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Author Topic: What are we doing?!  (Read 3341 times)

Offline Halberto
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What are we doing?!
« on: April 09, 2004, 08:44:21 PM »
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040410/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq&cid=540&ncid=716

Why are we fighting a war for the Iraqi people, when we\'re fighting the majority of them. No wonder why everyone hates us. We put our nose in everything and force our ways on people with brute force. Not only that, the public doesn\'t even care. How many times do we have to fight for another country and murder eachother for a purpose that isn\'t worth it. If we went there for WMD\'s, where are they? If we went there to help the Iraqi people, why are our soldiers being blown up randomly in the streets?

And it\'s not like we\'re going to learn from this mistake we\'ve done it twice before. Korea is still unfinished war, and Vietnam was just a massacre and total failure.

Maybe this is just me letting off steam, but the U.S. is nothing like I was told it was.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2004, 08:46:26 PM by Halberto »

Offline SwifDi
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What are we doing?!
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2004, 09:11:46 PM »
Vote Kerry.

Offline Halberto
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What are we doing?!
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2004, 09:13:04 PM »
Kerry is a tool. And I can\'t vote Ill be 17

Offline Bozco
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What are we doing?!
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2004, 10:12:04 PM »
Pathetic, the first presidential race I can vote in and it\'s littered with worthless canidates.

Offline Capcom
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What are we doing?!
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2004, 11:09:40 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Bozco
Pathetic, the first presidential race I can vote in and it\'s littered with worthless canidates.


Get use to it.:mad:

Offline THX
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What are we doing?!
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2004, 12:23:14 AM »
The Iraqis are f*cked in the head.  It seems that place is destined to be a hellhole for all eternity.

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Offline Ace
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What are we doing?!
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2004, 03:59:38 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by THX
The Iraqis are f*cked in the head.  It seems that place is destined to be a hellhole for all eternity.


The whole region appears to be but I still have to believe the majority of people there want peace like the rest of us.
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Offline Titan

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What are we doing?!
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2004, 11:39:13 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by ViVi
If we went there for WMD\'s, where are they?  


I swear no one reads my posts. A WMD isn\'t just nuclear weapons but anything that can kill a group of people. A truck bomb, biological and chemical weapons (which we ARE finding), the missiles that Hussein had and anything else that can kill a group of people or property. The civilian population is thinking and exagerating this WMD thing way too much. People think that they are nuclear weapons. But we aren\'t looking for them. We suspected that he had them but went in to disarm him from other stuff too.
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Offline GigaShadow
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Re: What are we doing?!
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2004, 01:31:35 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by ViVi
[And it\'s not like we\'re going to learn from this mistake we\'ve done it twice before. Korea is still unfinished war, and Vietnam was just a massacre and total failure.

Maybe this is just me letting off steam, but the U.S. is nothing like I was told it was.


Vivi - Korea was the UN - not just the US and it involved more countries than you realize.  Do a little research on the Korean War and will see how many times the UN and the North Korean/Chinese forces took the whole pennisula only to have the the other side retake it in a counter attack.  The peace was signed due to it being a stalemate.  

Vietnam was a failure because the US government failed to commit what was needed for it to be a victory AND because the South Vietnamese didn\'t want to fight for their freedom - they wanted us to do it.  When we left they lost because they didn\'t have the will to fight.

Personally I can\'t believe the average American is whimpering over the body count so far... our soldiers joined the military knowing they might have to go to war.  The American public needs to get a backbone and be able to stomach some casualties.  By the way people are whining it sounds like this is the repeat of the massacre at Little Big Horn. :rolleyes:
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Offline SirMystiq

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What are we doing?!
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2004, 05:39:26 PM »
So, You are saying that it was the soldier\'s fault for joining the military in the first place and that they should of known that there was a possibility of dying for a useless war...? Perhaps somebody should of warned them that Bush was going to become President and try to finish of Hussain because his daddy couldn\'t.

Funny how at first we all were crying over not "supporting the troops" and how everytime an American soldier cried people made a big buzz about it. I think that a war has gone on too far when it get\'s to a point where casualties of war are thing that we have to become used to.


On a funnier note...Rice lied!

Bush was warned!

I mean...No he wasn\'t. There wasn\'t enough evidence or people telling to do something about the FBI investigations and other countries reporting what was going on. I mean cmon, what\'s a guy supposed to do?!

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/04/10/bush.briefing/index.html
RICE:

Rice told the commission Thursday that the briefing included mostly "historical information" and that most of the threat information known in the summer of 2001 referred to overseas targets.


Memo:
The memo, titled "Bin Laden determined to attack inside the U.S."
 An allegation that al Qaeda had been considering ways to hijack American planes to win the release of operatives who had been arrested in 1998 and 1999.
A report that at least 70 FBI investigations were under way in 2001 regarding possible al Qaeda cells/terrorist-related operations in the United States.




 
(CNN) -- The White House declassified and released Saturday the daily intelligence briefing delivered to President Bush a month before the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001.

The declassified intelligence report said the FBI had detected "patterns of suspicious activity in this country consistent with preparations for hijackings."

The names of countries that supplied the CIA with intelligence have been removed from the memo dealing with Osama bin Laden\'s al Qaeda network and dated August 6, 2001.

"We have not been able to corroborate some of the more sensational threat reporting, such as that from a [redacted] service in 1998 saying that bin Laden wanted to hijack a U.S. aircraft to secure the release of \'Blind Sheikh\' Omar Abdel Rahman and other U.S.-held extremists," the memo says in part.

Rahman is serving a life sentence for conspiring to assassinate Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak and to blow up New York landmarks.

The White House said the presidential daily briefing, or PDB, was requested by Bush, who sought information about the possibility of an al Qaeda attack in the United States.

"The PDB article did not warn of the 9/11 attacks," the White House said in a statement released Saturday night. "Although the PDB referred to the possibility of hijackings, it did not discuss the possible use of planes as weapons."

The memo, titled "Bin Laden determined to attack inside the U.S.," had been described by the White House as a largely historical document with scant information about domestic al Qaeda threats.

The memo includes intelligence on al Qaeda threats as recent as three months before the attacks.

Highlights of the report include:

• An intelligence report received in May 2001 indicating that al Qaeda was trying to send operatives to the United States through Canada to carry out an attack using explosives. That information had been passed on to intelligence and law enforcement agencies.

• An allegation that al Qaeda had been considering ways to hijack American planes to win the release of operatives who had been arrested in 1998 and 1999.

• An allegation that bin Laden was set on striking the United States as early as 1997 and through early 2001.

• Intelligence suggesting that suspected al Qaeda operatives were traveling to and from the United States, were U.S. citizens, and may have had a support network in the country.

• A report that at least 70 FBI investigations were under way in 2001 regarding possible al Qaeda cells/terrorist-related operations in the United States.

The two-page document became the highlight of national security adviser Condoleezza Rice\'s testimony Thursday before the commission investigating the attacks.

Rice told the commission Thursday that the briefing included mostly "historical information" and that most of the threat information known in the summer of 2001 referred to overseas targets.

She said she did not recall any reports about al Qaeda using aircraft as weapons before September 11.

Former counterterrorism aide Richard Clarke had testified two weeks before that the White House had ignored warnings about bin Laden\'s terrorist organization. Clarke said the Bush administration, including Rice, was aware of al Qaeda threats but did not treat them as "urgent."

The commission asked that the presidential daily briefing be declassified after Rice\'s testimony.

"This was the commission\'s hope," spokesman Al Felzenberg said Saturday.

"The White House has now complied. The White House agreed to release the documents. This is what the commission had hoped."

The August briefing was delivered to Bush at his ranch in Crawford, Texas.

Some commission members said the administration was given enough information about bin Laden\'s intentions and capabilities to have warned the public that an attack was possible.
Don\'t try to confuse me with what you call  facts, my mind is already made up.

Offline GigaShadow
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What are we doing?!
« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2004, 06:38:22 PM »
Like that information could have prevented 9/11 - get over the conspiracy theories kid.  

It only said hijackings - not flying the damn planes into buildings.  Do you comprehend what you read Sir Mystiq?  Do you fail to realize that 9/11 was planned well before Bush was even elected?  Where was our great intelligence network under Clinton?  As most intelligent people know - this wasn\'t one person or adminstrations fault.  It took years for Al Qaeda to plan these attacks.

As for soldiers dying - I guess people like you would be having a nervous breakdown if this were a real war - meaning front lines and casuality reports in the hundreds daily.  The one advantage that the Islamic fundamentalists have over us is they aren\'t afraid to die - this week alone 450 died and that is close to our total in a year.  People with your attitude are what make this country weak Mystiq.  I am sure no soldier wants to be over there, but they are proud to serve their country and proud to be defending the US against radical Islamic facism.  

In case you didn\'t know a lot of Arab foreigners aka terrorists are fighting alongside the Sunni\'s.  This is a war - a war against an enemy who would mutilate you and string you up from a bridge regardless of your stance on this war.  They don\'t hate us because we are over there - they would hate us period.  They hate our lifestyle and our freedoms - so before you say this war is meaningless think about those things and maybe it is better to fight the war over there than have 9/11 type attacks on a routine basis.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2004, 06:40:08 PM by GigaShadow »
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Offline Titan

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What are we doing?!
« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2004, 07:41:02 PM »
Well said Giga, well said.

Quote
People with your attitude are what make this country weak Mystiq. I am sure no soldier wants to be over there, but they are proud to serve their country and proud to be defending the US against radical Islamic facism.


Bingo Giga.

Quote


So, You are saying that it was the soldier\'s fault for joining the military in the first place and that they should of known that there was a possibility of dying for a useless war...? Perhaps somebody should of warned them that Bush was going to become President and try to finish of Hussain because his daddy couldn\'t.


You totally missed what Giga was saying, don\'t you. A soldier joins the military knowing that he might go into a war that he/she may or may not agree with and fight no matter what, serve their country for the fat lazy bastards that take advantage of the soldiers\' cause and those too afraid to fight. A soldier joins knowing that they will be in a war and they may die. I\'m joining the military and I know I might be pulled into a war and have a chance on dying. But because I love this country, I would die for it and the freedoms and comforts that I have that another country may not have.
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Offline shockwaves
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Re: Re: What are we doing?!
« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2004, 11:06:54 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by GigaShadow
Personally I can\'t believe the average American is whimpering over the body count so far... our soldiers joined the military knowing they might have to go to war.  The American public needs to get a backbone and be able to stomach some casualties.  By the way people are whining it sounds like this is the repeat of the massacre at Little Big Horn. :rolleyes:


Agreed completely.  It\'s amazing that if we have a couple...literally, a couple of casualties, it\'s big news.  That doesn\'t speak to the fact that it\'s such an unexceptable thing as to the fact that there are so few American casualties overall for such a large military operation.

The fact is, the soldiers signed up to serve their country, knowing that might potentially mean putting their lives at risk.  Whether you agree with us being in Iraq or not, or even if you agree with how we\'re handling the situation, the fact remains that that is exactly what they are doing.  

Quote
Originally posted by SirMystiq
Funny how at first we all were crying over not "supporting the troops" and how everytime an American soldier cried people made a big buzz about it. I think that a war has gone on too far when it get\'s to a point where casualties of war are thing that we have to become used to.


This is a war, what did you expect?  There are casualties in war, and that\'s a fact you have to accept.  It isn\'t that people are fine with American soldiers dying, but if you want change, and decide it is necessary to achieve that change in such an aggressive military manner, you have to be willing to accept military casualties.  The fact that our casualties have been so relatively low overall simply shows how prepared and efficient our military has become.  Crying over such a small body count during a war is pointless.  These men knew what they were signing up for, and they died supporting their country, something that anyone who volunteers for such service would be proud of, even if it is an unenviable fate.

And as for the war going on long enough, what are we supposed to do, just pull out now?  What do you think would happen if we were to do that?  The amount of violence and chaos that could and likely would break out in Iraq if we leave this situation unfinished at this point would be far more than what we\'re losing by staying there.  When you start a job (once again, whether you agreed with starting it in the first place or not), you have to finish it.  Otherwise, things could be worse even than they were before.

And by the way, this comes from someone who is and was fully against this war from the start.
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Offline Bozco
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What are we doing?!
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2004, 12:43:20 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Capcom
Get use to it.:mad:


Somehow I\'m not suprised.  So this is what I have to look forward to every four years.  Sadly I can see how so many just end up not voting, between driving to a place to vote and the trash canidates, whats the point.  As long as the country isn\'t turned into a dictatorship I\'ll fare in the end.

Offline videoholic

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What are we doing?!
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2004, 04:46:12 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Bozco
Pathetic, the first presidential race I can vote in and it\'s littered with worthless canidates.


Go back in history and find a single election where the nominees were kick ass presidential material?

Fact is everyone has skeletons in their closet.  just the good leader types are in industry and they don\'t have to worry about people drumming up their trivial past and they can make 100X\'s more money in the private sector.
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