastalant
That what I was saying its overhyped and its crap.  There real fighter out there like Tekken, VF, SC, Snk vs. Capcom, and DOA3.  Those are real fighter.:fro: :fro:

Speaking of fighting games, why didn\'t you list Guilty Gear (x)???  I mean, that is what your pic is all about, Testament that is.

If you liked the first one will you like this one?

I dont care if its mindless fun..... as long as it is fun.

WOW!  Look what IGN.com gave this game.  I think this game is neat because it has all your favorite nintendo characters in one game.

Presentation
All the retro Nintendo franchises wrapped into one, neat, feature-filled package. Amazing.  10.0  

Graphics
It\'s fast and furious, but still has some so-so background work. That said, most of the up-close visuals are great, but past that everything is average.  8.0  

Sound
Take all of your favorite Nintendo themes and orchestrate them to perfection. This is one of the best soundtracks in history, despite being based on pre-composed themes.  10.0  

Gameplay
An expansive single-player mode and a deep multiplayer mode make SSB Melee hard to put down.  9.0  

Lasting Appeal
Nearly 300 beautifully rendered trophies to collect, a stellar multiplayer mode, and tons of characters, stages, and options. It couldn\'t get much better than this.  10.0  

OVERALL SCORE (not an average)  
 9.6

I think it is garbage. It is fun for about 2 hours with friends, then the entire lack of gameplay hits you like a rock.


Eric Jacob

That what I was saying its overhyped and its crap. There real fighter out there like Tekken, VF, SC, Snk vs. Capcom, and DOA3. Those are real fighter.

You always make me laugh Rast, always.  "Real fighters," yah, that\'s funny as hell.  If SSB:M were trying to be a real fighter, then some of the moves would be a little bit more difficult to pull off.  It\'s like a one button super game and you don\'t like it because it\'s not a "real fighter."  That\'s hilarious.  You herald DOA3 as a "real fighter" yet shun SSB:M?  I hate DOA3 because it tries to be what it isn\'t, but SSB:M doesn\'t even pop-out as trying at all.

Originally posted by Troglodyte


Speaking of fighting games, why didn\'t you list Guilty Gear (x)???  I mean, that is what your pic is all about, Testament that is.

Oops......I forgot GGX is one of best fighter ever.  Yes............Testament rules!!!!!  Now thats a game!!!!

Originally posted by Ryu


You always make me laugh Rast, always.  "Real fighters," yah, that\'s funny as hell.  If SSB:M were trying to be a real fighter, then some of the moves would be a little bit more difficult to pull off.  It\'s like a one button super game and you don\'t like it because it\'s not a "real fighter."  That\'s hilarious.  You herald DOA3 as a "real fighter" yet shun SSB:M?  I hate DOA3 because it tries to be what it isn\'t, but SSB:M doesn\'t even pop-out as trying at all.

Well........I think DOA3 is a great fighter I liked doa2 a lot.  It was one of the best fighters on ps2 and dc.    I think its hyprocity to get on doa3 with shallow while you people say nothing about that crap SSB:Melee.  I mean its overhyped, kiddy, and shallow thats my opinion.  You  say doa3 sucks, but SSB:Melee is great?  OOKAAAYYYY.  Thats my opinion about the situation.......  Btw, when is a "real" fighter coming out for gamecube?