PS2 : for worse times...

WHat the hell were you just talking about?

My point is that good games should have been out right from the start.

Originally posted by Watchdog
My point is that good games should have been out right from the start.

But your definition of "good games" is not the definition of "good games."  I loved the launch games.  I played TTT, Timesplitters, and SSX to death.  Just because you don\'t like what the PS2 has to offer doesn\'t mean the PS2 isn\'t a great system.

Originally posted by IronFist

But your definition of "good games" is not the definition of "good games."  I loved the launch games.  I played TTT, Timesplitters, and SSX to death.  Just because you don\'t like what the PS2 has to offer doesn\'t mean the PS2 isn\'t a great system.

Word my man.. WORD!

Yeah.. I loved SSX, TTT and Timesplitters.. All those were/are launchtitles..

Yes, well you guys are the minority.

SSX was good.  

TTT was nothing new except graphics--the game was a dissappointment in the eyes of most hardcore tekken players.  It was ok.

And timespliters was not a good game.  Bad framerate, and nothing compared to any PC game of that genre.  The single player was a complete joke.  Multiplayer was better, but, again not on the same scale as PC shooters.

My vote is that PS2 is doing just fine

Originally posted by Watchdog
Yes, well you guys are the minority.

SSX was good.  

TTT was nothing new except graphics--the game was a dissappointment in the eyes of most hardcore tekken players.  It was ok.

And timespliters was not a good game.  Bad framerate, and nothing compared to any PC game of that genre.  The single player was a complete joke.  Multiplayer was better, but, again not on the same scale as PC shooters.

So don\'t play PS2 if you don\'t like it.  Nobody is trying to make you...  

Btw most tekken fans I know loved TTT, and my buddies and I had a pretty good time with timesplitters.  It was a lot easier to set up a game than to network 4 PCs.  Not everybody enjoys playing agianst others online.  I wanna play against my friends without having to set up my 10baseT everytime.  I liked Timesplitters for that.

You are a little to hard on graphics anyway.  Most games on PS2 look pretty good... there are certainly no better looking console games on any other system out.  And by the time there is, there are going to be a pretty kick ars selection of nice looking games.  And  I think that VF4 looks as good as DOA3 if not better in it\'s own way (certainly more realistic, less cartoony).  I dislike it when people prejudge and expect everyone else to do so also.  I am satisfied with my PS2 so far, I always figured it would be a long road of mastery for the programers.

If you wanna sell your PS2 thats fine, but you will most likely regret it a little farther down the road.  I will own all systems ,(they are already paid for) because I don\'t like to lose out on good games because of brand loyalty or becuase you think soemthing may be better down the road.  There will always be better hardware down the road, will it be XBOX or GC, maybe... but we haven\'t seen PS2 shine in it\'s strengths yet either.  I never expected to see full power right a way.  With Xbox and GC you get pretty close to full power early on.  So if 2nd gen PS2 games are close to GC and Xbox 1st gen, than I am already impressed.  

"if you don\'t like it don\'t play it"

Has to be the stupidist statement that people make during console debates.  Moving on...

"You are a little to hard on graphics anyway. Most games on PS2 look pretty good... there are certainly no better looking console games on any other system out."

I agree that PS2 games look "pretty good".  First gen GC and Xbox games look immensely better than anything on or coming from the ps2--this debate is old and it\'s (almost) universally agreed that the PS2 can\'t match the visuals of any of the other next-gen consoles.  PS2 was supposed to be a revolution, it was supposed to be what the xbox and GC are (in terms of graphics) and have revolutionary games.  As it is now, it has pretty good graphics and rehashes and sequels.

Again you are content to wait with medicore games until they figure out the system.  Here\'s my stock comparison: If you buy a porshe, would you be content to be only allowed to drive it at 60mph for the first two years that you own it?  Of course not, why are you content with sub-par games from the PS2?

Sure TTT was fun for a while, but it wasn\'t an upgrade from the previous game in the series except for a graphical tweek.  That is not acceptable.

It\'s not tough to set up a network of PCs, plus you only have to do it once, not "everytime".  It\'s easy to find your friends online.  You don\'t have to settle for a small window on a tv, framerate problems etc.  This is a worthless debate, the only advantage of have 4-way split screen is that your buddies are sitting right beside you.  But that is often ruined by bad framerate and a knowledge of where the other players are.  This debate isn\'t what this thread is about so I\'ll drop it there.

I have not the time nor the inclination to own all systems.  You know, I seem to hate the PS2, that\'s not true.  I have enjoyed it, but I have never been overwhelmed by any one aspect of it.  The NES, SNES/Genesis, PSX were all great leaps ahead in gaming.  The PS2 isn\'t.

Besides I am not alone with my opinions--there is a reason why retailers are growing frustrated with the amount of PS2 software that isn\'t selling, and why the Japanese use the PS2 primarily as a DVD player.  The reason is the quality of the games.

I\'m going to add a couple things to what PahnCrD said.

Originally posted by Watchdog
SSX was good.

*cough*in your oppinion*cough*

IMO, and in a lot of other people\'s oppinions, SSX was great.  It was the game that made all snowboarding games evolve.  It was a much needed change to the old snowboard-down-a-halfpipe trend.

It got an EGM gold award with four 9/10s.
It got an almost perfect score from Gamepro.  two 5s, and two 4.5s.
It got a 10 from PSM.

You are the one who\'s in the minority now.

TTT was nothing new except graphics--the game was a dissappointment in the eyes of most hardcore tekken players.  It was ok.

TTT was a game for only the hardcore gamers.  I don\'t know what you\'re talking about.  The reason most reviewers bash it is because it wasn\'t new enough.  They didn\'t understand that it wasn\'t supposed to be a new thing.  It was a game made to make all hardcore Tekken fans happy -- and it worked.  Why do you think a lot of hardcore Tekken players won\'t give up TTT and move on to Tekken 4?

And timespliters was not a good game.  Bad framerate, and nothing compared to any PC game of that genre.  The single player was a complete joke.  Multiplayer was better, but, again not on the same scale as PC shooters.

The framerate never dropped below 60 FPS.  They used a technique to make the graphics not as good when tons of stuff was happening to make sure that the framerate never went below 60 FPS.  I think you were misinformed.  Everything else in that paragraph is your oppinion.

"if you don\'t like it don\'t play it"

I second that

Originally posted by Watchdog
[B
It\'s not tough to set up a network of PCs, plus you only have to do it once, not "everytime".  It\'s easy to find your friends online.  You don\'t have to settle for a small window on a tv, framerate problems etc.  This is a worthless debate, the only advantage of have 4-way split screen is that your buddies are sitting right beside you.  But that is often ruined by bad framerate and a knowledge of where the other players are.  This debate isn\'t what this thread is about so I\'ll drop it there.

[/B]

Are you rich... I am not. When I set up a network my friends must bring their own PCs.  And online gaming, can you all go to the bar or dennys\' and BS about what you have just played.

Another thing, "If you don\'t like it, don\'t play it" is the words I live by.  I hated mario 64 so I didn\'t play it much.  Didn\'t like zelda 64, so didn\'t play it.  There are many AAA titles I didn\'t like at all, but I didn\'t try to push my views on other people.  You say all of your views are widely accepted, but not on this forum... maybe you mean on the GC forum and the Xbox forum.  But at least they\'re over on their own boards.  You are not going to convince me of what games I like, or what games look good.  In fact I have yet to see any games on the other systems I believe to be out of the PS2s cababilities.  I don\'t have a crystal ball, and niether do you.  You can predict the future, by whatever means you want, but it doesn\'t make it right.

As for the PS2 not being a revolution.  It is a revolution, so much so that the programmers don\'t understand it.  (If someone could post a link to that arstechnica essay on the ps2 and dynamic hardware).  Sony was brave for going with dynamic hardware.  

Oh and one more thing, I like playing all my old PS games on my PS2.  Not related but a neat bonus.

*caugh* fanboys *caugh*


Of course everything is my opinion--that\'s a stupid thing to say.  and of course you can have your own opinion, this is a debate, and I\'m stating mine.

Whatever.  Yes I agree about SSX, I understated it.

TTT was a dissppointment to hardcore players because it hadn\'t changed and got boring quickly.

I just loaded up timesplitters again and in 4 player mode it DOES slowdown and it does drop frames and it does lose quality.  It didn\'t drop frames as much as I remember (haven\'t played it in a LONG time), but it still does and it is noticeable when there is lots of stuff going on.  Anyway, this wasn\'t a horrible game, but when there are many better shooters out there that I can play in the next room it is does not shine.

I\'m getting pissed at waiting for new games, i don\'t even give a sh!t if they look better then MGS2 or DMC, i just want "GOOD" games, now, not a year from now, or 2... NOW!

Besides I am not alone with my opinions--there is a reason why retailers are growing frustrated with the amount of PS2 software that isn\'t selling, and why the Japanese use the PS2 primarily as a DVD player. The reason is the quality of the games.

That is a story of long past. If you see the sales charts for the past 6 months you will notice that the PS2 is dominating in software sales.

/ dm /

Originally posted by Watchdog
*caugh* fanboys *caugh*

What is your reasoning behind this?  I don\'t quite understand.  Isn\'t it possible to love the PS2 and want what\'s coming to the NGC and Xbox?  I am a gamer, nothing more.  Don\'t be so quick to judge.

TTT was a dissppointment to hardcore players because it hadn\'t changed and got boring quickly.

I have started a poll over at TekkenZaibatsu to see what they, the most hardcore Tekken players in the world, think about TTT.  We will see.

I just loaded up timesplitters again and in 4 player mode it DOES slowdown and it does drop frames and it does lose quality.  It didn\'t drop frames as much as I remember (haven\'t played it in a LONG time), but it still does and it is noticeable when there is lots of stuff going on.  Anyway, this wasn\'t a horrible game, but when there are many better shooters out there that I can play in the next room it is does not shine.

I prefer to play Quake II over Timesplitters, but that was when I had access to a network of computers.  Now I have to settle for a console FPS, and Timesplitters is the best console FPS I have ever played.  It is extremely fast paced and very fun.  I have never noticed the framerate decreasing, so it obviously isn\'t that big of a problem.  I can\'t wait for the sequel.